backintexas2013 said:

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California is the only state I can remember that voted for a constitutional amendment outlawing gay marriage. Maybe others have but CA I remember it passing.

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In 2008 Prop 8 passed with a narrow majority 52% to 47%. In the same year, FLs ban passed 61-38, Maine in 2009 52-47. In 2006 Wisconsin was 59-40 against. TX in 2004 was 76-23..

CA was the 25th state to have a gay marriage referendum. If you look at the actual results, no gay marriage was blowout except Maine and CA, with national attitudes changing rapidly, so 2004 TX vs 2008 CA is imperfect as mores change, but I think my overall point still stands.

Democrat leadership.

That's it.

Thanks I remember CA in 2008 because I lived there. CA isn't that tolerant when you get on the 99 corridor or northern CA. Guess it all depends on where you live. Most towns on 99 are very segregated.

backintexas2013 said:

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Thanks I remember CA in 2008 because I lived there. CA isn't that tolerant when you get on the 99 corridor or northern CA. Guess it all depends on where you live. Most towns on 99 are very segregated.

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Well, yea. Bakersfield and Redding are way more conservative than Austin. That's also a fairly small % of the state compared to the coasts.

EclipseAg said:

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UTExan said:

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there is so little available space because there are too many people.

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It will never happen, but if the US was smart, we would begin clamping down on immigration and severely limit population growth.

The list of activities, events and economic/lifestyle benefits that have been ruined by overcrowding -- in a single lifetime -- is a long one, and growing every day.

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Exactly. The US does not need a population growth. My parents are from Taiwan, but I believe it's time for Congress to tamp down on mass immigration. There are already about 332 million people in this country, and this immigration growth beyond 400 million people is unsustainable. Massive immigration causes traffic congestion, which would cause the quality of roads to decline faster. Also, the rapid increase has strained America's beleaguered schools, which literally don't have room for all these students. In addition, it would further tighten the supply of affordable housing for purchase or rent. Furthermore, there would be an increased demand for water, electricity, and other public services. Most importantly, there would be increased competition for jobs. We have to not only crackdown on illegal immigration, but also set legal immigration caps.

I am from Fremont, California, but I have lived in Texas since August 2013 and have not looked back. My parents still live in California and I visit my parents twice a year. But because they have noticed the decline of California, the high cost of living, and a very competitive job market, they actually encouraged me to move to Texas.

California used to be a Republican state. Republicans won the state in every presidential election between 1952 and 1988, except for 1964. California's Latino and Asian populations boomed in the 1990s and the growing segment of voters were turned off by the Republican Party's hard-line stance on immigration. After the party closely tied itself to Proposition 187, a controversial California ballot measure that denied public services to people in the country illegally, Republicans struggled to win back the state's immigrant population. Democratic candidates have won decisively in every election since 1992 by performing well in the most populous areas.

https://www.latimes.com/projects/la-pol-ca-california-voting-history/

LSCSN said:

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My great granduncle moved there in 1955 from Texas. He had so many great stories of California in the 50s and 60s.

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It was fun listening to stories of a horse wrangler who worked on Western pictures back during that era.

Demographics happened.

Iraq2xVeteran said:

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I am from Fremont, California, but I have lived in Texas since August 2013 and have not looked back. My parents still live in California and I visit my parents twice a year. But because they have noticed the decline of California, the high cost of living, and a very competitive job market, they actually encouraged me to move to Texas.

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Our company has most operations in CA but we don't hire new CA workers anymore unless boots on the ground is a requirement for success. It's just too expensive.

I've been both lucky and skilled to be on the right side of the wealth gap here and live in a city fairly immune from LA shenanigans. But this state has an unmistakable death rattle that can only be fixed by business and law and order returning.

Regulatory Capture happened in California that is truly unfathomable, imo.

cecil77 said:

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Fill CA with Texans and Texan sensibilities and it would be paradise. There'd be a wall to keep people out.

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Don't stop with CA.....go all the way up the West Coast. Do you know what conservative farmers, hunters, outdoorsmen could do with OR and WA too? Beautiful land, inhabited by parasites.

