If a cure were invented for AIDS ...

4,153 Views | 144 Replies | Last: 20 yr ago by ramblin_ag02
SWOSU
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... what would be the effect on the behavior of those who are at most risk?

Would the frequency of promiscuous gay sex increase? Would the use of needle-introduced drugs increase?

This is a legitimate discussion for ALL personal activities that carry potentially harmful consequences.

If a cure were developed for lung cancer, would tobacco be taken off the hit list of bad actors and the tobacco companies once again become the largest in the world? Would the states then be required to return the hideously large judgements against tobacco to them?
b.blauser
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No change if any. If someone is already living the lifestyle, they're not curbing their activity now. Maybe less protected activity?
Sink Maggots
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quote:
Would the frequency of promiscuous gay sex increase?
Oh yeah I forgot AIDS is a gays disease???
o3
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All that matters is lives would be saved. Lets hope we find a cure/vaccine soon.



"There are 10 kinds of people in this world: those who understand binary and those who don't."
NavajoJim
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No question AIDS is no longer just a gay disease (though it once clearly was, and still is if we are talking about relative proportions in the U.S. only). The stats answer the question better than argument. AIDS is on the rise now that good treatments are available, though expensive. Natural human phenomenon. Fear of a risky behavior goes down, avoidance of a risky behavior goes with it.
ro828
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In a world where thousands upon thousands of teenagers actually believe that Mountain Dew is a contraceptive (they think that if the boy drinks it before sex it will immediately kill his sperm cells) facts have very little value. People get pregnant and/or get vd for one main reason- magical thinking. It can't happen to them.
AgGermany
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With an AIDS cure...

Would the frequency of promiscuous gay sex increase?

YES, and it would be used to recruit and make promiscuous gay sex "normal" experimentation that is "safe".

If you want to know how sick society will get from this you need look no further than the Sodomite society as recorded in scripture.

I hope no cure for AIDS will be found and that it will increse in promiscious circles for the good of the people who contract AIDS. When confronted with death some may turn and seek God.
DamnGood'88
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Wow.
Michael Irving&Bob Davies
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So basically, AgGermany is ok with thousands (millions?) of children dying of AIDS as long as a few f@gs suffer? Perhaps you could devote your life to science, Germany, and work on creating a lethal disease that is contracted any time a penis enters an anus. Be sure and try to make it a very quick death, though, because AIDS tends to drg out for years and costs a lot of money.
Hedwigkin
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SWOSU,

You should read a little on health belief models. The HBM is a theoretical framework that is used by public health officials in preventative education. The basic model has stages:

quote:


Perceived Susceptibility - Each individual has his/her own perception of the likelihood of experiencing a condition that would adversely affect one's health. Individuals vary widely in their perception of susceptibility to a disease or condition. Those at low end of the extreme deny the possibility of contracting an adverse condition. Individuals in a moderate category admit to a statistical possibility of disease susceptibility. Those individuals at the high extreme of susceptibility feel there is real danger that they will experience an adverse condition or contract a given disease.

Perceived Seriousness - refers to the beliefs a person holds concerning the effects a given disease or condition would have on one's state of affairs. These effects can be considered from the point of view of the difficulties that a disease would create. For instance, pain and discomfort, loss of work time, financial burdens, difficulties with family, relationships, and susceptibility to future conditions. It is important to include these emotional and financial burdens when considering the seriousness of a disease or condition.

Perceived Benefits of Taking Action - taking action toward the prevention of disease or toward dealing with an illness is the next step to expect after an individual has accepted the susceptibility o f a disease and recognized it is serious. The direction of action that a person chooses will be influenced by the beliefs regarding the action.

Barriers to Taking Action - However, action may not take place, even though an individual may believe that the benefits to taking action are effective. This may be due to barriers. Barriers relate to the characteristics of a treatment or preventive measure may be inconvenient, expensive, unpleasant, painful or upsetting. These characteristics may lead a person away from taking the desired action.

Cues to Action - an individual's perception of the levels of susceptibility and seriousness provide the force to act. Benefits (minus barriers) provide the path of action. However, it may require a 'cue to action' for the desired behavior to occur. These cues may be internal or external.


Source

Using the key components of this framework, if a cure for AIDs was found, the perceived susceptibility and seriousness would dramatically decline, while the perceived benefits of taking action [sexual gratification] would increase. This could be applied to homosexuals as well as heterosexuals. But, then what prevents promiscuous sex? If it is fears if STIs (also including AIDs), then a cure for AIDs would not necessarily lower the barriers for risky behaviour.

