Howdy, it is me! said:

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dermdoc said:

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Thaddeus73 said:

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Well, this certainly is not ecumenical...What possesses a pastor to do this evil thing?

https://spiritdaily.org/blog/baptist-pastor-lets-kids-smash-statues-of-virgin-mary-angels/

---

Not surprised at all. Google John MacArthur and RC Sproul's remarks remarks on Catholicism. What do you expect when your leaders are preaching this stuff?

---

How in the world are they getting dragged into this?

---

https://www.gty.org/sermons/series/296/explaining-the-heresy-of-catholicism MacArthur claims to be Baptist.
Sproul has said similar things, where do you think this guy got his beliefs?

Howdy, it is me! said:

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dermdoc said:

---

Howdy, it is me! said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Thaddeus73 said:

---

Well, this certainly is not ecumenical...What possesses a pastor to do this evil thing?

https://spiritdaily.org/blog/baptist-pastor-lets-kids-smash-statues-of-virgin-mary-angels/

---

Not surprised at all. Google John MacArthur and RC Sproul's remarks remarks on Catholicism. What do you expect when your leaders are preaching this stuff?

---

How in the world are they getting dragged into this?

---

https://www.gty.org/sermons/series/296/explaining-the-heresy-of-catholicism MacArthur claims to be Baptist.
Sproul has said similar things, where do you think this guy got his beliefs?

---

Not from them. The church flat out claims that Calvinism is false doctrine and Sproul wasn't even a Baptist!

---

Do you mean the Catholic Church when you say church? Who is teaching this guy in the video? He is not alone. Do you think they read MacArthur? Did you read my link? It is not a leap to far to find out where they get their theology from? Too man question marks. Sorry.

Howdy, it is me! said:

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dermdoc said:

---

Howdy, it is me! said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Howdy, it is me! said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Thaddeus73 said:

---

Well, this certainly is not ecumenical...What possesses a pastor to do this evil thing?

https://spiritdaily.org/blog/baptist-pastor-lets-kids-smash-statues-of-virgin-mary-angels/

---

Not surprised at all. Google John MacArthur and RC Sproul's remarks remarks on Catholicism. What do you expect when your leaders are preaching this stuff?

---

How in the world are they getting dragged into this?

---

https://www.gty.org/sermons/series/296/explaining-the-heresy-of-catholicism MacArthur claims to be Baptist.
Sproul has said similar things, where do you think this guy got his beliefs?

---

Not from them. The church flat out claims that Calvinism is false doctrine and Sproul wasn't even a Baptist!

---

Do you mean the Catholic Church when you say church? Who is teaching this guy in the video? He is not alone. Do you think they read MacArthur? Did you read my link? It is not a leap to far to find out where they get their theology from? Too man question marks. Sorry.

---

No, I mean the church the guy in the video pastors. I do not think this guy reads or listens to MacArthur. It's not just Calvinists who think there are issues within the Catholic church…

---

Got it. But somebody is teaching pastors like this guy. Who do you think they are?

Howdy, it is me! said:

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dermdoc said:

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Howdy, it is me! said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Howdy, it is me! said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Howdy, it is me! said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Thaddeus73 said:

---

Well, this certainly is not ecumenical...What possesses a pastor to do this evil thing?

https://spiritdaily.org/blog/baptist-pastor-lets-kids-smash-statues-of-virgin-mary-angels/

---

Not surprised at all. Google John MacArthur and RC Sproul's remarks remarks on Catholicism. What do you expect when your leaders are preaching this stuff?

---

How in the world are they getting dragged into this?

---

https://www.gty.org/sermons/series/296/explaining-the-heresy-of-catholicism MacArthur claims to be Baptist.
Sproul has said similar things, where do you think this guy got his beliefs?

---

Not from them. The church flat out claims that Calvinism is false doctrine and Sproul wasn't even a Baptist!

---

Do you mean the Catholic Church when you say church? Who is teaching this guy in the video? He is not alone. Do you think they read MacArthur? Did you read my link? It is not a leap to far to find out where they get their theology from? Too man question marks. Sorry.

---

No, I mean the church the guy in the video pastors. I do not think this guy reads or listens to MacArthur. It's not just Calvinists who think there are issues within the Catholic church…

---

Got it. But somebody is teaching pastors like this guy. Who do you think they are?

