Dead cat bounce.

Just like Enron!

Dang. It's only up 91% over 30 days. Obviously the sky has fallen

Quote:

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It's only up 91% over 30 days

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The first clue that it's a scam.

It may be overvalued. I don't know. It's been going up for years though. It's being used more and more and becoming more widely accepted by the market at large. Time will tell. But the Bears have been crying wolf for at least three years now

As a business owner, you couldn't buy anything from me using "bitcoins" today... i don't know a single person that accepts it unless they've severely inflated their pricing to do so.

Tom Doniphon said:

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Quote:

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It's only up 91% over 30 days

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The first clue that it's a scam.

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Not necessarily. Cryptocurrency is a new thing. It's searching for its real value.

Tom Doniphon said:

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As a business owner, you couldn't buy anything from me using "bitcoins" today... i don't know a single person that accepts it unless they've severely inflated their pricing to do so.

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As a business owner you could buy anything you want from me with bitcoin. I know lots of people that accept it and many who've discounted their pricing to attract bitcoiners (and other crypto enthusiasts).

Weird. It's like what you said but opposite.

Gymbo said:

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It may be overvalued. I don't know. It's been going up for years though. It's being used more and more and becoming more widely accepted by the market at large. Time will tell. But the Bears have been crying wolf for at least three years now

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Where is it accepted? I've honestly never seen it accepted anywhere.

If you want a currency, it can't be so volatile. As a currency, it is as useless as the bolivar.

Crypto currency probably has a place in the future, but it can't be so volatile to be used as a currency.

Tom Doniphon said:

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As a business owner, you couldn't buy anything from me using "bitcoins" today... i don't know a single person that accepts it unless they've severely inflated their pricing to do so.

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I would sell you my truck tomorrow for a few bitcoins

Funny... i sell trucks and wouldn't accept them.

To each his own.

Purple Parrot said:

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SpreadsheetAg said:

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How is this helpful or superior to current currency or fiat money?

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BTC is a store of value. It's worth comes from its scarcity. Fiat money isn't backed by anything and can be printed

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Do you see BC as a viable long-term resource or flash in the pan. At what point would you consider getting out of it. Honest questions, I'm curious.

1876er said:

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Gymbo said:

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It may be overvalued. I don't know. It's been going up for years though. It's being used more and more and becoming more widely accepted by the market at large. Time will tell. But the Bears have been crying wolf for at least three years now

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Where is it accepted? I've honestly never seen it accepted anywhere.

If you want a currency, it can't be so volatile. As a currency, it is as useless as the bolivar.

Crypto currency probably has a place in the future, but it can't be so volatile to be used as a currency.

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This is what confuses me. But I am about a illiterate financially as any person on this forum (I am SERIOUS).

The issue with volatility is that you can't print prices because a company is converting everything to USD. If they say something costs 1 BTC and then over 2 hours 1 BTC loses 40% of its value compared to USD then that's a major problem.

What makes a currency viable is that the USD moves slow enough that if I walk into a 7/11 and see a soda costs 2 bucks I agree with the price, pay and move on with my life. If it said .000000076 BTC I would need to check the current value and then pay a huge fee that's more expensive than the coke itself.

What makes currency valuable is the utility and common agreed upon value to facilitate the trade of goods and services. Some people have a hard time with fiat because it requires belief in the system. It's annoying and frustrating at times, but better alternative than the opposite. I think of it like traffic laws. I get so pissed that I have to stop at a traffic light where there aren't any cars passing through the intersection at 2 AM, but I'm glad that for the most part, most people follow the laws and buy into them. It creates a safe environment for all of us to move about during our days.

Tom Doniphon said:

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Funny... i sell trucks and wouldn't accept them.

To each his own.

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Isn't the free market grand? Thanks Bitcoin.

Besides if it's not a lambo, you're prolly not getting paid in crypto for it.

Rustys-Beef-o-Reeno said:

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I would sell you my truck tomorrow for a few bitcoins

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No. You would sell your truck in USDs and use bitcoins as a proxy for USDs.

1876er said:

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Rustys-Beef-o-Reeno said:

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I would sell you my truck tomorrow for a few bitcoins

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No. You would sell your truck in USDs and use bitcoins as a proxy for USDs.

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This is asinine. Maybe he wants to keep it in bitcoin like overstock has done with much of their crypto. Maybe he wants to convert it to yen or maybe ripple.