As far as drug use, I would hypothosize that the percieved benefits of a high generally outweigh the percieved risk of infection and the percieved risk to ones future. Drug use can impede one's future, and AIDs is but one of many risk. Therefore, I would think drug use would not statistically change due to an AIDs cure, ceteris paribus.


Smoking is a bit different. If a cure for lung cancer was found, then smoking would probably increase. However, the side effects (asthma, burning eyes, odor) would still persist and it would probably continue to be a stigmatized action.
Doubtful
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quote:
I hope no cure for AIDS will be found and that it will increse in promiscious circles for the good of the people who contract AIDS.


DUDE!
Hootie
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AgGermany: You should be ashamed of yourself. It's Christians like you that make Christianity look bad.
Hedwigkin
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AgGermany,

You do know there are innocent AIDs victims right? Babies?

How about the culture on the Texas border? There is a growing health problem on the Texas border where married men commit adultry in Mexico where there is a high prevalence of AIDs/STIs, and then transmit the diseases back to unknowing wives.

AgFormerlyInIrving
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As harsh as AgInGermany's sentiments sound...I happen to agree. I have a brother who contracted HIV from living what the Bible defines as a sinful lifestyle.

I'm hoping that the sad, painful health problems that he will have will humble him and bring him back to God. You can think I'm a bigot for valuing his soul more than his physical well being, but I love my brother enough to hope he spends eternity in Heaven.

What a hate-monger I am!!!
AgFormerlyInIrving
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And by the way...it is horrific that people can be so selfish as to engage in activities that cause their children to contract HIV. To think that AgInGermany wishes harm upon the innocent indicates you haven't read many of his posts.
o3
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quote:
I'm hoping that the sad, painful health problems that he will have will humble him and bring him back to God.
Why not put a gun to his head and humble him into submission?



"There are 10 kinds of people in this world: those who understand binary and those who don't."
AgFormerlyInIrving
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Because my putting a gun to his head would not be his fault. Living a promiscuous gay lifestyle was his CHOICE. Please!

[This message has been edited by AgInIrving (edited 11/14/2005 10:03a).]
o3
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quote:
Because my putting a gun to his head would not be his fault. Living a promiscuous gay lifestyle was his CHOICE. Please!
Im saying put a gun to his head because of the choice he made. Youre a loving brother, aren't you? Force him to turn back to God, then make the reunion happen.



"There are 10 kinds of people in this world: those who understand binary and those who don't."
disconnected
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quote:
I hope no cure for AIDS will be found and that it will increse in promiscious circles for the good of the people who contract AIDS.


In other words, "I hope an incurable disease wipes out everyone who doesn't share my religious beliefs". Dude, you are awesome! Wanna work on the next Nazi-ish scheme with me?
AgFormerlyInIrving
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o3 - I know you're just trying to agitate, but I'll bite anyway. No one is talking about Forcing someone to love God. That can't be done. Suffering consequences from sinful actions is a pretty far stretch to having someone Force you to obey.
o3
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quote:
o3 - I know you're just trying to agitate
I'm sorry you feel this way. I just find AgGermany's post and yours quite revolting.



"There are 10 kinds of people in this world: those who understand binary and those who don't."
Satan Aggie
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Legalizing gay marriage would reduce promiscuity and thus reduce the spread of AIDS through the gay community.

If that doesn't work, maybe we could go another direction and look through Marge Schott's personal diary and come up with some good ideas on what to do.
DamnGood'88
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So, a hypothetical here - Atalhualpa, last king of the Incas, converted to Christianity (under duress) right before Pizarro had him garotted to death.

Good move by Pizarro?

Atalhualpa would get to go to heaven, I suppose. He had been living a very sinful, pagan lifestyle prior to his conversion/execution. Pizarro had the good form to insure that there would be no backsliding after the conversion.

If it's for the greater good (eternity!), why not follow Pizarro's lead?
AgFormerlyInIrving
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You are all making a very poor assumption - that I believe that forcing someone to 'accept' Christianity saves. We have free will to choose. My brother very well may die from his disease without having come back to God (which would be a tragedy beyond words). Hopefully though, as we all tend to be much more humble in times of desire need, he'll get past his pride and repent.

He has asked my family - "don't you want me to be happy on Earth even if I end up in Hell?" What kind of family would we be if we told him "sure...enjoy your 60 years on this Earth...and we won't care if you spend eternity in hell." Wouldn't that be infinitely more hateful?

Its obvious though that many of you don't believe in Christianity and therefore our way of thinking is so foreign that you can't fathom our hope for eternal life.

But at least try to see it from that point of view.
ramblin_ag02
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AginIrving,

Don't even try to make this a Christian v. non-Christian issue. I am a born-again Christian and I was as appalled by what you and AgGermany said as any of them.

