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Up to 1,000 teenage boys have been separated from their parents and thrown out of their communities by a polygamous sect to make more young women available for older men, Utah officials claim.

Many of these "Lost Boys," some as young as 13, have simply been dumped on the side of the road in Arizona and Utah, by the leaders of the Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (FLDS), and told they will never see their families again or go to heaven.

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http://www.guardian.co.uk/international/story/0,3604,1505995,00.html

This story, to me, is an example of what can happen when one's church is governed by "revelation" rather than by scripture.

On a political note, I think the parents who abandoned these boys should be jailed. They cannot use their religion as a defense for child abandonment.

Religion has been used throughout history as a defense. As a society we must recognize this or suffer the consequences.

More:

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What is the FLDS?

The Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints split off from the Mormon church in 1890, when the mainstream faith disavowed polygamy.

The sect has communes in Utah, Arizona, Texas and Canada. It is the biggest polygamous group in the US.

What does the FLDS believe?

Polygamy allows a higher birth rate, increasing the "righteous" population. No man can go to heaven if he has less than three wives. The sect believes black people are inferior, the offspring of Cain. It teaches that America was first colonised by a lost tribe of Israelites and was visited by Jesus after his resurrection.

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Muster ag, what consequences?

Thanks for the update muster ag!

And if what the utah officials claim is true then a "religion" defense would have no basis here as these people would be guilty of child abandonment. I am not sure where muster ag lives but in the United States we do not allow religious belief to be a way out for child abandonment. Maybe they do where muster ag is and that is why he made that ridiculous comment.

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This story, to me, is an example of what can happen when one's church is governed by "revelation" rather than by scripture.

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Is this what you are resorting to now to try to throw mud on the LDS church? Some wierd fringe group that would throw out their own children? Pretty sad--our discussions were getting good there for a minute. Of course they should be jailed! All religious entities are required to obey the law.

BTW, these guys have no right to call themselves "Fundamentalist Mormons", but that is an issue between them and myself, one I would love to resolve if I ever met one of those creeps.

Not trying to throw mud at all. I am trying to make a serious point.

Religion can be a powerful thing. Witness the fanatics who travel from Saudi Arabia to Iraq in order to blow themselves up.

Men of True faith must therefore guard against misuse of religion.

One important safeguard against misuse of Christianity is the Bible. The principles laid out in the Bible are tried and true. This is not the place for a discussion of all those principles, but if one lives his life by them, he will be a force for good in this world.

When a faith "adds on" to the Bible with additional supposed revelation, that safeguard is weakened, and dangererous things can happen. People can believe, for example, that they should abandon their boys.

Did you read how that one boy said he tried to go back to his mother, but he "was dead to her"?

I am sure the FLDS church believe in their hearts that they are led by the Holy Spirit. They are not. They have been fooled, deceived by an evil spirit. They have allowed perceived revelation to trump reason.

There is evil at work in the FLDS sect. One lesson to be drawn from their mistakes is the importance of the Bible.

(There are of course other ways to abuse religion, but that is outside the scope of this discussion.)

[This message has been edited by Modano (edited 6/15/2005 7:23a).]

Okay, I am fine with that take I suppose. I don't see how the Bible alone safeguards wierdos though. There are encyclopedias full of disturbed and evil sects that take all of their doctrine from the Bible alone.

Modano,

"Reason" tells us that there are more crazy people who use the Bible as the sole source of God’s word than crazy people that associate themselves with the Mormons. You see, "reason" when applied by some Bible believers leaves them using snakes and such as their means of worship. Please reveal you religion so that we may investigate whether there are any people associated with your religion or beliefs that “reason” tells us would be crazy.

i saw a piece on the news last night about this. quite sad. i recommend krakauer's book "under the banner of heaven." fascinating and terrifying.

Everytime I see Mormon it's like I automatically miss that second m for some reason.

De Jili Nada, I fear that once again you have missed my message.

I note that any religion can be abused, and there are many protections which should be in place to prevent such abuse.

Sticking to the Bible is the most important protection. There are others.

One other important protection is a sound and Biblically based leadership. The kooks to whom you allude would lack such leadership.

Even faiths with well intentioned leaders, though, can be misled when they discard the protection of inspired scripture and begin to follow pure spiritual revelation.

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Even faiths with well intentioned leaders, though, can be misled when they discard the protection of inspired scripture and begin to follow pure spiritual revelation.

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How do you tell the difference between legitimate spiritual revelation and people making things up?

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How do you tell the difference between legitimate spiritual revelation and people making things up?

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Pretty simple, really. If it is revelation by a Church that Jesus promised would be the one true Church, then it's real.

To be the one true Church, it needs to be the one that Jesus founded through Peter. I only know of one church that fits this description, and it ain't the Mormons.....

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I only know of one church that fits this description

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funny, I feel the same way, and it ain't the catholics!

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funny, I feel the same way, and it ain't the catholics!

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Interesting - you're Jewish, then? That can be the only verifiable answer.

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How do you tell the difference between legitimate spiritual revelation and people making things up?

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1) You rely on the Bible and test what is claimed against God's Word

2) You pray about it and seek the guidance of the Holy Spirit

3) You employ reason - you use the mind which God gave to you - in your analysis.

