Property appraisals as a method for mark-to-market taxation is the biggest scam ever sanctioned by the state of Texas.

Why do we put up with it? Why do we allow the state of Texas the extortion of its citizens?

I honestly would rather have an income tax vs ridiculous property taxes that are so arbitrary that they have no basis in reality, at least an income tax is based on some type of agreed upon standard

If I were king, your property taxes per year would be set at the time of purchase. It has always baffled me that we put up with this crap, its basically lawful theft made even more laughable that you can actually protest the results, which on the surface seems fair, except that now you are setting up different rules for different classes of people, those that can afford to fight it and those that cant, it is all seriously broken

More money more problems.

Bag said:

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Property appraisals as a method for mark-to-market taxation is the biggest scam ever sanctioned by the state of Texas.

Why do we put up with it? Why do we allow the state of Texas the extortion of its citizens?

I honestly would rather have an income tax vs ridiculous property taxes that are so arbitrary that they have no basis in reality, at least an income tax is based on some type of agreed upon standard

If I were king, your property taxes per year would be set at the time of purchase. It has always baffled me that we put up with this crap, its basically lawful theft made even more laughable that you can actually protest the results, which on the surface seems fair, except that now you are setting up different rules for different classes of people, those that can afford to fight it and those that cant, it is all seriously broken

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Oh great... Another *****fest about property tax appraisals...

You'd make a ****ty king because it's been pointed out relentlessly that this is what California does and it's a complete ****ing disaster.

And if you can "afford" to fight your appraisal, which costs nothing to do, you're probably paying a **** ton anyway and you're already paying way more than the supposed peons who can't afford free.

Bag said:

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Property appraisals as a method for mark-to-market taxation is the biggest scam ever sanctioned by the state of Texas.

Why do we put up with it? Why do we allow the state of Texas the extortion of its citizens?

I honestly would rather have an income tax vs ridiculous property taxes that are so arbitrary that they have no basis in reality, at least an income tax is based on some type of agreed upon standard

If I were king, your property taxes per year would be set at the time of purchase. It has always baffled me that we put up with this crap, its basically lawful theft made even more laughable that you can actually protest the results, which on the surface seems fair, except that now you are setting up different rules for different classes of people, those that can afford to fight it and those that cant, it is all seriously broken

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In other words, create a new state bureaucracy to collect income taxes and then pass them out to the various counties based on who deserves what. While they are at it, I'm sure the legislature can figure out some additional spending and so collect money for that, too. And, of course, for those who live out of state but who own property in Texas, such as Bill Gates, they wouldn't have to pay anything for the local services that property taxes now cover and so the income taxes would have to take more from Texas citizens to pay for the out of state property owners.

Don't forget, when new taxes are created, the old taxes don't go away. For example, the VAT was supposed to replace income taxes when it was introduced around the world. Did the income tax go away? Not that I know of. There was one country where the income tax was purportedly eliminated when they adopted the VAT, but for some reason that country still has an income tax.

Before the VAT spread in Europe, they supposedly paid about the same percentage of their income in income taxes as us. With the VAT, they now pay both income taxes and VAT and pay a much higher percentage of their income in income taxes than we do.

Can you provide examples of governments that have replaced one tax with another and eliminated the first?

To me, the idea reeks of a big tax hike on Texas citizens.

Remember, Texas' reputation is much more red than her history, policies, and urban population voting. We remain O&G friendly and business friendly as a whole, but we lack many of the policies that a conservative utopia would have - and our government is reticent to actually move forward on them.

Income tax where half the state is illegals that don't report income.

ABATTBQ11 said:

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Bag said:

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Property appraisals as a method for mark-to-market taxation is the biggest scam ever sanctioned by the state of Texas.

Why do we put up with it? Why do we allow the state of Texas the extortion of its citizens?

I honestly would rather have an income tax vs ridiculous property taxes that are so arbitrary that they have no basis in reality, at least an income tax is based on some type of agreed upon standard

If I were king, your property taxes per year would be set at the time of purchase. It has always baffled me that we put up with this crap, its basically lawful theft made even more laughable that you can actually protest the results, which on the surface seems fair, except that now you are setting up different rules for different classes of people, those that can afford to fight it and those that cant, it is all seriously broken

---

Oh great... Another *****fest about property tax appraisals...

You'd make a ****ty king because it's been pointed out relentlessly that this is what California does and it's a complete ****ing disaster.

And if you can "afford" to fight your appraisal, which costs nothing to do, you're probably paying a **** ton anyway and you're already paying way more than the supposed peons who can't afford free.

---

good to know you are cool with the current racket, thanks for sharing, when I say "afford" that entails more than just $$$, time and energy and loopholes and and and

Its also lovely that you point out that california is a disaster while ignoring that what we have here is just as bad, well played

Mcadprotest.com

Holy ****, we need a property tax board. Maybe they can convert F84 now that Covid is over?

