LMCane said:

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aTmAg said:

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cecil77 said:

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"Best"? if you mean most effective at implementing policies they promised. In the modern era it's Trump by a large margin.
Reagan may have been better in other ways.

But these two are head/shoulders above any in my lifetime.

---

I can't think of a single way that Trump is better than Reagan.

Reagan won the cold war, tamed inflation, reduced the top marginal tax rates from 70% to 28%, built the strongest economy since WW2, and more. Any one of those is better than what Trump did.

---

Reagan also was REELECTED in the largest landslide in US history while Trump LOST TO JOE BIDEN

Reagan was not impeached twice (and yes there was a democrat party Congress he had to deal with)

Reagan broke the back of the Soviet Union

Reagan was never despised by a majority of the American voters

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Hot damn that's some delicious tds

So broken… lolz

LMCane said:

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doubledog said:

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lethalninja said:

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I would say Abraham Lincoln, mainly because he did something that rhymes with "nail polished glavery" (abolished slavery).

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Washington because he established the presidency (although the whiskey rebellion was a bit over handed)
Lincoln because he saved the Union (although the hadius cuprous thing was a bit over handed)

Jefferson Davis, he almost single-handily lost the Civil War and thus saved the Union (with the help of R.E. Lee Gettysburg over Vicksburg).

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"habeas corpus"

Jeff Davis was not an American President

good point about Vicksburg being about as important as Gettysburg

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Thanks damn spell checker...

Marcus Brutus said:

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aTmAg said:

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cecil77 said:

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"Best"? if you mean most effective at implementing policies they promised. In the modern era it's Trump by a large margin.
Reagan may have been better in other ways.

But these two are head/shoulders above any in my lifetime.

---

I can't think of a single way that Trump is better than Reagan.

Reagan won the cold war, tamed inflation, reduced the top marginal tax rates from 70% to 28%, built the strongest economy since WW2, and more. Any one of those is better than what Trump did.

---

Gorbachev ended the cold war. Reagan almost doubled the debt, gave amnesty to illegals, passed EMTALA and the agencies got larger under him. Trump almost cut the corporate tax rate in half. Lowest UE since 1968. Downsized the agencies. Etc etc. Reagan also had sane Dems in congress to work with. While still the best, had Trump had sane Dems, he would have blown the doors off Reagans tenure.

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Saying Gorbachev "ended the cold war" is like saying "Hitler ended the war in Europe". Reagan kicked the pants out of every General Secretary he faced INCLUDING Gorbachev. Gorbachev just so happened to be the guy holding the bag when they collapsed. Reagan got the result he DID want while Gorbachev got the result he DIDN'T want, Reagan WON, Gorby LOST. Former KGB officials credit Reagan for their demise. No matter how much you guys try to re-write history, you can't erase common sense.

And "sane congress?" Are you kidding? Trump OWNED both houses of congress for half of his term. Reagan NEVER had that. And Trump still rung up YUGE deficits despite that. We gave Obama crap for doubling the debt, but his largest budget was $4.2T. Trump's last two were $6.5T and $6.8!! He only had one Budget less than any of Obama's and it was BARELY lower. It took Trump 4 years to spend almost as much as it took Obama to spend in 6. If Trump were there for 4 more years he would have BLOWN Obama's spending record away.

Trump wasn't a pimple on Reagan's ass.

It's barnes

Can you tell me what permanent changes, enshrined in federal law, that Trump accomplished?

He had a GOP House and Senate for two years, so surely he didn't squander it with sideshows and White House turmoil, right? There had to have been a tidal wave of conservative legislation?

ttu_85 said:

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My Name Is Judge said:

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Trump

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Trumps biggest mistake was not sacking Obama appointees to federal offices. Biden sure sacked his.

Huge mistake !! Hard to forgive that one

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Very true. He should have cleaned house across the entire fed.

carl spacklers hat said:

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Of the modern era? Reagan

Pre-20th Century? Washington

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Aggie4Life02 said:

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aTmAg said:

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Aggie4Life02 said:

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aTmAg said:

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Get Off My Lawn said:

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lethalninja said:

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I would say Abraham Lincoln, mainly because he did something that rhymes with "nail polished glavery" (abolished slavery).