---

No clue. Could be a lot of people. But I'd bet it wasn't these two.

---

Did you read the link from MacArthur?

Howdy, it is me! said:

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dermdoc said:

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Howdy, it is me! said:

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dermdoc said:

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Howdy, it is me! said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Howdy, it is me! said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Howdy, it is me! said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Thaddeus73 said:

---

Well, this certainly is not ecumenical...What possesses a pastor to do this evil thing?

https://spiritdaily.org/blog/baptist-pastor-lets-kids-smash-statues-of-virgin-mary-angels/

---

Not surprised at all. Google John MacArthur and RC Sproul's remarks remarks on Catholicism. What do you expect when your leaders are preaching this stuff?

---

How in the world are they getting dragged into this?

---

https://www.gty.org/sermons/series/296/explaining-the-heresy-of-catholicism MacArthur claims to be Baptist.
Sproul has said similar things, where do you think this guy got his beliefs?

---

Not from them. The church flat out claims that Calvinism is false doctrine and Sproul wasn't even a Baptist!

---

Do you mean the Catholic Church when you say church? Who is teaching this guy in the video? He is not alone. Do you think they read MacArthur? Did you read my link? It is not a leap to far to find out where they get their theology from? Too man question marks. Sorry.

---

No, I mean the church the guy in the video pastors. I do not think this guy reads or listens to MacArthur. It's not just Calvinists who think there are issues within the Catholic church…

---

Got it. But somebody is teaching pastors like this guy. Who do you think they are?

---

No clue. Could be a lot of people. But I'd bet it wasn't these two.

---

Did you read the link from MacArthur?

---

Yes. But there is just no way the pastor in this video listens to MacArthur or Sproul. I feel like you jumped to that conclusion so quickly because you look for reasons to bring up pastors like them so you can speak against them. And, in this case, it's not only unfounded but there is evidence to suggest otherwise.

---

What evidence? And you are correct. I really do not like anything about Macarther. RC was a nice guy with theology I do not agree with. But MacArthur is a Baptist and I bet the guy in the video listened to him, Every Baptist I know does,

Howdy, it is me! said:

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dermdoc said:

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Howdy, it is me! said:

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dermdoc said:

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Howdy, it is me! said:

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dermdoc said:

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Howdy, it is me! said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Howdy, it is me! said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Howdy, it is me! said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Thaddeus73 said:

---

Well, this certainly is not ecumenical...What possesses a pastor to do this evil thing?

https://spiritdaily.org/blog/baptist-pastor-lets-kids-smash-statues-of-virgin-mary-angels/

---

Not surprised at all. Google John MacArthur and RC Sproul's remarks remarks on Catholicism. What do you expect when your leaders are preaching this stuff?

---

How in the world are they getting dragged into this?

---

https://www.gty.org/sermons/series/296/explaining-the-heresy-of-catholicism MacArthur claims to be Baptist.
Sproul has said similar things, where do you think this guy got his beliefs?

---

Not from them. The church flat out claims that Calvinism is false doctrine and Sproul wasn't even a Baptist!

---

Do you mean the Catholic Church when you say church? Who is teaching this guy in the video? He is not alone. Do you think they read MacArthur? Did you read my link? It is not a leap to far to find out where they get their theology from? Too man question marks. Sorry.

---

No, I mean the church the guy in the video pastors. I do not think this guy reads or listens to MacArthur. It's not just Calvinists who think there are issues within the Catholic church…

---

Got it. But somebody is teaching pastors like this guy. Who do you think they are?

---

No clue. Could be a lot of people. But I'd bet it wasn't these two.

---

Did you read the link from MacArthur?

---

Yes. But there is just no way the pastor in this video listens to MacArthur or Sproul. I feel like you jumped to that conclusion so quickly because you look for reasons to bring up pastors like them so you can speak against them. And, in this case, it's not only unfounded but there is evidence to suggest otherwise.

---

What evidence? And you are correct. I really do not like anything about Macarther. RC is a nice guy with theology I do not agree with. But MacArthur is a Baptist and I bet the guy in the video listened to him, Every Baptist I know does,

---

The church's website gives the evidence.

