And the text?Gary Johnson said:
Oh come on now. "The call" is one small piece of what this is about, surely you know this.
"Yeah he pressured Ukraine to investigate Biden but so what" is the line y'all should be taking.
And the President of Ukraine point blank saying "There was no push (pressure)".FireAg said:And the text?Gary Johnson said:
Oh come on now. "The call" is one small piece of what this is about, surely you know this.
"Yeah he pressured Ukraine to investigate Biden but so what" is the line y'all should be taking.
The transcript plus the text would be case-closed in a normal court...
Not all of the "facts" are out???Gary Johnson said:
I'm not sure what specific text you're referring to but I'll grant you this doesn't sound like a slam dunk case. BUT not all the facts are out. That's what due process and investigations are for.
There is no "due process" in what's taking place in the House.Gary Johnson said:
I'm not sure what specific text you're referring to but I'll grant you this doesn't sound like a slam dunk case. BUT not all the facts are out. That's what due process and investigations are for.
Do you not recognize how dangerously flippant your statement is?Gary Johnson said:
This is exactly what due process looks like under house rules. You can argue the charges are weak and unlikely to end with impeachment in the Senate. But those are separate questions.
Under the Clinton impeachment the president's council was allowed in the room to hear testimony and even cross examine. Both political parties were allowed to call witnesses. It was done in the open and not in secret.Gary Johnson said:
This is exactly what due process looks like under house rules. You can argue the charges are weak and unlikely to end with impeachment in the Senate. But those are separate questions.
He is in that stage now. Do you really not get that part?Gary Johnson said:
Cool. Trump will get that too if it gets to that stage.
are you that dumb? Clinton got that from day 1.Gary Johnson said:
Cool. Trump will get that too if it gets to that stage.
Gee, since the House didn't hold an impeachment inquiry with hearings after the release of the Starr Report, that's a bit disingenuous. They went straight to voting on articles of impeachment based on the Starr Report.Gary Johnson said:
Link where Clinton's counsel was allowed in judiciary committee impeachment inquiry meetings....?
Show me where in the house rules the subject's lawyer is allowed in committee meetings.
Gary Johnson said:
Link where Clinton's counsel was allowed in judiciary committee impeachment inquiry meetings....?
Show me where in the house rules the subject's lawyer is allowed in committee meetings.
https://www.congress.gov/congressional-report/105th-congress/house-report/795/1?s=1&r=60Quote:
President's Procedural Rights
Prior to the October 5, Committee meeting, some raised
concerns about ``procedural fairness'' and encouraged the
Committee to adopt rules, similar to those adopted by the
Committee in 1974, which would provide the President with
certain procedural rights. After voting on the Hyde resolution,
the Committee adopted, by voice vote, a number of protections
for the President. The President and his counsel shall be
invited to attend all executive session and open committee
hearings. The President's counsel may cross examine witnesses.
The President's counsel may make objections regarding the
pertinency of evidence. The President's counsel shall be
invited to suggest that the Committee receive additional
evidence. Lastly, the President or the President's counsel
shall be invited to respond to the evidence adduced by the
Committee at an appropriate time. The provisions will ensure
that the impeachment inquiry is fair to the President.
Issues Relating to Defining Standards for Impeachment
The minority and the White House have demanded that the
Committee needs to adopt standards of impeachment before it
proceeds. Standards, however, already exist. They are found in
Article Two, Section Four of the Constitution and include
``Treason, Bribery, or other high Crimes and Misdemeanors.''
Our founding fathers did not adopt these words without
debate or forethought. These words are not arbitrary or
capricious. They have meaning to which facts must be applied.
Indeed, the meaning of these words have been applied in the
House of Representatives numerous times, four of which occurred
in the past 25 years. Impeachment precedents, like court
precedents, can be helpful to the Committee as it proceeds and
will help inform the judgment of all Members of the House. It
would be presumptuous of this Committee to state as fact the
manner in which all Members should judge the evidence. All
Members, after a consideration of the facts and the law of
impeachment, must exercise their constitutional responsibility
as they deem appropriate.
It was all open to members of both parties. Some was public and some was private. But the president's lawyers were welcome for all of it. You lost this argument bud.Gary Johnson said:
Key there is "open meetings" I'll plead ignorance on what "executive" meetings are.
That's just wrong. The only time Clinton didn't have attorneys present was when he testified before the grand jury in the Paula Jones civil case. No one testifying before a grand jury has their lawyer present nor able to cross-examine.Gary Johnson said:
We're taking about precedent and due process right? Both got to the committee iniquiry stage.
Clinton's counsel was called to testify but they didn't get to "sit in" on or "cross examine" in other meetings.
https://www.congress.gov/105/crpt/hrpt830/CRPT-105hrpt830.pdf#page=137
I don't think so with Clinton. Closed door would just mean, not public. His council was still invited to attend. Hawg or some other legal nerd would be able to confirm though.Gary Johnson said:
Not entirely clear but I'll concede it appears you may be right.