Don't tax you
Don't tax me
Tax that fellow
Behind the tree

A buddy just texted me and told me that his house (non homestead) went up 57% in value this year.

read that again, IN ONE YEAR

Mark to market tyranny.

Bag said:

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A buddy just texted me and told me that his house (non homestead) went up 57% in value this year.

read that again, IN ONE YEAR

Mark to market tyranny.

---

The real problem is inflation.

Eliminate inflation and housing prices will generally be static, more or less.

Property taxes in Texas are ridiculous and in all honesty I see no argument for it that makes any sense. I love Texas though, and I suppose it's the price of living there. In Oklahoma, we have (relatively) low state income tax and very low property tax. Both added together would add up to about a quarter of Texas property taxes.

But again, Texas is a desirable place to live. Oklahoma isn't bad at all, but it's no Texas.

eric76 said:

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Bag said:

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Property appraisals as a method for mark-to-market taxation is the biggest scam ever sanctioned by the state of Texas.

Why do we put up with it? Why do we allow the state of Texas the extortion of its citizens?

I honestly would rather have an income tax vs ridiculous property taxes that are so arbitrary that they have no basis in reality, at least an income tax is based on some type of agreed upon standard

If I were king, your property taxes per year would be set at the time of purchase. It has always baffled me that we put up with this crap, its basically lawful theft made even more laughable that you can actually protest the results, which on the surface seems fair, except that now you are setting up different rules for different classes of people, those that can afford to fight it and those that cant, it is all seriously broken

---

In other words, create a new state bureaucracy to collect income taxes and then pass them out to the various counties based on who deserves what. While they are at it, I'm sure the legislature can figure out some additional spending and so collect money for that, too. And, of course, for those who live out of state but who own property in Texas, such as Bill Gates, they wouldn't have to pay anything for the local services that property taxes now cover and so the income taxes would have to take more from Texas citizens to pay for the out of state property owners.

Don't forget, when new taxes are created, the old taxes don't go away. For example, the VAT was supposed to replace income taxes when it was introduced around the world. Did the income tax go away? Not that I know of. There was one country where the income tax was purportedly eliminated when they adopted the VAT, but for some reason that country still has an income tax.

Before the VAT spread in Europe, they supposedly paid about the same percentage of their income in income taxes as us. With the VAT, they now pay both income taxes and VAT and pay a much higher percentage of their income in income taxes than we do.

Can you provide examples of governments that have replaced one tax with another and eliminated the first?

To me, the idea reeks of a big tax hike on Texas citizens.

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Bill Gates owns ag exempt farmland, he doesnt pay anything now.

I have family in Oklahoma and the more times I visit Tulsa the more appealing it is. You can get a nice house at a very reasonable price compared to big cities in Texas.

aggiederelict said:

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I have family in Oklahoma and the more times I visit Tulsa the more appealing it is. You can get a nice house at a very reasonable price compared to big cities in Texas.

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Good to know, once texas completes getting California'd we'll all move up to OK and California it too

Bag said:

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Bill Gates owns ag exempt farmland, he doesnt pay anything now.

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I know lots of farmers. I wonder if any of them don't pay property taxes on their farms.

My understanding is that the ag exemption reduces the taxable value from market value to production value. It doesn't make the property exempt from all property taxes. Do I misunderstand this?

41% increase on my home (Collin Co.)

And how long has our state conservative leadership been talking and doing nothing? Yes looking at Patrick and his buddy Bettencourt. .

Farm land pays zero tax?

Where can I get some?

aggiederelict said:

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I have family in Oklahoma and the more times I visit Tulsa the more appealing it is. You can get a nice house at a very reasonable price compared to big cities in Texas.

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Absolutely. The only drawback to Tulsa, from what I understand is they are having some issues with crime right now. But you can get a beautiful home in a great neighborhood for about 1/2 to 2/3 the price of a quality home in say, Plano. Tulsa is also close to the Ozarks, so great fishing and hunting abound in the area.

Real Texans wouldn't do that to another state. Real Texans are some of the best people I know. That's the beauty of Texas and by far it's greatest resource, the PEOPLE of your great state. You cannot come close to matching the rugged individualism and can-do nature of Texans. There really is no comparison elsewhere in the Republic.

Unless you are a homeless person, everyone in this state pays property tax. It is about an evenly applied tax as we have. Sales tax would need to be about 25% to compensate for no property tax, and income tax would be so unevenly applied the kvetching would be worse than it is now.

If you are mad because your valuation blew up that is an inflation problem. If you don't believe real estate is blowing up right now, you are in denial. As someone mentioned above, the real problem is local governments who are not adjusting the tax rate down to compensate.

Bag said:

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A buddy just texted me and told me that his house (non homestead) went up 57% in value this year.

read that again, IN ONE YEAR

Mark to market tyranny.