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There's a good argument to be made that Lincoln is actually the worst. The idea that a state cannot leave the union has fueled the shift from a small fed to a functionally unchecked national government. He didn't preserve the union: he imprisoned the states. And he did so by ordering mass killing and deviation.

And I say this knowing that states secceeded between Lincoln's election and his inauguration, and knowing slavery to be evil, and having been taught that he was one of the best.

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The problem with this view is that the South attacked first. Yeah, Lincoln goaded them a bit, but they were ALL too happy to oblige.

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A foreign army that refused to evacuate. That hardly makes your case morally.

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Clearly it does, since that is what caused a huge surge in enlistment on BOTH sides.

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Nobody said Lincoln wasn't good at propaganda.

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You think Southerners who couldn't read were somehow buying into Lincoln's propaganda? Please.

LMCane said:

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aTmAg said:

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cecil77 said:

---

"Best"? if you mean most effective at implementing policies they promised. In the modern era it's Trump by a large margin.
Reagan may have been better in other ways.

But these two are head/shoulders above any in my lifetime.

---

I can't think of a single way that Trump is better than Reagan.

Reagan won the cold war, tamed inflation, reduced the top marginal tax rates from 70% to 28%, built the strongest economy since WW2, and more. Any one of those is better than what Trump did.

---

Reagan also was REELECTED* in the largest landslide in US history while Trump LOST TO JOE BIDEN

Reagan was not impeached twice (and yes there was a democrat party Congress he had to deal with)

Reagan broke the back of the Soviet Union

Reagan was never despised by a majority of the American voters

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1.) sketchy election practices with "flooding" at 3 in the morning
2.) Political tool used by democrats, was a joke
3.) Yes, but USSR was failing already, he just didnt' take his foot off its throat
4.) also didn't have 24 hour news cycle badmouthing him

Quote:

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Yes, but USSR was failing already, he just didnt' take his foot off its throat

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This is 20/10 hindsight.

There was no widespread belief in 1980 that the USSR was failing.

It wasn't as if Reagan took office and everyone was like "Oh, just keep it up, Ronnie. The Soviets are doomed."

Obama.

How many woke points do I get?

aTmAg said:

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Aggie4Life02 said:

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aTmAg said:

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Aggie4Life02 said:

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aTmAg said:

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Get Off My Lawn said:

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lethalninja said:

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I would say Abraham Lincoln, mainly because he did something that rhymes with "nail polished glavery" (abolished slavery).

---

There's a good argument to be made that Lincoln is actually the worst. The idea that a state cannot leave the union has fueled the shift from a small fed to a functionally unchecked national government. He didn't preserve the union: he imprisoned the states. And he did so by ordering mass killing and deviation.

And I say this knowing that states secceeded between Lincoln's election and his inauguration, and knowing slavery to be evil, and having been taught that he was one of the best.

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The problem with this view is that the South attacked first. Yeah, Lincoln goaded them a bit, but they were ALL too happy to oblige.

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A foreign army that refused to evacuate. That hardly makes your case morally.

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Clearly it does, since that is what caused a huge surge in enlistment on BOTH sides.

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Nobody said Lincoln wasn't good at propaganda.

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You think Southerners who couldn't read were somehow buying into Lincoln's propaganda? Please.

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I'm sure you have a point, but I'm not sure what it is? Your point is that the South started the war. It was the North that invaded a foreign nation, not the South.

aTmAg said:

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Marcus Brutus said:

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aTmAg said:

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cecil77 said:

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"Best"? if you mean most effective at implementing policies they promised. In the modern era it's Trump by a large margin.
Reagan may have been better in other ways.

But these two are head/shoulders above any in my lifetime.

---

I can't think of a single way that Trump is better than Reagan.