Honestly, in all those cases it's the coastal urban people. The remainder are pretty much like the rest of us.

BigHitterDaLama said:

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cecil77 said:

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Fill CA with Texans and Texan sensibilities and it would be paradise. There'd be a wall to keep people out.

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Don't stop with CA.....go all the way up the West Coast. Do you know what conservative farmers, hunters, outdoorsmen could do with OR and WA too? Beautiful land, inhabited by parasites.

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To my earlier point though, those hard nosed manly men don't create Silicon Valley nor Hollywood. California culture is a feature, not a bug, of its historical and current business success and wealth. Similarly, this culture is not suited for high finance (NY wheelers and dealers) nor TX oil barons.

With that though the progressive overreach is killing the golden goose.

Malibu2 said:

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The good:
1. Creative and iconoclast culture - There's a reason SV and Hollywood are in California. There's also a reason that SV is moving to Austin, and not Houston. Culture does matter and California is in general far more permissive of alternative thought than other parts of the country.

2. The weather and geography - Undeniable beauty. My wife is a very accomplished marathon runner and running year round with access to great trails and hills is a huge draw. I like to surf. A McMansion in McKinney might give us better $/sqft, but at what cost to our lifestyle of things we really like to do in life.

3. Access to wealth - This matter a lot more to starting and growing a business than dumb tax regimes. Complaining endlessly about the $800 / year LLC fees is right, but that has to be balanced against how easy it has been to raise money here for my business.

The bad:
1. Bad governance:

• Taxes are out of control. Part of this is progressives that never learn you can't tax your way out of trouble, part of this is bad public policy from voters (Prop 13). My property taxes in CA are probably lower than yours in TX and I live in million home. They won't go up more than 2% per year by law. That necessarily means that taxes have to come from income, placing an undue burden on the asset-less class that makes up a larger and larger portion of our state.
• Soft on crime. I supported initiatives that looked good in pilot programs. Drug decriminalization. Bail reform. Housing for homeless. It's clear now that these don't work at scale and the unintended consequences are much more severe than the benefits. The state has been far too slow to pivot

2. How point 2 above contribute to problems:

• Geography - San Francisco is a highly developed city on a peninsula with almost no empty lots and LA has the same issue with the ocean. Transposing a DFW or Houston paradigm on these cities won't work. We don't have the same room to grow housing supply without going vertical or infill. CA has passed great laws for ADUs and making all SFH zoning anywhere in the state eligible for building up to 4 units. That increases supply, thats great, but we're still severly limited in housing supply.
  
  People often marvel that housing and rent in LA and SF are going up when everyone seems to be leaving. That's because there's still not nearly enough supply. Families live in cramped multi-generation housing.
  
  
• Weather - Irrespective of other unintended consequences and soft on crime, all else equal I'd rather be a homeless heroin addict in LA than Dallas. The weather here will attract vagrants and ne'er-do-wells at a higher rate than other places.

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I saw a video from The NY Times (I believe - it was a progressive site, that I do remember) and it chastised progressives for having the case of NIMBY. They won't develop more housing units inside good neighborhoods, yet they complain about housing prices. It's as if they want the asset evaluation to be high to keep the undesirables out. They also control the sq footage requirements for the lots to prevent high rises. It also discussed other topics how the progressives do a double speak in Cali on many topics. And it went on and on.

Iraq2xVeteran said:

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EclipseAg said:

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UTExan said:

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there is so little available space because there are too many people.

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It will never happen, but if the US was smart, we would begin clamping down on immigration and severely limit population growth.

The list of activities, events and economic/lifestyle benefits that have been ruined by overcrowding -- in a single lifetime -- is a long one, and growing every day.