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One of the condos I own went up 89.3% from 2021 to 2022.

Yeah...I'm gonna protest it.

eric76 said:

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Bag said:

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Bill Gates owns ag exempt farmland, he doesnt pay anything now.

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I know lots of farmers. I wonder if any of them don't pay property taxes on their farms.

My understanding is that the ag exemption reduces the taxable value from market value to production value. It doesn't make the property exempt from all property taxes. Do I misunderstand this?

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You have it right.

birdman said:

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eric76 said:

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Bag said:

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Bill Gates owns ag exempt farmland, he doesnt pay anything now.

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I know lots of farmers. I wonder if any of them don't pay property taxes on their farms.

My understanding is that the ag exemption reduces the taxable value from market value to production value. It doesn't make the property exempt from all property taxes. Do I misunderstand this?

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You have it right.

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My land is Ag exempt but that just lowers taxes. Never has eliminated them.

Back in the 80s my folks bought a part of what is now the ranch. A house and an old poison ivy riddled outhouse that had not been used in 40 years since indoor plumbing was provided, was taxed as an outbuilding.

She fought it and won.

SouthTex99 said:

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Its not the values that matter. Its the tax rate. Make your local officials pledge NO NEW REVENUE aka lower the tax rate.

The quicker we wise up to this the quicker we'll fix this problem.

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Easier said than done when their are half a dozen government entities assessing taxes on your property.

Tulsa is really such an undervalued city. My parents are selling their home in south Tulsa right now. 3800sqft 4 bedroom 3 bath with a pool and hot tub and looking to get $480,000. Crazy affordable compared to major metro cities in Texas.

Burdizzo said:

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Unless you are a homeless person, everyone in this state pays property tax. It is about an evenly applied tax as we have. Sales tax would need to be about 25% to compensate for no property tax, and income tax would be so unevenly applied the kvetching would be worse than it is now.

If you are mad because your valuation blew up that is an inflation problem. If you don't believe real estate is blowing up right now, you are in denial. As someone mentioned above, the real problem is local governments who are not adjusting the tax rate down to compensate.

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My issue is that you are taxing people based on gains that they have not realized and might never realize. on what planet does that make sense?

imagine being taxed on your stock portfolio yearly would you be okay with that?

the fundamental problem is that you are taxing people out of their homes. if a young couple scrapes together as much money as they can to buy a house at $200,000 and can barely get by and then all of a sudden you tell them their houses worth $600,000 even though they have not realized any of that money you have now just priced them out of their homes

Hb 3 and sb2 that passed in the last session don't let local governments reap the benefits of higher tax appraisals. It forces their tax rate down to a modest increase in revenue. If they exceed that, it forces an election. So to say that localities get to keep all the excess money due to these rising appraisals is not true

eric76 said:

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Bag said:

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Bill Gates owns ag exempt farmland, he doesnt pay anything now.

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I know lots of farmers. I wonder if any of them don't pay property taxes on their farms.

My understanding is that the ag exemption reduces the taxable value from market value to production value. It doesn't make the property exempt from all property taxes. Do I misunderstand this?

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sorry for the hyperbole, it was infered that he does pay some taxes but nowhere near what a property with no exemption pays.

Bag said:

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Burdizzo said:

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Unless you are a homeless person, everyone in this state pays property tax. It is about an evenly applied tax as we have. Sales tax would need to be about 25% to compensate for no property tax, and income tax would be so unevenly applied the kvetching would be worse than it is now.

If you are mad because your valuation blew up that is an inflation problem. If you don't believe real estate is blowing up right now, you are in denial. As someone mentioned above, the real problem is local governments who are not adjusting the tax rate down to compensate.

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My issue is that you are taxing people based on gains that they have not realized and might never realize. on what planet does that make sense?

imagine being taxed on your stock portfolio yearly would you be okay with that?

the fundamental problem is that you are taxing people out of their homes. if a young couple scrapes together as much money as they can to buy a house at $200,000 and can barely get by and then all of a sudden you tell them their houses worth $600,000 even though they have not realized any of that money you have now just priced them out of their homes

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Same thing happens to renters.

aggiederelict said:

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Tulsa is really such an undervalued city. My parents are selling their home in south Tulsa right now. 3800sqft 4 bedroom 3 bath with a pool and hot tub and looking to get $480,000. Crazy affordable compared to major metro cities in Texas.

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.
Crazy affordable is spot on! A pool and hot tub to boot. Damn, I'd love to have that but sadly I'm looking to retire soon and downsize bigtime. There is no telling how long this craptastic economy will last.

Is that the problem?

Should the taxes be managed by a single entity?

The crazy increase in revenues each year is not sustainable


Edit: as the system currently sits its like we've created this perfect bureaucracy and no one is responsible for anything