Reagan won the cold war, tamed inflation, reduced the top marginal tax rates from 70% to 28%, built the strongest economy since WW2, and more. Any one of those is better than what Trump did.

---

Gorbachev ended the cold war. Reagan almost doubled the debt, gave amnesty to illegals, passed EMTALA and the agencies got larger under him. Trump almost cut the corporate tax rate in half. Lowest UE since 1968. Downsized the agencies. Etc etc. Reagan also had sane Dems in congress to work with. While still the best, had Trump had sane Dems, he would have blown the doors off Reagans tenure.

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Saying Gorbachev "ended the cold war" is like saying "Hitler ended the war in Europe". Reagan kicked the pants out of every General Secretary he faced INCLUDING Gorbachev. Gorbachev just so happened to be the guy holding the bag when they collapsed. Reagan got the result he DID want while Gorbachev got the result he DIDN'T want, Reagan WON, Gorby LOST. Former KGB officials credit Reagan for their demise. No matter how much you guys try to re-write history, you can't erase common sense.

And "sane congress?" Are you kidding? Trump OWNED both houses of congress for half of his term. Reagan NEVER had that. And Trump still rung up YUGE deficits despite that. We gave Obama crap for doubling the debt, but his largest budget was $4.2T. Trump's last two were $6.5T and $6.8!! He only had one Budget less than any of Obama's and it was BARELY lower. It took Trump 4 years to spend almost as much as it took Obama to spend in 6. If Trump were there for 4 more years he would have BLOWN Obama's spending record away.

Trump wasn't a pimple on Reagan's ass.

---

Someone has never heard the term filibuster. The Dems had TDS and filibustered at every opportunity. Controlling congress now doesn't mean what it used to mean.

Gorbechev allowed the USSR to dissolve, after implementing major social and economic reforms. He allowed the republics to vote on a Russian federation of states after Poland, etc left. Because of that, there was a coup attempt which was unsuccessful. The republics then voted to leave and he allowed it. He could have shed blood to keep it together but he chose not to. It had nothing to do with Reagan.

You're a neocon warmonger, so it doesn't surprise me the misguided nostalgia is causing you to lash out in Reagans defense.

He was a great president, but Trump was better.

In modern history, Trump.

What he did for our country's economy, security and culture is unmatched and rivals Lincoln.

While Lincoln abolished slavery, Trump created economic reforms and fostered an an Environment where blacks were more employed than in any time in our nations history. But not just blacks, brown people and Indians were more employed as well. He "freed" them from economic slavery, if you will.

He was also a tremendous military leader who kept the peace by communicating our military might to the world.

His style was brash, yes, but what he accomplished in his 4 years despite the left wing radicals and the MSM is easily top 3 of all time.

Washington, Trump, Lincoln

Quote:

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3.) Yes, but USSR was failing already, he just didnt' take his foot off its throat

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Wrong. The Soviets built two pipelines that were going to fuel Europe and flood the Soviets with cash for decades. It just so happened, it blew up. Why? Because of Reagan. Under him, the CIA created a brand new division that designed faulty engineering equipment for the Soviets to steal. Russians built their entire oil infrastructure with this faulty equipment and had to shut the entire thing down.

Reagan also made a weapons deal with Saudi Arabia so they would turn on the oil *****ets full blast, reduce oil prices, which both help the US economy and crushed the Soviet economy.

He exposed to Europe that eastern block nations were double financing on a bunch of their loans. Those loans defaulted, and when the Soviets couldn't bail them out, the credit of the entire system collapsed.

Reagan gave Stingers to the Afghanis which turned that war around and defeated the Soviets.

And plenty more.


Without these actions, the USSR could have continued just like Cuba and North Korea have for decades since.

Reagan in my lifetime followed by Trump. No one else comes remotely close.

I'm reading The Rise of Theodore Roosevelt right now and it's hard not to like him.

AGinHI said:

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I would rather take on all the Presidents in a Hunger Games battle

than read this thread.

