Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Adultery is sinful.

Why resort to ad Homs?

---

Because you are acting like a joke. You took about 11 posts to say adultery was sinful. Now how do we know that?

---

So now I am a joke?

You ever looked at a woman with lust?

---

Yes. I am a sinner. Was it okay that I did?

---

Sure. What about the people you want judge so bad?

Is your sin less than theirs?

---

Where have I mentioned people? That was my entire point. You refuse to judge both actions and people. We are not to adjudge people as damned, that is not our role. Actions are a different manner entirely

And no, it wasn't okay that I did. It was sinful

---

I am not God. I can judge no one.

Guess you are different.

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Adultery is sinful.

Why resort to ad Homs?

---

Because you are acting like a joke. You took about 11 posts to say adultery was sinful. Now how do we know that?

---

So now I am a joke?

You ever looked at a woman with lust?

---

Yes. I am a sinner. Was it okay that I did?

---

Sure. What about the people you want judge so bad?

Is your sin less than theirs?

---

Where have I mentioned people? That was my entire point. You refuse to judge both actions and people. We are not to adjudge people as damned, that is not our role. Actions are a different manner entirely

And no, it wasn't okay that I did. It was sinful

---

I am not God. I can judge no one.

Guess you are different.

---

Doc, you are having to twist my words to hide the fact that you're lukewarm. I have literally said we can't adjudge people damned, but we can judge actions sinful; and you respond with " I can't judge anyone but I guess you can"

I understand it is easier and perhaps more fun for you to create arguments out of thin air than it is to address your new age *******ization of the Gospel, but it is intellectually wanting.

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Adultery is sinful.

Why resort to ad Homs?

---

Because you are acting like a joke. You took about 11 posts to say adultery was sinful. Now how do we know that?

---

So now I am a joke?

You ever looked at a woman with lust?

---

Yes. I am a sinner. Was it okay that I did?

---

Sure. What about the people you want judge so bad?

Is your sin less than theirs?

---

Where have I mentioned people? That was my entire point. You refuse to judge both actions and people. We are not to adjudge people as damned, that is not our role. Actions are a different manner entirely

And no, it wasn't okay that I did. It was sinful

---

I am not God. I can judge no one.

Guess you are different.

---

Doc, you are having to twist my words to hide the fact that you're lukewarm. I have literally said we can't adjudge people damned, but we can judge actions sinful; and you respond with " I can't judge anyone but I guess you can"

I understand it is easier and perhaps more fun for you to create arguments out of thin air than it is to address your new age *******ization of the Gospel, but it is intellectually wanting.

---

Okay judge. And you even judge me as being luke warm.

Very consistent.

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Adultery is sinful.

Why resort to ad Homs?

---

Because you are acting like a joke. You took about 11 posts to say adultery was sinful. Now how do we know that?

---

So now I am a joke?

You ever looked at a woman with lust?

---

Yes. I am a sinner. Was it okay that I did?

---

Sure. What about the people you want judge so bad?

Is your sin less than theirs?

---

Where have I mentioned people? That was my entire point. You refuse to judge both actions and people. We are not to adjudge people as damned, that is not our role. Actions are a different manner entirely

And no, it wasn't okay that I did. It was sinful

---

I am not God. I can judge no one.

Guess you are different.

---

Doc, you are having to twist my words to hide the fact that you're lukewarm. I have literally said we can't adjudge people damned, but we can judge actions sinful; and you respond with " I can't judge anyone but I guess you can"

I understand it is easier and perhaps more fun for you to create arguments out of thin air than it is to address your new age *******ization of the Gospel, but it is intellectually wanting.

---

Okay judge. And you even judge me as being luke warm.

Very consistent.

---

Answer the question, can we judge actions as sinful? If so, why do you continually tell me I'm judging people, when I'm only referring to actions?

You won't answer this question.

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Adultery is sinful.

Why resort to ad Homs?

---

Because you are acting like a joke. You took about 11 posts to say adultery was sinful. Now how do we know that?

---

So now I am a joke?

You ever looked at a woman with lust?

---

Yes. I am a sinner. Was it okay that I did?

---

Sure. What about the people you want judge so bad?

Is your sin less than theirs?

---

Where have I mentioned people? That was my entire point. You refuse to judge both actions and people. We are not to adjudge people as damned, that is not our role. Actions are a different manner entirely

And no, it wasn't okay that I did. It was sinful

---

I am not God. I can judge no one.

Guess you are different.

