CanyonAg77 said:

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I'm still waiting on the flying cars GM forecast in the 1930s

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Meet George Jetson . . .

GM will go bankrupt forcing this down people's throats. It won't effect me as drive Ford here.

MouthBQ98 said:

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We don't have enough lithium. We simply don't.

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I'm hoping though they try to find all they can find and then I'll divest myself of that misadventure.

They said it doesn't apply to trucks.

Just cars and SUVs

Most days I drive 50-60 miles, but there are times I travel for work and that may be 300 or so.

Are apartment complexes now going to have charging stations in every spot, or do you have to stop on your way home for an hour to charge the car?

Driving in to work today I saw I had 200 miles left in the tank and was trying to remember the last time I filled up. It was 1/16/21. 700 miles without a stop at a gas station is pretty nice.

There appears to be no bad idea that Shanked doesn't support.

ChemEAg08 said:

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amercer said:

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They said it doesn't apply to trucks.

Just cars and SUVs

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They'll quietly back out of suvs as well.

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Quote in OP says trucks, too. I agree with you that they will back away from trucks and SUVs.

The plan is to eliminate personal vehicles and force us into the cities on public transportation. They can have my V8 when...

Shanked Punt said:

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Quote:

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The company plans to use 100% renewable energy to power its U.S. facilities by 2030 and global facilities by 2035 five years ahead of a previously announced goal.

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So virtue signaling GM is going green around the globe in places that absolutely wreck the environment? Yeah, I'm gonna call BS on that one.

MouthBQ98 said:

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We don't have enough lithium. We simply don't.

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Or infrastructure, home or on the road. The range is not there also, nor is battery life or battery production. Many Nissan Leaf buyers have a brick now because they can't get a replacement.

The whole thing is a fantasy.

Short GM stock because they are going under.

jja79 said:

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Where are they going to dispose of all the batteries? Strip mine a mountain away and put them in a landfill? Great environmentalists. They're so stupid they don't even know they're stupid.

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Someone is going to get rich figuring out how to economically recycle them.

ChemEAg08 said:

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amercer said:

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They said it doesn't apply to trucks.

Just cars and SUVs

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They'll quietly back out of suvs as well.

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Shhh.. Mercer fancies himself a scientist and believes it

Magic City Wings said:

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jja79 said:

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Where are they going to dispose of all the batteries? Strip mine a mountain away and put them in a landfill? Great environmentalists. They're so stupid they don't even know they're stupid.

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Someone is going to get rich figuring out how to economically recycle them.

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Someone is going to get rich recycling nuclear waste too.

MouthBQ98 said:

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We don't have enough lithium. We simply don't.

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I don't know, but lithium was the 3rd most abundant atom at the birth of the universe. Seems it is somewhere around the 27th most abundant mineral in the earth. BUT, it is toxic and mining is dangerous and dirty. Soooo we pollute the environment to save the environment. Let alone cobalt mining.

Actually it seems some of the off the wall environmentalists exhibit symptoms of lithium overdose specifically "an altered level of consciousness" aka Kerry:

Quote:

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Lithium toxicity, also known as lithium overdose, is the condition of having too much lithium.[url=https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lithium_toxicity#cite_note-Stat2019-1][1][/url] Symptoms may include a tremor, increased reflexes, trouble walking, kidney problems, and an altered level of consciousness.[url=https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lithium_toxicity#cite_note-Stat2019-1][1][/url] Some symptoms may last for a year after levels return to normal.[url=https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lithium_toxicity#cite_note-Stat2019-1][1][/url] Complications may include serotonin syndrome.[url=https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lithium_toxicity#cite_note-Stat2019-1][1][/url]

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WHOOP!'91 said:

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ChemEAg08 said:

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amercer said:

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They said it doesn't apply to trucks.

Just cars and SUVs

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They'll quietly back out of suvs as well.

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Quote in OP says trucks, too. I agree with you that they will back away from trucks and SUVs.

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I don't have a source since I was listening to SXM, but I think I heard that only HD vehicles would have internal combustion engines available.

I'm FINE if they can give me new tech as good or better than the old. I just don't see the physics and chemistry allowing that.