Closed-door meetings also occurred during the Clinton and Nixon investigations correct? With no counsel present.
https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2019/10/23/who-william-taylor-impeachment-star-witness-longtime-relationship-burisma-backed-think-tank/Quote:
Acting U.S. Ambassador to Ukraine Bill Taylor, who provided key testimony to the Democrats' controversial impeachment inquiry yesterday, has evidenced a close relationship with the Atlantic Council think tank, even writing Ukraine policy pieces with the organization's director and analysis articles published by the Council.
The Atlantic Council is funded by and works in partnership with Burisma, the natural gas company at the center of allegations regarding Joe Biden and his son, Hunter Biden.
In addition to a direct relationship with the Atlantic Council, Taylor for the last nine years also served as a senior adviser to the U.S.-Ukraine Business Council (USUBC), which has co-hosted events with the Atlantic Council and has participated in events co-hosted jointly by the Atlantic Council and Burisma.
Another senior adviser to the USUBC is David J. Kramer, a long-time adviser to late Senator John McCain. Kramer played a central role in disseminating the anti-Trump dossier to the news media and Obama administration. Taylor participated in events and initiatives organized by Kramer.
The links may be particularly instructive after Breitbart News reported that itinerary for a trip to Ukraine in August organized by the Burisma-funded Atlantic Council for ten Congressional aides reveals that a staffer on Rep. Adam Schiff's House Permanent Select Committee on Intelligence held a meeting during the trip with Taylor. The pre-planned trip took place after the so-called whistleblower officially filed his August 12 complaint and reportedly after a Schiff aide was contacted by the so-called whistleblower.
Rapier108 said:https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2019/10/23/who-william-taylor-impeachment-star-witness-longtime-relationship-burisma-backed-think-tank/Quote:
Acting U.S. Ambassador to Ukraine Bill Taylor, who provided key testimony to the Democrats' controversial impeachment inquiry yesterday, has evidenced a close relationship with the Atlantic Council think tank, even writing Ukraine policy pieces with the organization's director and analysis articles published by the Council.
The Atlantic Council is funded by and works in partnership with Burisma, the natural gas company at the center of allegations regarding Joe Biden and his son, Hunter Biden.
In addition to a direct relationship with the Atlantic Council, Taylor for the last nine years also served as a senior adviser to the U.S.-Ukraine Business Council (USUBC), which has co-hosted events with the Atlantic Council and has participated in events co-hosted jointly by the Atlantic Council and Burisma.
Another senior adviser to the USUBC is David J. Kramer, a long-time adviser to late Senator John McCain. Kramer played a central role in disseminating the anti-Trump dossier to the news media and Obama administration. Taylor participated in events and initiatives organized by Kramer.
The links may be particularly instructive after Breitbart News reported that itinerary for a trip to Ukraine in August organized by the Burisma-funded Atlantic Council for ten Congressional aides reveals that a staffer on Rep. Adam Schiff's House Permanent Select Committee on Intelligence held a meeting during the trip with Taylor. The pre-planned trip took place after the so-called whistleblower officially filed his August 12 complaint and reportedly after a Schiff aide was contacted by the so-called whistleblower.
The Atlantic Council also receives a large amount of funding from Soros.
At some point, I pray that all Americans will wake up to the fact that for over a century now, we have all been nothing but pawns of the elite on both sides of the aisle...Rapier108 said:https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2019/10/23/who-william-taylor-impeachment-star-witness-longtime-relationship-burisma-backed-think-tank/Quote:
Acting U.S. Ambassador to Ukraine Bill Taylor, who provided key testimony to the Democrats' controversial impeachment inquiry yesterday, has evidenced a close relationship with the Atlantic Council think tank, even writing Ukraine policy pieces with the organization's director and analysis articles published by the Council.
The Atlantic Council is funded by and works in partnership with Burisma, the natural gas company at the center of allegations regarding Joe Biden and his son, Hunter Biden.
In addition to a direct relationship with the Atlantic Council, Taylor for the last nine years also served as a senior adviser to the U.S.-Ukraine Business Council (USUBC), which has co-hosted events with the Atlantic Council and has participated in events co-hosted jointly by the Atlantic Council and Burisma.
Another senior adviser to the USUBC is David J. Kramer, a long-time adviser to late Senator John McCain. Kramer played a central role in disseminating the anti-Trump dossier to the news media and Obama administration. Taylor participated in events and initiatives organized by Kramer.
The links may be particularly instructive after Breitbart News reported that itinerary for a trip to Ukraine in August organized by the Burisma-funded Atlantic Council for ten Congressional aides reveals that a staffer on Rep. Adam Schiff's House Permanent Select Committee on Intelligence held a meeting during the trip with Taylor. The pre-planned trip took place after the so-called whistleblower officially filed his August 12 complaint and reportedly after a Schiff aide was contacted by the so-called whistleblower.
The Atlantic Council also receives a large amount of funding from Soros.
Preferable to the opposite.Gary Johnson said:
Spotted Ag spotted in the wild