---

Exactly. The US does not need a population growth. My parents are from Taiwan, but I believe it's time for Congress to tamp down on mass immigration. There are already about 332 million people in this country, and this immigration growth beyond 400 million people is unsustainable. Massive immigration causes traffic congestion, which would cause the quality of roads to decline faster. Also, the rapid increase has strained America's beleaguered schools, which literally don't have room for all these students. In addition, it would further tighten the supply of affordable housing for purchase or rent. Furthermore, there would be an increased demand for water, electricity, and other public services. Most importantly, there would be increased competition for jobs. We have to not only crackdown on illegal immigration, but also set legal immigration caps.

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And deport many of them - even if they have anchor babies.

TAMU1990 said:

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I saw a video from The NY Times (I believe - it was a progressive site, that I do remember) and it chastised progressives for having the case of NIMBY. They won't develop more housing units inside good neighborhoods, yet they complain about housing prices. It's as if they want the asset evaluation to be high to keep the undesirables out. They also control the sq footage requirements for the lots to prevent high rises. It also discussed other topics how the progressives do a double speak in Cali on many topics. And it went on and on.

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I don't think it's about keeping out undesirables so much as it is self interest in keeping property values high. Fairly universally, people like getting wealthier by doing very little.

cecil77 said:

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Honestly, in all those cases it's the coastal urban people. The remainder are pretty much like the rest of us.

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Unfortunately most of the states population lives along the coast.

SA68AG said:

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Jerry Brown was the beginning of the end.

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It was the "woking" of the school systems.

Hedge said:

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They really aren't, I understand why people hate them but they are beautiful women, except maybe khloe.

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No.
This is a bad take and you should feel bad.

Republicans are PRO immigration, legal immigration. And it is preposterous for illegal immigrants to get the benefit of public services which are paid for by taxpayers. I get it that illegals work and somewhat / indirectly pay into the system, but that isn't good enough. Public services funded by taxpayers should only be available to legal taxpayers, that does not always necessarily include citizens as you can be in the country legally with work permits, visas, etc., etc.

Quote:

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Similarly, this culture is not suited for . . . TX oil barons.

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I don't know. Jed Clampett seemed to do OK out there.

Cali hasn't been the same since this guy left the Governor office.

I was born and spent my preteen years in California, and I've lived there three times as an adult, beginning fifteen years after we first moved back east. The California into which I was born in the '60's is long gone.

My subtle-as-a-can-of-Drano mother said it best: "California used to be free spirited. Now everybody there thinks the sun shines out their ass,".

Malibu2 said:

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backintexas2013 said:

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Thanks I remember CA in 2008 because I lived there. CA isn't that tolerant when you get on the 99 corridor or northern CA. Guess it all depends on where you live. Most towns on 99 are very segregated.

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Well, yea. Bakersfield and Redding are way more conservative than Austin. That's also a fairly small % of the state compared to the coasts.

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The entire 99, outside of Sacramento proper, is very conservative. Doesn't mean they're not tolerant people. I believe California has the most registered republicans of any state, correct?

Most of my work travels the last couple of years have been Sacramento and into the Central Valley. I haven't worn a mask there since late 2020. Actually I'm in Tulare for the World Ag Expo right now. Good folks all around.

EclipseAg said:

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California in the '60s:



California today:

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*'70s

One of the big reason CA is such a shat show is due to direct democracy. If you get a petition with enough sigs, you can put anything on the ballot and directly impact both law and the budget. It's pretty stupid.

California writ large is a 3rd world country now, from a societal perspective. Specifically, the large cities there.

It's reasonable to ask whether I'm seeking out outliers, but I met James 5 minutes after parking my car and he was the first person I interviewed, and Ben, below, was the 4th person we interviewed after ~20 minutes on the street doing interviewshttps://t.co/kVQW0q9y5D

— Michael Shellenberger (@ShellenbergerMD) February 9, 2022

Pretty sure CA turning blue is correlated with the amount of immigration the last 50 years. I remember reading studies showing the correlation.

Other studies showing that basically if we had no immigration since the 60s, the democratic party would have ceased to be a major party, without becoming more right leaning.

Look at the amount of dems that are 1st, 2nd or 3rd gen Americans vs how many are Repubs. That shows that many do not assimilate to the American culture... Self reliance and rugged individualism.