Shanked Punt said:

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Jbob04 said:

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Ol Rock said:

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I wonder where all of that electricity will come from?

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lol, coal is dying away. electric generation from coal in 2035 will be single digit small potatoes.

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Shut down natural gas production and replace it for generating electricity with ......

Shanked Punt said:

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https://www.cnbc.com/2021/01/28/general-motors-plans-to-exclusively-offer-electric-vehicles-by-2035.html

This is great news all around, though hopefully they can bring in the deadline yet another five years or so. Its now time to get all the infrastructure in place. This can't come soon enough to help greatly reduce our dependency on oil.

Quote:

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DETROIT General Motors wants to end production of all diesel- and gasoline-powered cars, trucks and SUVs by 2035 and shift its entire new fleet to electric vehicles as part of a broader plan to become carbon neutral by 2040, the company said Thursday.

The company plans to use 100% renewable energy to power its U.S. facilities by 2030 and global facilities by 2035 five years ahead of a previously announced goal.

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The shift to non-gas vehicles has to happen eventually. I hope GM can pull it off. The main problem isn't just the infrastructure, but making sure the power grids can keep up with the increased demands. This electricity has to come from somewhere.

Do you think our power grid will be able to meet our increasing energy demands in 2035 without fossil fuels? Right now, the net zero natural gas technology is a clean, safe, efficient way to produce electricity. We're going to need some major breakthroughs for green energy to have it surpass nat gas. I think it's extremely foolish for Biden to try and kneecap the O&G industry. Hurting O&G isn't going to magically make green energy suddenly able to keep up or make it cheaper.

Magic City Wings said:

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jja79 said:

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Where are they going to dispose of all the batteries? Strip mine a mountain away and put them in a landfill? Great environmentalists. They're so stupid they don't even know they're stupid.

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Someone is going to get rich figuring out how to economically recycle them.

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Lots of people said that about tires.

Ever look up at how many tire dumps are out there that have been abandoned?



https://www.tceq.texas.gov/permitting/waste_permits/tires/tires-reporting#tirerptsum

Cassius said:

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ChemEAg08 said:

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amercer said:

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They said it doesn't apply to trucks.

Just cars and SUVs

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They'll quietly back out of suvs as well.

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Shhh.. Mercer fancies himself a scientist and believes it

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I apparently occupy a weird slice of real estate in your head.

Signel said:

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By 2035, the battery technology should be strong enough to support 1000+ miles a charge. I don't see why this is much of a big deal.

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If there were a way to know that for certain, and how supply chains and infrastructure could support it, it would be a gigantic deal. As in impossibly gigantic. Even over 20 years, the capital expenditures required to construct as electric and reliably charge the cars on the road today would soak up an almost unfathomable amount of investment for a money losing project.

If anyone right now knows how to make a battery that could support a 1000 mile range in a commercially self supporting product, they would be a trillionaire. The richest guy in the world makes one with a 400 mile EPA range (more like 270 at highway speed) and is losing money selling as many as he can make at $80k a pop. He sometimes makes a profit on the emission credits he sells to companies like GM.

Electric cars require someone else to pay for it and no business model shows otherwise, tech advancements may turn the corner someday, but the Tesla Model S has been around for nearly a decade and hasn't approached the kind of leaps in range performance that would be required to get near 1000 miles.

Magic City Wings said:

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jja79 said:

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Where are they going to dispose of all the batteries? Strip mine a mountain away and put them in a landfill? Great environmentalists. They're so stupid they don't even know they're stupid.

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Someone is going to get rich figuring out how to economically recycle them.

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Yes! Just like someone figured out to recycle nuclear waste!

California can't keep the lights on now. How are they going to be able to grow their grid that fast?

How do you serve the fueling stations in the middle of the desert?

How do you handle the lines of cars waiting at charging stations for a 45 min charge that used to take 7 mins for a fill up?

How do you increase the amount of copper and aluminum that would be needed for all the new infrastructure?

etc., etc......

Tony Franklins Other Shoe said:

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Magic City Wings said:

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jja79 said:

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Where are they going to dispose of all the batteries? Strip mine a mountain away and put them in a landfill? Great environmentalists. They're so stupid they don't even know they're stupid.