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Will check it out. Thanks

Wow. That is crazy stuff. Like Wells TX stuff. Agree he is not listening to Macarthur or Sproul. Crazy train cult.

lobopride said:

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Howdy, it is me! said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Thaddeus73 said:

---

Well, this certainly is not ecumenical...What possesses a pastor to do this evil thing?

https://spiritdaily.org/blog/baptist-pastor-lets-kids-smash-statues-of-virgin-mary-angels/

---

Not surprised at all. Google John MacArthur and RC Sproul's remarks remarks on Catholicism. What do you expect when your leaders are preaching this stuff?

---

How in the world are they getting dragged into this?

---

Dermdoc hates Calvinist pastors. He brings it into almost all conversations that have nothing to do with Calvinism.

---

I don't hate anyone. I disagree with Calvinist theology. I brought up MacArthur and Sproul because MacArthur is a Baptist. Was wrong on Sproul. The guy in the op is a nutcase cult guy. And if you want to join the civil conversation we were having you are welcome to.

shalom.

lobopride said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

lobopride said:

---

Howdy, it is me! said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Thaddeus73 said:

---

Well, this certainly is not ecumenical...What possesses a pastor to do this evil thing?

https://spiritdaily.org/blog/baptist-pastor-lets-kids-smash-statues-of-virgin-mary-angels/

---

Not surprised at all. Google John MacArthur and RC Sproul's remarks remarks on Catholicism. What do you expect when your leaders are preaching this stuff?

---

How in the world are they getting dragged into this?

---

Dermdoc hates Calvinist pastors. He brings it into almost all conversations that have nothing to do with Calvinism.

---

I don't hate anyone. I disagree with Calvinist theology. I brought up MacArthur and Sproul because MacArthur is a Baptist. Was wrong on Sproul. The guy in the op is a nutcase cult guy. And if you want to join the civil conversation we were having you are welcome to.

shalom.

---

I've seen enough of your posts to say that you do hate Calvinists. You bring it up in almost every post and many times in a very dishonest manner.

---

Where did I ever say I hate Calvinists? Link please.

lobopride said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

lobopride said:

---

Howdy, it is me! said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Thaddeus73 said:

---

Well, this certainly is not ecumenical...What possesses a pastor to do this evil thing?

https://spiritdaily.org/blog/baptist-pastor-lets-kids-smash-statues-of-virgin-mary-angels/

---

Not surprised at all. Google John MacArthur and RC Sproul's remarks remarks on Catholicism. What do you expect when your leaders are preaching this stuff?

---

How in the world are they getting dragged into this?

---

Dermdoc hates Calvinist pastors. He brings it into almost all conversations that have nothing to do with Calvinism.

---

I don't hate anyone. I disagree with Calvinist theology. I brought up MacArthur and Sproul because MacArthur is a Baptist. Was wrong on Sproul. The guy in the op is a nutcase cult guy. And if you want to join the civil conversation we were having you are welcome to.

shalom.

---

I've seen enough of your posts to say that you do hate Calvinists. You bring it up in almost every post and many times in a very dishonest manner.

---

But is he really culpable? Is it really his fault? I mean he was pre-determined to hate them, right?

Howdy, it is me! said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Thaddeus73 said:

---

Well, this certainly is not ecumenical...What possesses a pastor to do this evil thing?

https://spiritdaily.org/blog/baptist-pastor-lets-kids-smash-statues-of-virgin-mary-angels/

---

Not surprised at all. Google John MacArthur and RC Sproul's remarks remarks on Catholicism. What do you expect when your leaders are preaching this stuff?

---

How in the world are they getting dragged into this?

---

Because they were awful

I always thought RC Sproules was a disgusting person

dermdoc said:

---

lobopride said:

---

Howdy, it is me! said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Thaddeus73 said:

---

Well, this certainly is not ecumenical...What possesses a pastor to do this evil thing?

https://spiritdaily.org/blog/baptist-pastor-lets-kids-smash-statues-of-virgin-mary-angels/

---

Not surprised at all. Google John MacArthur and RC Sproul's remarks remarks on Catholicism. What do you expect when your leaders are preaching this stuff?

---

How in the world are they getting dragged into this?

---

Dermdoc hates Calvinist pastors. He brings it into almost all conversations that have nothing to do with Calvinism.