I sold some old furniture using usd and then converted it to btc using usd as a proxy for btc. It's just a matter of perspective.

Synopsis said:

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Purple Parrot said:

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SpreadsheetAg said:

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How is this helpful or superior to current currency or fiat money?

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BTC is a store of value. It's worth comes from its scarcity. Fiat money isn't backed by anything and can be printed

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Do you see BC as a viable long-term resource or flash in the pan. At what point would you consider getting out of it. Honest questions, I'm curious.

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I do think cryptcurrency will have long term value. Whether it's BTC or some other one is anyone's guess. BTC has the first to market advantage.

I consider my BTC investments to be sunk costs in that I have already forgotten about the money. I probably wouldn't get out unless I really needed the money.

Gymbo said:

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1876er said:

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Rustys-Beef-o-Reeno said:

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I would sell you my truck tomorrow for a few bitcoins

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No. You would sell your truck in USDs and use bitcoins as a proxy for USDs.

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This is asinine. Maybe he wants to keep it in bitcoin like overstock has done with much of their crypto. Maybe he wants to convert it to yen or maybe ripple.

I sold some old furniture using usd and then converted it to btc using usd as a proxy for btc. It's just a matter of perspective.

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Ok. Without checking the current exchange rate, would you take 0.3 bitcoin for your truck?

No. My truck is worth more than that.

But again, this is just a matter of perspective. When I'm in a foreign country I still think of what I'm spending in usd even though I'm using their currency. Currencies and crypto currencies value constantly fluctuate in relation to each other. There is an entire market for currency traders.

Gymbo said:

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No. My truck is worth more than that.

But again, this is just a matter of perspective. When I'm in a foreign country I still think of what I'm spending in usd even though I'm using their currency. Currencies and crypto currencies value constantly fluctuate in relation to each other. There is an entire market for currency traders.

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What is it worth in bitcoin? And if I come back in a week will you still sell it for that?

The comments on this thread are hardcore evidence that most Aggies are light years ahead of me in how they understand all of this works. I am no idiot, but a lot of this is very confusing to me (admits his own incompetence).

1876er said:

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Gymbo said:

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No. My truck is worth more than that.

But again, this is just a matter of perspective. When I'm in a foreign country I still think of what I'm spending in usd even though I'm using their currency. Currencies and crypto currencies value constantly fluctuate in relation to each other. There is an entire market for currency traders.

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What is it worth in bitcoin? And if I come back in a week will you still sell it for that?

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It's effectively a floating currency in this situation so it depends on the exchange rate at the time. No different than if I wanted to buy or sell my truck for Canadian dollars. No different than if I wanted to trade my truck for apple stock.

What point do you think you are making?

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What point do you think you are making?

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1. That it is too volatile to be used as a currency.
2. It isn't really a replacement for the USD because it is essentially tied to the dollar (or Euro, GBP, or CHF) to give it any value.

1876er said:

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Quote:

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What point do you think you are making?

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1. That it is too volatile to be used as a currency.
2. It isn't really a replacement for the USD because it is essentially tied to the dollar (or Euro, GBP, or CHF) to give it any value.

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I'm fine if you don't consider it a currency. It is volatile. Lots of currencies are volatile though. Your view is too US-centric. It provides huge value to countries with weak failing currencies like Argentina and it provides huge value for people moving their wealth outside traditional banking like Chinese trying to leave the country with their money.

I doubt it replaces usd though I think it's quite obvious cryptocurrencies will see more and more use. It can be a powerful medium of exchange and nothing necessitates you exchange it for govt fiat. Plenty of transaction occur using crypto and stay in crypto. More are happening everyday. It's a fluid situation but nobody expects it to replace the usd at least anytime soon so I guess you nailed that straw man.

It's really not all that complicated.

In essence, bitcoin is one half of what it takes to encrypt something; ie, there's an alogorithim that takes a known input like say "jamaggie06 has 10 bitcoin" and converts it into a large amount of unique gibberish, just like encryption would. However, unlike encryption, the creation of the gibberish is one way; there is no key to convert the gibberish back into something meaningful. This is where the "propf of work" comes from. Instead of trying to guess the encryption key, millions of computers run through millions of iterations of gibberish produced by transactions and attempt to verify that the unique gibberish produced matches previously created gibberish (the blockchain ledger)

So, at one point in time, for example, if I bought bitcoin from someone, the unique blockchain gibberish outut was generated but the original non-gibberish version included the statements "jamaggie06 has 10 bitcoin. UserX has 5 bitcoin"

So, any attempt to now claim jamaggie06 has 5 bitcoin and userX has 10 bitcoin requires running that statement through the gibberish generating function and comparing the output to the already existing blockchain gibberish. If jamaggie06 realy has 10 bitcoin, then the two pieces of gibberish will not match and the transaction is not approved. If jamaggie06 really only had 5 bitcoin then the gibberish generated by the algorithim will match and the transaction can be approved.