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Someone is going to get rich figuring out how to economically recycle them.

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Lots of people said that about tires.

Ever look up at how many tire dumps are out there that have been abandoned?



https://www.tceq.texas.gov/permitting/waste_permits/tires/tires-reporting#tirerptsum

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The market will find a way to whatever works if allowed, interesting though that the invention/refinement of steel belted radial tires has tripled the life of a set.

Electrics are fine, mandates and subsidies are not.

chimpanzee said:

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Signel said:

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By 2035, the battery technology should be strong enough to support 1000+ miles a charge. I don't see why this is much of a big deal.

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If there were a way to know that for certain, and how supply chains and infrastructure could support it, it would be a gigantic deal. As in impossibly gigantic. Even over 20 years, the capital expenditures required to construct as electric and reliably charge the cars on the road today would soak up an almost unfathomable amount of investment for a money losing project.

If anyone right now knows how to make a battery that could support a 1000 mile range in a commercially self supporting product, they would be a trillionaire. The richest guy in the world makes one with a 400 mile EPA range (more like 270 at highway speed) and is losing money selling as many as he can make at $80k a pop. He sometimes makes a profit on the emission credits he sells to companies like GM.

Electric cars require someone else to pay for it and no business model shows otherwise, tech advancements may turn the corner someday, but the Tesla Model S has been around for nearly a decade and hasn't approached the kind of leaps in range performance that would be required to get near 1000 miles.

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+ 1000.
The first thing a sane government would do would be discontinue the $7500 tax credit per car (I believe this is for the first 200,000 cars). I do not want to pay for someone else's $70,000 car, if they can afford $70,000 they sure as hell can affford $77,500.

Grand goal. Current technology does not support. If and when tech can support 1000+ mile range and short recharge time(less than a couple of hours). Maybe it is time to invest in TAAS(Transportation as a Service) stocks. Drive to destination, turn car in at hotel and have fresh vehicle next morning to continue trip.

Tony Franklins Other Shoe said:

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Magic City Wings said:

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jja79 said:

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Where are they going to dispose of all the batteries? Strip mine a mountain away and put them in a landfill? Great environmentalists. They're so stupid they don't even know they're stupid.

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Someone is going to get rich figuring out how to economically recycle them.

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Lots of people said that about tires.

Ever look up at how many tire dumps are out there that have been abandoned?



https://www.tceq.texas.gov/permitting/waste_permits/tires/tires-reporting#tirerptsum

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That was before there was a "***President***" going green.

Magic City Wings said:

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jja79 said:

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Where are they going to dispose of all the batteries? Strip mine a mountain away and put them in a landfill? Great environmentalists. They're so stupid they don't even know they're stupid.

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Someone is going to get rich figuring out how to economically recycle them.

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I'll be hoping to identify who that is so I can invest in them.

We need a new rule. When you make a claim like this you must 100% comply with it.

Shanked, go do some research on Lithium and Cobalt mining. Focus on these key points and questions below.

- Energy requirements to mine Lithium including digging, transport and refining
- Where is this energy to obtain Lithium going to come from (no not solar and wind)?
- Where are Lithium deposits located in the world?
- What is the environmental impacts of mining Lithium?
- What will be impact of private land owners (i.e., Portugal) of government or corporate takeovers so they can access Lithium deposits?
- At what point with the USA become totally dependent on foreign supplies of raw material for batteries
- How much are you willing to pay for gas for your car and your electric bill before you start thinking that maybe O&G have some meaningful role in our world? Is $10/gal gas a good price for you?

Why is it a one or zero for folks like you - are you willing to walk or ride a bike and reduce your carbon footprint to zero?

There is no battery technology that will doesn't include mining vast amount of metals from the earth at a far more destructive rate than drilling for hydrocarbons.

revvie said:

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Grand goal. Current technology does not support. If and when tech can support 1000+ mile range and short recharge time(less than a couple of hours). Maybe it is time to invest in TAAS(Transportation as a Service) stocks. Drive to destination, turn car in at hotel and have fresh vehicle next morning to continue trip.

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Thats how teal cars end up hung in trees and abandoned at street corners.

OP will depressed when this doesn't pan out