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An oldie but a goodie: https://faceintheblue.wordpress.com/2012/08/22/in-a-mass-knife-fight-to-the-death-between-every-american-president-who-would-win-and-why/

Keegan99 said:

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Can you tell me what permanent changes, enshrined in federal law, that Trump accomplished?

He had a GOP House and Senate for two years, so surely he didn't squander it with sideshows and White House turmoil, right? There had to have been a tidal wave of conservative legislation?

---

Nope, there wasn't. But it wasn't for lack of trying. And w/out the squandering you mentioned, I think he would have clearly been the best of my lifetime. Main reason I'm pissed at him and ready for him to go away.

And this brings up a different and probably more important topic.

Executive Orders.

At the rate use of them has gone this century, we'll be an "elected " in a generation.

Marcus Brutus said:

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aTmAg said:

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Marcus Brutus said:

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aTmAg said:

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cecil77 said:

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"Best"? if you mean most effective at implementing policies they promised. In the modern era it's Trump by a large margin.
Reagan may have been better in other ways.

But these two are head/shoulders above any in my lifetime.

---

I can't think of a single way that Trump is better than Reagan.

Reagan won the cold war, tamed inflation, reduced the top marginal tax rates from 70% to 28%, built the strongest economy since WW2, and more. Any one of those is better than what Trump did.

---

Gorbachev ended the cold war. Reagan almost doubled the debt, gave amnesty to illegals, passed EMTALA and the agencies got larger under him. Trump almost cut the corporate tax rate in half. Lowest UE since 1968. Downsized the agencies. Etc etc. Reagan also had sane Dems in congress to work with. While still the best, had Trump had sane Dems, he would have blown the doors off Reagans tenure.

---

Saying Gorbachev "ended the cold war" is like saying "Hitler ended the war in Europe". Reagan kicked the pants out of every General Secretary he faced INCLUDING Gorbachev. Gorbachev just so happened to be the guy holding the bag when they collapsed. Reagan got the result he DID want while Gorbachev got the result he DIDN'T want, Reagan WON, Gorby LOST. Former KGB officials credit Reagan for their demise. No matter how much you guys try to re-write history, you can't erase common sense.

And "sane congress?" Are you kidding? Trump OWNED both houses of congress for half of his term. Reagan NEVER had that. And Trump still rung up YUGE deficits despite that. We gave Obama crap for doubling the debt, but his largest budget was $4.2T. Trump's last two were $6.5T and $6.8!! He only had one Budget less than any of Obama's and it was BARELY lower. It took Trump 4 years to spend almost as much as it took Obama to spend in 6. If Trump were there for 4 more years he would have BLOWN Obama's spending record away.

Trump wasn't a pimple on Reagan's ass.

---

Someone has never heard the term filibuster. The Dems had TDS and filibustered at every opportunity. Controlling congress now doesn't mean what it used to mean.

---

Obama never had a fillibuster proof senate and was still able to ram through things like Obamacare without a single GOP vote. Reagan never even had a majority of both houses and he pushed through the largest tax cut in American history. So this excuse is BS. Hell, let the democrats fillibuster. I'd rather congress waste their time fillibustering than passing laws that infringe on freedom. It's the best of both worlds.

Quote:

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Gorbechev allowed the USSR to dissolve, after implementing major social and economic reforms. He allowed the republics to vote on a Russian federation of states after Poland, etc left. Because of that, there was a coup attempt which was unsuccessful. The republics then voted to leave and he allowed it. He could have shed blood to keep it together but he chose not to. It had nothing to do with Reagan.

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Total BS. The SOVIETS THEMSELVES credit Reagan. The reason Gorbechev was implementing economic reforms was because he needed to do SOMETHING out of desperation. Reagan was kicking their ass economically as he shut off their energy exports along with much more.

Quote:

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You're a neocon warmonger, so it doesn't surprise me the misguided nostalgia is causing you to lash out in Reagans defense.

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LOL! You are agreeing with BIDEN on foreign policy. The guy that Gates said hasn't made a correct foreign policy decision in his entire life. The entire reason Putin invaded is because of idiocy like you espouse. You have ZERO room to talk on foreign policy.