---

I don't hate anyone. I disagree with Calvinist theology. I brought up MacArthur and Sproul because MacArthur is a Baptist. Was wrong on Sproul. The guy in the op is a nutcase cult guy. And if you want to join the civil conversation we were having you are welcome to.

shalom.

---

I noticed you don't give the same "shalom" on your other posts outside of this forum

Curious why?

Do you feel as if you are forced have to live one life in some areas and another elsewhere?

Do you think the salutation would be poorly accepted in some arenas and feel the need to hide it?

Are you not fully comfortable with it?

It doesn't seem like it would be genuine if you only use it some of the time in only certain areas like it's a catch phrase at a football game or Star Trek convention.

Live long and prosper.

CrackerJackAg said:

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dermdoc said:

---

lobopride said:

---

Howdy, it is me! said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Thaddeus73 said:

---

Well, this certainly is not ecumenical...What possesses a pastor to do this evil thing?

https://spiritdaily.org/blog/baptist-pastor-lets-kids-smash-statues-of-virgin-mary-angels/

---

Not surprised at all. Google John MacArthur and RC Sproul's remarks remarks on Catholicism. What do you expect when your leaders are preaching this stuff?

---

How in the world are they getting dragged into this?

---

Dermdoc hates Calvinist pastors. He brings it into almost all conversations that have nothing to do with Calvinism.

---

I don't hate anyone. I disagree with Calvinist theology. I brought up MacArthur and Sproul because MacArthur is a Baptist. Was wrong on Sproul. The guy in the op is a nutcase cult guy. And if you want to join the civil conversation we were having you are welcome to.

shalom.

---

I noticed you don't give the same "shalom" on your other posts outside of this forum

Curious why?

Do you feel as if you are forced have to live one life in some areas and another elsewhere?

Do you think the salutation would be poorly accepted in some arenas and feel the need to hide it?

Are you not fully comfortable with it?

It doesn't seem like it would be genuine if you only use it some of the time in only certain areas like it's a catch phrase at a football game or Star Trek convention.

Live long and prosper.

---

I just do it when it feels like I should.

I was just curious.

I know some Arab guys who will greet you in the name of God and say goodbye to you in the name of God consistently 100% of the time. They will probably sprinkle two or three masha'allah in there too. Obviously while I don't agree with them in their religion, I certainly don't question their intent and sincerity because they do it 100% of the time.

I've obviously picked on you about this a little bit and questioned it because I don't understand. I think to me it just comes across as curious or contrived and seemingly disingenuous if you only choose to use it sometimes as it's so unusual.

I've asked and you've answered and I'll leave it alone.

Inshallah

CrackerJackAg said:

---

I was just curious.

I know some Arab guys who will greet you in the name of God and say goodbye to you in the name of God consistently 100% of the time. They will probably sprinkle two or three masha'allah in there too. Obviously while I don't agree with them in their religion, I certainly don't question their intent and sincerity because they always do it 100% of the time.

I've obviously picked on you about this a little bit and questioned it because I don't understand. I think to me it just comes across as curious or contrived and seemingly disingenuous if you only choose to use it sometimes as it's so unusual.

I've asked and you've answered and I'll leave it alone.

Inshallah

---

No worries. Shalom.

I see that the disdain towards the doctrine of justification by faith alone is still alive and well. Even in a thread where it had no connection.

Yes, MacArthur and Sproul were hardly ecumenical guys. This has long since been established.

10andBOUNCE said:

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I see that the disdain towards the doctrine of justification by faith alone is still alive and well. Even in a thread where it had no connection.

Yes, MacArthur and Sproul were hardly ecumenical guys. This has long since been established.

---

Who said anything about that? You know what part of their theology I don't agree with. Blessings my brother in Christ.

lobopride said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

lobopride said:

---

Howdy, it is me! said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Thaddeus73 said:

---

Well, this certainly is not ecumenical...What possesses a pastor to do this evil thing?

https://spiritdaily.org/blog/baptist-pastor-lets-kids-smash-statues-of-virgin-mary-angels/

---

Not surprised at all. Google John MacArthur and RC Sproul's remarks remarks on Catholicism. What do you expect when your leaders are preaching this stuff?

---

How in the world are they getting dragged into this?