Thats kind of the quick and dirty explanation as best as I understand it.

Its the same principle good companies use for password security; they dont store your password, they store the gibberish generated by a one way algorithim. Then, when you enter your password on the website, it is run through the algorithim and the out put gibberish is compared against the stored gibberish. If the two are the same, your password is accepted. If they are not, the attempted password entry is rejected.

Don't worry, it is truly confusing.

No one has ever had honest discussions on value before. Especially perceived value.

Then on top of that most people don't understand how data is transferred, stored, verified, kept secure, or what encryption entails. Some people even think nobody deserves privacy.

Regardless, everyone's got different values to emphasize and cryptocurrency gives that person an option to try something different.

Decide what's important for yourself

Better yet...

If you sell me a pickup for 1 BTC now... will you still be happy after the transaction finally goes through?

The problem with the blockchain is that it's the tally-stick system where anyone verifying transactions has to carry around every tally-stick that has ever existed. That's impractical.

Banks will adopt the blockchain, but in a different manner. When a specific tally-stick returns to the issuing bank the whole chain can be destroyed. One won't need the history of all previous transactions ever completed to verify... simply using transactions related to that blockchain will be necessary.

It does require a central authority, but every currency does. The only way around that is to trade goods & services for goods & services straight up in an agreement. Hell. You can't even use time as a currency. An hour of my time and an hour of yours are not worth the same.

Gymbo said:

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1876er said:

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Quote:

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What point do you think you are making?

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1. That it is too volatile to be used as a currency.
2. It isn't really a replacement for the USD because it is essentially tied to the dollar (or Euro, GBP, or CHF) to give it any value.

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I'm fine if you don't consider it a currency. It is volatile. Lots of currencies are volatile though. Your view is too US-centric. It provides huge value to countries with weak failing currencies like Argentina and it provides huge value for people moving their wealth outside traditional banking like Chinese trying to leave the country with their money.

I doubt it replaces usd though I think it's quite obvious cryptocurrencies will see more and more use. It can be a powerful medium of exchange and nothing necessitates you exchange it for govt fiat. Plenty of transaction occur using crypto and stay in crypto. More are happening everyday. It's a fluid situation but nobody expects it to replace the usd at least anytime soon so I guess you nailed that straw man.

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I think blockchain could be a viable currency one day. But as long as investors and speculators are driving the price up and down, its volatility makes it useless as a currency.

1876er said:

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Gymbo said:

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1876er said:

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Quote:

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What point do you think you are making?

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1. That it is too volatile to be used as a currency.
2. It isn't really a replacement for the USD because it is essentially tied to the dollar (or Euro, GBP, or CHF) to give it any value.

---

I'm fine if you don't consider it a currency. It is volatile. Lots of currencies are volatile though. Your view is too US-centric. It provides huge value to countries with weak failing currencies like Argentina and it provides huge value for people moving their wealth outside traditional banking like Chinese trying to leave the country with their money.

I doubt it replaces usd though I think it's quite obvious cryptocurrencies will see more and more use. It can be a powerful medium of exchange and nothing necessitates you exchange it for govt fiat. Plenty of transaction occur using crypto and stay in crypto. More are happening everyday. It's a fluid situation but nobody expects it to replace the usd at least anytime soon so I guess you nailed that straw man.

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I think blockchain could be a viable currency one day. But as long as investors and speculators are driving the price up and down, its volatility makes it useless as a currency.

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Blockchain is a technology, not a currency

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South Korea's government announced tougher measures to crack down on cryptocurrency trading in the country and said it is considering shutting down the nation's bitcoin exchanges, stepping up its attempts to curb widespread investor speculation fueling the market.

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uh oh!!!!

SK is the 3rd largest block of traders!

Creating a good buy opportunity. I find it highly doubtful they shut down exchanges