If you do all these things, you will have the best chance to know whether it is made up. In the case of the RLDS faith, the supposed revelation will fail the three part test.

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1) You rely on the Bible and test what is claimed against God's Word

2) You pray about it and seek the guidance of the Holy Spirit

3) You employ reason - you use the mind which God gave to you - in your analysis.

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And when you do this, you are your own pope. Which is fine if that's what you want.

By the same philosophy, you can be your own doctor as well. Except being your own doctor is a lot less dangerous.

77,

You are the only moron here. Go take your hit a run tactics to another board.

AiTx,

Responses to your comments would take about 3 weeks of education on Mormons. Go do some research on the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints and then come back for a discussion. Your knowledge is so far below the average poster on this topic it is hardly worth the time to have a discussion with you.

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Your knowledge is so far below the average poster on this topic it is hardly worth the time to have a discussion with you.

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You have no idea .... I know all about the mormon "church".

AiTx,

Your posts tell a different story.

Yes, the "church" I attend each sunday really isn't a "church" at all, alas the "church" may have bricks and mortar and worshippers inside, but we all know the "church" doesn't really count as a "church" unless we can get official acknowledgement by everyone on the Texags religious forum.

Please!

We have a claim to the authority of Peter, whether or not you believe the account of the restoration of the Priesthood to be true. And we don't have to rely on unsubstantiated tradition to make the link.

I never called you a "moron". I just said whenever I see mormon I just can't help but not see that second m.

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1) You rely on the Bible and test what is claimed against God's Word

2) You pray about it and seek the guidance of the Holy Spirit

3) You employ reason - you use the mind which God gave to you - in your analysis.

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And when you do this, you are your own pope. Which is fine if that's what you want.

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1. Get God right
2. Get the right God
3. Get right with God.

If that makes me my own Pope, then I'll take my funny hat and wear it with pride. Whoop, Modano. Whoop.

dumb, dumb, dumb....lol.

It is amazing that amidst all of this conjecture...Southpark had it right all along.

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dumb, dumb, dumb....lol.

It is amazing that amidst all of this conjecture...Southpark had it right all along.

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Yea, you are right South Park shows all Mormons making it to heaven! I would say almost 100% right minus the members that don't do what they are supposed to do. People that use South Park as their reference make it easy, simple minds.

When Christ died, did darkness cover the land for three days or for three hours? (Luke 23:44 and 3 Nephi 8:19, 23).

If the original 1830 Book of Mormon was inspired than why were there so many errors and changes and additions and deletions, when compared to current editions?

Bruce R. McConkie, who was an Apostle in the Mormon Church, wrote the following in a book published in 1958:

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Negroes in this life are denied the priesthood; under no circumstances can they hold this delegation of authority from the Almighty. The gospel message of salvation is not carried affirmatively to them..."Negroes are not equal with other races where the receipt of certain spiritual blessings are concerned..." (Mormon Doctrine, 1958, page 477)

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Once again we see how revelation changed as the times changed...

[This message has been edited by 77 (edited 6/16/2005 5:29p).]

77,

What religion are you?

77,

Why are there so many errors in the Bible? I guess Jesus was a racist because the Gentiles could not hold the Priesthood during his time. 77 you make the same weak arguments that have been made before on Texags. Why don't you go read other threads so you educate yourself before opening your mouth?

No, 77's argument (ad nauseam) is something about how the gospel once given is not the one we preach or some such dubious stretch of logic.

And once again he shows his class.

Was that a 77 Original, or did you have to find that "Everytime I see Mormon it's like I automatically miss that second m for some reason" zinger from a website?

You're good for a laugh anyway.

I am a Christian. What are you?

What errors? Don't you claim to go by both the word of God, and the word according to Joseph Smith?

Jesus abolished the levitical priesthood when he died on the cross. Now all Christians are priests. That little shot you took is meaningless.

Why get so hostile? If you can't answer the questions don't take it out on me. You claim the "book of mormon" to be from God -- not me. Now support your claim by answering the questions.

That's a 77 original Liam. I must have a mental hang up with the word. Sorry -- no offense I just can't help it.

How is it a stretch of logic if it is the truth? Your doctrine changes as the times change.

[This message has been edited by 77 (edited 6/16/2005 9:52p).]

77,

Matthew 7:6
"Give not that which is holy unto the dogs, neither cast ye your pearls before swine, lest they trample them under their feet, and turn again and rend you."

Where have you been. You don't tell us your religion because you fear having to defend your beliefs. You come to this thread and ask for answers to questions that have been answered at least 100 times on this site. Your intentions are not an honest effort to learn about the religion but to take pot shots while not having to answer any questions. Again, do a search and read some of the responses then come back with a honest intent to learn and maybe someone will want to take the time to talk with you.

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dumb, dumb, dumb....lol.

It is amazing that amidst all of this conjecture...Southpark had it right all along.
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Yea, you are right South Park shows all Mormons making it to heaven! I would say almost 100% right minus the members that don't do what they are supposed to do. People that use South Park as their reference make it easy, simple minds.

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Actually...I was referring to the dumb, dumb, dumb part.