Quote:

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He was a great president, but Trump was better.

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Reagan was the greatest president of any of our lifetimes. Trump wasn't even close. Hell most of the inflation we are experiencing right now is due to Trump. We haven't started feeling his dumbass policies on that yet.

Reagan

Washington
Lincoln

Trump

Ike

three of these are from historical purposes as they predated my birth.

This guy was a gem while in office.

Before I click on that link, if anyone but TR won then its flawed opinion.

And now I'll click it.

Tom Doniphon said:

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Before I click on that link, if anyone but TR won then its flawed opinion.

And now I'll click it.

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He's one of the "Holy Trinity" with Lincoln and Jackson.

So McCain as a tiebreaker is considered having senate?

Trump kept every campaign promise & delivered around $10k/year raise to the working class…

He literally had to fight trashbags from the left, right, media, foreign govts, & his own cabinet every single day

He exposed just how fraudulent our entire system is

He's no doubt the goat in my book

BonsaiGreen said:

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In modern history, Trump.

What he did for our country's economy, security and culture is unmatched and rivals Lincoln.

While Lincoln abolished slavery, Trump created economic reforms and fostered an an Environment where blacks were more employed than in any time in our nations history. But not just blacks, brown people and Indians were more employed as well. He "freed" them from economic slavery, if you will.

He was also a tremendous military leader who kept the peace by communicating our military might to the world.

His style was brash, yes, but what he accomplished in his 4 years despite the left wing radicals and the MSM is easily top 3 of all time.

Washington, Trump, Lincoln

---

Trump payed people to not work and demanded Powell print money and spent OVER 60% MORE in his last 2 years than Obama did in his last 2 years. That increases the money supply and reduces the amount of goods that those dollars are chasing. That is why we are having record high inflation right now. It takes well over a year for this crap to kick in. We have barely started feeling the effects of Biden's dumbass policies.

If Trump had won in 2020 we would be having the EXACT SAME inflation problem we are having right now.

My Name Is Judge said:

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So McCain as a tiebreaker is considered having senate?

Trump kept every campaign promise & delivered around $10k/year raise to the working class…

He literally had to fight trashbags from the left, right, media, foreign govts, & his own cabinet every single day

He exposed just how fraudulent our entire system is

He's no doubt the goat in my book

---

Did Trump promise to spend $2T more per year than any other president in history? If so, then he nailed that one.

My Name Is Judge said:

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So McCain as a tiebreaker is considered having senate?

Trump kept every campaign promise & delivered around $10k/year raise to the working class…

He literally had to fight trashbags from the left, right, media, foreign govts, & his own cabinet every single day

He exposed just how fraudulent our entire system is

He's no doubt the goat in my book

---

Well, his commentary on McCain didn't do him any favors with that majority. Unlike Cruz McCain wasn't going to take Trump's bull**** with a smile.

lb3 said:

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I have mixed feelings about Lincoln. His credit in ending slavery rings hollow to me when the emancipation only freed southern slaves and not northern slaves. It seems as if it was more of a means of economic and cultural warfare than based in any moral reasoning.

Lincoln also unconstitutionally suspended habeas corpus and unleashed a campaign of terror upon civilians that had not been seen in in Christian civilizations for hundreds of years.

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The British suspended habeas corpus in 1816.

Does the Seven Years' War not include a campaign of terror on non-combatants? Or what about the Napoleonic Wars?

You have to give Trump a tremendous amount of credit for dealing with Fake News, the Swamp and all that that entailed

suburban cowboy said:

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You have to give Trump a tremendous amount of credit for dealing with Fake News, the Swamp and all that that entailed

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Trump was the first.... it'll be no different for any (R) president moving forward. The explosion of social media changed that dynamic (IMHO).

aTmAg said:

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Jason C. said:

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aTmAg said:

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ttu_85 said:

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aTmAg said:

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I'm not a fan of Teddy's anti-trust nonsense.