No major denomination of Christianity would approve of your sentiments, and I can't see how you would get that message out of the Bible. What part of loving your fellow man (even your enemy) makes you hope they get AIDS?

To say such a thing is callous and despicable, especially regarding the large number of people who have AIDS and have lived no more sinful a life than you or me.
AgFormerlyInIrving
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quote:
No major denomination

I don't subscribe to a denomination. I follow only the Bible.

By the way, did David losing his son not help turn him back to God?

And I only hope that someone gets HIV if that is the only way that will turn them to God. I did hope that my brother would get it - only if it humbles him and brings him back to God. If you claim to be a Christian and don't wish for others to submit to God's will and choose life over death...then what demonination do you claim?

If you cannot see the greater importance on eternal life than on the temporal, then there is no point in my debating with you.

(And regarding they are no more sinful than you and I - on many levels I agree. Sin is sin (homosexuality, fornication, lying, drunkeness - all are sin and separate us from God). However, promiscuity - hetero or homo - is one of those sins that can also carry with it physical consequences. If lying caused AIDS, we'd have the same conversation about liars)

[This message has been edited by AgInIrving (edited 11/14/2005 11:29a).]
ramblin_ag02
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quote:

By the way, did David losing his son not help turn him back to God?


No, it didn't. David had already turned back to God before he was told his son would die. He was confronted with his sin and prostrated himself to God, all before God pronounced judgement on him.

quote:
there is no point in my debating with you.

I agree with you here. If you can honestly read through the entire Bible, and then wish ill upon your own brother your fruits speak for themselves.

The thief was saved on the cross before death, because he was laid low before God. Even knowing this, I would not have pounded the nails into his arms nor would I approve of any who did.
AgFormerlyInIrving
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How did I nail my brother on the cross?

His actions created his own problem.

It amazes me that you have no concept of the value of eternal life. That is what infuriates me.
Hedwigkin
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There are other ways to get someone to God other than the threat of a slow, painful death. To wish him well physically and spiritually are non-contradictory feelings. And what if he doesn't repent? You haven't helped him at all? It seems as though this is your coping method.


quote:
I did hope that my brother would get it


This is the most horrible thing I have ever read on TexAgs. Did you tell him this? The betrayel that his heart must feel when his family wishes him harm because they do not accept him.
ramblin_ag02
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quote:
It amazes me that you have no concept of the value of eternal life. That is what infuriates me.


What infuriates me is that you assume you have gained eternal life, and you want the wrath of God to force others to step into line.

God has stayed His due judgement against me, and therefore I refuse to call for His terrible judgement against anyone else. The Apostles of Christ and Christ Himself spread the message through love and self-sacrifice, not ill-wishing and fear-mongering. That is the example you should follow.
AgFormerlyInIrving
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quote:
because they do not accept him.


This is where you just do not get it. It has nothing to do with ME accepting him. I haven't made the 'rules.' It has to do with God accepting him. My hoping (that if getting HIV would be the only thing to humble him - that he'd get HIV) did not give him HIV. His defying Godly principles gave him HIV.
saajan
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AgInIrving/AgGermany: your posts are the most revolting spew I've ever read on this board, and I thought that would take a lot.

I don't classify you as Christians, because I believe that religion holds more class and dignity than condone a belief that wants to spread a disease so that more people can turn to your God.

Sickening.
AgFormerlyInIrving
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The disease won't spread if people behave as they should. Your philosophy is that the disease is cured and people will continue to sin-it-up with no consequences (other than that minor thing called eternal damnation). My philosphy is that eternal life is much more imporant. Appauling, I know.

If it doesn't spread because people stop illicit sexual activity, than that is even better!

[This message has been edited by AgInIrving (edited 11/14/2005 11:50a).]
Hedwigkin
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quote:
It has nothing to do with ME accepting him.


Do you or do you not accept his lifestyle? If you do, then you would not wish him to get AIDs.

And if he does not believe in God, then it has EVERYTHING to do with you accepting him.

While I am sickened by your coping method, I must acknowledge it as such. Perhaps you won't regret your method once he passes. May God have mercy on YOUR soul.
AgFormerlyInIrving
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Explain your last post Hed. Why is accepting his lifestyle the right thing to do when God has not?

(And it is not a coping method. I thought about him getting HIV well before he got it...and years after knowing he was living a homosexual lifestyle.)

By the way...read Matthew 5:30 and Matthew 18:8. Spiritual is much more important that physical.

[This message has been edited by AgInIrving (edited 11/14/2005 12:02p).]
 
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