---

Dermdoc hates Calvinist pastors. He brings it into almost all conversations that have nothing to do with Calvinism.

---

I don't hate anyone. I disagree with Calvinist theology. I brought up MacArthur and Sproul because MacArthur is a Baptist. Was wrong on Sproul. The guy in the op is a nutcase cult guy. And if you want to join the civil conversation we were having you are welcome to.

shalom.

---

I've seen enough of your posts to say that you do hate Calvinists. You bring it up in almost every post and many times in a very dishonest manner.

---

So I am dishonest and I hate Calvinists. Where did that come from? Disagreeing on theology does not imply being dishonest or hating anyone. As much as I disagree with Steve Lawson's theology, I added him to my prayer list as 10andBounce will attest, And the lack of reaction by any of my brothers/sisters in Christ to this post gives me pause. God's blessings on all! Shalom.

Thaddeus73 said:

---

Well, this certainly is not ecumenical...What possesses a pastor to do this evil thing?

https://spiritdaily.org/blog/baptist-pastor-lets-kids-smash-statues-of-virgin-mary-angels/

---

So, what is the correct exegesis of Exodus 20:4 per the Roman Church?

"You shall not make for yourself a carved image, or any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth."

Is Mary not in heaven above? Make no image or likeness of anything above? Seems simple but obviously it isn't.

10andBOUNCE said:

---

Thaddeus73 said:

---

Well, this certainly is not ecumenical...What possesses a pastor to do this evil thing?

https://spiritdaily.org/blog/baptist-pastor-lets-kids-smash-statues-of-virgin-mary-angels/

---

So, what is the correct exegesis of Exodus 20:4 per the Roman Church?

"You shall not make for yourself a carved image, or any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth."

Is Mary not in heaven above? Make no image or likeness of anything above? Seems simple but obviously it isn't.

---

There is nothing new under the Christian Sun.

Iconoclasm (from the Greek *eikon*, "image," and *klasein*, "to break") refers to the rejection, prohibition, and often violent destruction of religious images, particularly those depicting Christ, Mary, and the saints. The term is most closely associated with a major crisis in the Eastern Church during the 8th and 9th centuries, though the underlying theological questionwhether it is permissible to depict and venerate sacred imagesrecurs throughout Christian history, including in the Protestant Reformation.

Let's start with the Byzantine Iconoclast Controversy (726843). The crisis began when Byzantine Emperor Leo III banned the veneration of icons in 726, likely influenced by a mix of theological concerns, political pressures, and possibly the aniconic tradition of nearby Islam. His successors, especially Constantine V, intensified the persecution, destroying images, persecuting monks who defended them, and convening a council in 754 that condemned icon veneration as idolatry.

The defense of icons was led most eloquently by St. John of Damascus, who argued that the Incarnation changed everything. Before Christ, depicting the invisible God would have been idolatrous. But because the Word became flesh and was seen, touched, and beheld by human eyes (1 John 1:1), matter itself was sanctified, and the visible humanity of Christ could be legitimately depicted in art.

The controversy was formally resolved at the Second Council of Nicaea in 787, the Seventh Ecumenical Council, which restored the veneration of icons. This was briefly overturned by a second wave of iconoclasm (815843) before being permanently settled in 843, an event still celebrated in the East as the "Triumph of Orthodoxy."

Theologically speaking the Church's resolution rests on a crucial distinction preserved in the Catechism of the Catholic Church:

"The honor paid to sacred images is a 'respectful veneration,' not the adoration due to God alone... Whoever venerates an image venerates the person portrayed in it" (CCC 2132).

This is the difference between *latria* (adoration owed to God alone) and *dulia* or *proskynesis* (honor given to the saints, and the higher *hyperdulia* given to Mary). The icon is not worshipped as an object; it serves as a window pointing beyond itself to the person represented.

Iconoclasm, taken to its logical conclusion, implicitly denies the full reality of the Incarnation. If Christ truly took on a human nature with a visible, physical body, then that humanity can be painted, sculpted, and venerated, just as a photograph of a deceased parent is treasured not as the parent, but as a meaningful connection to them. This principle also explains why later Protestant iconoclasm (smashing statues and stained glass during the Reformation) represented not just an aesthetic preference but a theological error about matter, sacramentality, and the Incarnation itself.