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I am. Monopolies and oligopolies are a cancer - limit innovation, suppress eco expansion and opportunities. Busting trust creates more companies and options and accelerates tech and efficiency.

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I think you are mistaken. There has never been a naturaly occurring Monopoly within the free market. Every monopoly had been created by or perpetuated by government. Even standard oil only had 30% of market share by the time they were broken up. What really happened was Rockefeller's competition used the anti-trust laws and the power of government to break him up because they could not compete against him in the free market. Even at his peak, he never pushed up prices like trust busters assumed. Standard Oil was easily the most innovative of all oil companies. So the government actually hampered that rather than enhance it.

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In the modern communication age I would love to see some of the big technology companies broken up, whether under antitrust laws or otherwise. They have too much power over the single most important thing in the global economy, information. So to some extent I also understand the early 20th century trust-busting efforts by the federal government. A handful of companies had come to control the then-most important thing in the developing American economy, energy.

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If we started doing that you regret it. Rush Limbaugh would have been "broken" up based on such rules because they would declare him a "monopoly". I remember back in the 1990s when everybody thought that Microsoft would crush everybody in the browser wars and that we needed government to stop allowing them to ship explorer with their OS. Now that opinion is laughable as MS got their asses kicked. The same will be true with Facebook, Google, etc.

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Limbaugh was not a company per se and did not have a "monopoly." That's absurd. He was on AM radio 3 hours a day and had a TV show for a very short time that most people today are unaware of. He wasn't on Sat, TV, newspaper (he did a monthly newsletter but only to subscribers -- not freely online), and late in his life, his shows were available in podcast form. There was no one, not a single person, that couldn't do the same thing Rush did. They may not have had access to a radio station, but they had as much as Rush had when he started: youtube, podcast mediums, etc.

MS wasn't "broken up" because they were a monopoly; they were harassed because they (at the time) weren't involved in a pay for play with the Clinton admin. It wasn't anything more than that. Clinton got Wall Street on board with democrats and every other big company after that. MS was somewhat of a holdout until Justice went after them. Once they started donating -- not just to Clinton, Gore, etc. but to Congress -- the heat stopped.

The only thing you're right about is that things DO change. But the companies you mention in your last sentence are in bed with the government now. They'll remain powerful as long as that's the case. That won't change.

My Name Is Judge said:

---

So McCain as a tiebreaker is considered having senate?

Trump kept every campaign promise & delivered around $10k/year raise to the working class…

He literally had to fight trashbags from the left, right, media, foreign govts, & his own cabinet every single day

He exposed just how fraudulent our entire system is

He's no doubt the goat in my book

---

The Senate following 2016 was 51-47-2 plus Pence.

Trump couldn't get 'em line.

A truly great President would.


He had no substantial permanent conservative legislative achievements.

A truly great President would.

carl spacklers hat said:

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Of the modern era? Reagan

Pre-20th Century? Washington

---

This

Were it not for Watergate, Richard Nixon would have been a contender.

aTmAg said:

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BonsaiGreen said:

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In modern history, Trump.

What he did for our country's economy, security and culture is unmatched and rivals Lincoln.

While Lincoln abolished slavery, Trump created economic reforms and fostered an an Environment where blacks were more employed than in any time in our nations history. But not just blacks, brown people and Indians were more employed as well. He "freed" them from economic slavery, if you will.

He was also a tremendous military leader who kept the peace by communicating our military might to the world.

His style was brash, yes, but what he accomplished in his 4 years despite the left wing radicals and the MSM is easily top 3 of all time.

Washington, Trump, Lincoln

---

Trump payed people to not work and demanded Powell print money and spent OVER 60% MORE in his last 2 years than Obama did in his last 2 years. That increases the money supply and reduces the amount of goods that those dollars are chasing. That is why we are having record high inflation right now. It takes well over a year for this crap to kick in. We have barely started feeling the effects of Biden's dumbass policies.

If Trump had won in 2020 we would be having the EXACT SAME inflation problem we are having right now.

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Your TDS is showing. I hope you enjoy what your boy Brandon is doing to our country.