TxTarpon said:

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Quote:

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This sounds much like the story of the Silicon Valley and the need for H-1B visas.
Can't find more workers willing to work for $100K when their apartment rent is $3000/mo.
But, there are tons of Indians who can't wait to get here.
Workplace loyalty - Ha! As long as they can find a new visa sponsor forget about it.

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USAA did that.
Fired veterans and hired H-1B Visa holders from India.


Are Silicon Valley industries recorded under "information" and "professional business service"?

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IT companies - Google, Apple, etc. every crappy little Silicon Valley start up, probably fall under the $324B of "Information". Now Apple could fall under some sort of product heading for hardware since they make phones and laptops even though they aren't made in California.

HollywoodBQ said:

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TxTarpon said:

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Quote:

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This sounds much like the story of the Silicon Valley and the need for H-1B visas.
Can't find more workers willing to work for $100K when their apartment rent is $3000/mo.
But, there are tons of Indians who can't wait to get here.
Workplace loyalty - Ha! As long as they can find a new visa sponsor forget about it.

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USAA did that.
Fired veterans and hired H-1B Visa holders from India.


Are Silicon Valley industries recorded under "information" and "professional business service"?

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IT companies - Google, Apple, etc. every crappy little Silicon Valley start up, probably fall under the $324B of "Information". Now Apple could fall under some sort of product heading for hardware since they make phones and laptops even though they aren't made in California.

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Kind of sad that about 1/8th of the GDP is government.

AustinScubaAg said:

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TxTarpon said:

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Why would a company pay 1.5x to 2x more for the same quality.

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To prevent the 3rd worlder from funneling the intellectual and personal data to the homeland for nefarious purposes?

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You totally missed the point I was making. Unrealistic wage inflation in tech drove costs way up forcing a companies to look for employees that would work for reasonable salaries. This was caused in part by companies like google that could make large profits with limited overhead.

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The other big factor is wages versus housing and the availability of workers who can and will jump from one IT startup to the next.

I know folks who think nothing of working for 3-4 different employers in a 12 month period as they're chasing the dream of finding that one needle in the haystack that hits.

Many people's aspirations are buoyed by stories like the Janitor at Silicon Graphics who became a millionaire.

Now in the more highly skilled part, up until the Plandemic, it was very important that you show up in the office a few days a week in the Bay Area. Which meant that you needed to live within commuting distance.

Most people have a tolerance of putting up with Bay Area cost of living challenges for 10-15 years. After that, they bail out. Move to Austin, etc. And they don't get replaced at the rate they leave. This creates the vacuum which leads to the "need" for the offshore "talent" who are willing to come to the USA for below par wages -even though they're still high wages compared to everywhere else in the country.

Gateway Computer tried to operate in South Dakota but in the late 1990s, they found that there were only a handful of tech people willing to move to South Dakota.

Personally, i've already hit my limit and I'm ready to move back to Texas. I'm just not finding it as easy to extract myself as I thought it would be.

geoag58 said:

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If boomers had the information technology available now like social networks and cell phones they would probably look more like generations of today. Starting to work in the 80's your circle of friends numbered in the tens not the tens of thousands.
Early on I never remember talking about how much I made with people in my industry. This probably had the effect of allowing all organizations to keep good people together longer. Today a misstep can adversely affect a business overnight.

No one can help when they are born and as I age I consider some of the choices my parents, who were born right before and at the beginning of the depression, made. And while I now think it was in some cases they made the wrong decision, faced with the events going on around them I understand why they could come to that decision. I have seen the same thing in my own choices over the years.

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My old man is Silent Generation - b. 1936, he'll be 86 this year.

It's funny you mentioned making the same decisions as your father and being able to understand why he made them.

I feel exactly the same way. I see a lot of similarities in the decisions made. The reasons could have been slightly different but the result of the decisions is the same - just 30 years apart.

HollywoodBQ said:

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AustinScubaAg said:

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TxTarpon said:

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Quote:

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Why would a company pay 1.5x to 2x more for the same quality.

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To prevent the 3rd worlder from funneling the intellectual and personal data to the homeland for nefarious purposes?

---

You totally missed the point I was making. Unrealistic wage inflation in tech drove costs way up forcing a companies to look for employees that would work for reasonable salaries. This was caused in part by companies like google that could make large profits with limited overhead.

---

The other big factor is wages versus housing and the availability of workers who can and will jump from one IT startup to the next.

I know folks who think nothing of working for 3-4 different employers in a 12 month period as they're chasing the dream of finding that one needle in the haystack that hits.

Many people's aspirations are buoyed by stories like the Janitor at Silicon Graphics who became a millionaire.

Now in the more highly skilled part, up until the Plandemic, it was very important that you show up in the office a few days a week in the Bay Area. Which meant that you needed to live within commuting distance.

Most people have a tolerance of putting up with Bay Area cost of living challenges for 10-15 years. After that, they bail out. Move to Austin, etc. And they don't get replaced at the rate they leave. This creates the vacuum which leads to the "need" for the offshore "talent" who are willing to come to the USA for below par wages -even though they're still high wages compared to everywhere else in the country.

Gateway Computer tried to operate in South Dakota but in the late 1990s, they found that there were only a handful of tech people willing to move to South Dakota.

Personally, i've already hit my limit and I'm ready to move back to Texas. I'm just not finding it as easy to extract myself as I thought it would be.

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This is so true. There was no stigma in silicon valley to jump between jobs at a high rate. The truth is those that do this are really not even contributing to the company they join just taking pay then leaving. Every tech company has its own quirks, processes, and flows. Even a really skilled coder often takes several months to come up to speed on the infrastructure and the existing code.

This is also why I chose to never move to the bay area to bad Austin is bay Area east these days.

The bay area really is a skilled workers 'paradise'. You've got a whole industry in just a few square miles. If you don't like the company you can jump next door and apply your same skills, non competes aren't enforceable in california, and company culture doesn't care if you job hop.

Its not like that really anywhere else. My dad worked for a large tech company that was far away from the rest of the tech industry. It was 'make that company happy or move to a different city' my whole childhood. Funny enough, he liked it that way because he then had no qualms living really close to work. I work in the oil and gas industry, and while there's a ton of oil/gas industry in houston, its still surprisingly rare/hard to jump from one to the next (for engineers). Cultures are intrenched and non competes are enforced. In houston it seems if you jump between companies its rarely from one huge name to the next, but usually moving to a smaller company and taking a larger role. Which makes it hard to move back up into a large company.