---

Doc, you are having to twist my words to hide the fact that you're lukewarm. I have literally said we can't adjudge people damned, but we can judge actions sinful; and you respond with " I can't judge anyone but I guess you can"

I understand it is easier and perhaps more fun for you to create arguments out of thin air than it is to address your new age *******ization of the Gospel, but it is intellectually wanting.

---

Okay judge. And you even judge me as being luke warm.

Very consistent.

---

Answer the question, can we judge actions as sinful? If so, why do you continually tell me I'm judging people, when I'm only referring to actions?

You won't answer this question.

---

I already did. We are to love, Holy Spirit is to convict, and God is to judge.

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Adultery is sinful.

Why resort to ad Homs?

---

Because you are acting like a joke. You took about 11 posts to say adultery was sinful. Now how do we know that?

---

So now I am a joke?

You ever looked at a woman with lust?

---

Yes. I am a sinner. Was it okay that I did?

---

Sure. What about the people you want judge so bad?

Is your sin less than theirs?

---

Where have I mentioned people? That was my entire point. You refuse to judge both actions and people. We are not to adjudge people as damned, that is not our role. Actions are a different manner entirely

And no, it wasn't okay that I did. It was sinful

---

I am not God. I can judge no one.

Guess you are different.

---

Doc, you are having to twist my words to hide the fact that you're lukewarm. I have literally said we can't adjudge people damned, but we can judge actions sinful; and you respond with " I can't judge anyone but I guess you can"

I understand it is easier and perhaps more fun for you to create arguments out of thin air than it is to address your new age *******ization of the Gospel, but it is intellectually wanting.

---

Okay judge. And you even judge me as being luke warm.

Very consistent.

---

Answer the question, can we judge actions as sinful? If so, why do you continually tell me I'm judging people, when I'm only referring to actions?

You won't answer this question.

---

I already did. We are to love, Holy Spirit is to convict, and God is to judge.

---

Love means telling people adultery isn't a sin?

I can not judge anybody. Guess you can.

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Adultery is sinful.

Why resort to ad Homs?

---

Because you are acting like a joke. You took about 11 posts to say adultery was sinful. Now how do we know that?

---

So now I am a joke?

You ever looked at a woman with lust?

---

Yes. I am a sinner. Was it okay that I did?

---

Sure. What about the people you want judge so bad?

Is your sin less than theirs?

---

Where have I mentioned people? That was my entire point. You refuse to judge both actions and people. We are not to adjudge people as damned, that is not our role. Actions are a different manner entirely

And no, it wasn't okay that I did. It was sinful

---

I am not God. I can judge no one.

Guess you are different.

---

Doc, you are having to twist my words to hide the fact that you're lukewarm. I have literally said we can't adjudge people damned, but we can judge actions sinful; and you respond with " I can't judge anyone but I guess you can"

I understand it is easier and perhaps more fun for you to create arguments out of thin air than it is to address your new age *******ization of the Gospel, but it is intellectually wanting.

---

Okay judge. And you even judge me as being luke warm.

Very consistent.

---

Answer the question, can we judge actions as sinful? If so, why do you continually tell me I'm judging people, when I'm only referring to actions?

You won't answer this question.

---

I already did. We are to love, Holy Spirit is to convict, and God is to judge.

---

Love means telling people adultery isn't a sin?

---

Never said that. And I bet that would occur at the divorce class that started all this.

dermdoc said:

---

I can not judge anybody. Guess you can.

---

Where have I said anything about judging someone? Why do you keep saying this? I have only mentioned actions.

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Adultery is sinful.

Why resort to ad Homs?

---

Because you are acting like a joke. You took about 11 posts to say adultery was sinful. Now how do we know that?

---

So now I am a joke?

You ever looked at a woman with lust?

---

Yes. I am a sinner. Was it okay that I did?

---

Sure. What about the people you want judge so bad?

Is your sin less than theirs?

---

Where have I mentioned people? That was my entire point. You refuse to judge both actions and people. We are not to adjudge people as damned, that is not our role. Actions are a different manner entirely

And no, it wasn't okay that I did. It was sinful

---

I am not God. I can judge no one.

Guess you are different.

---

Doc, you are having to twist my words to hide the fact that you're lukewarm. I have literally said we can't adjudge people damned, but we can judge actions sinful; and you respond with " I can't judge anyone but I guess you can"

I understand it is easier and perhaps more fun for you to create arguments out of thin air than it is to address your new age *******ization of the Gospel, but it is intellectually wanting.

---

Okay judge. And you even judge me as being luke warm.

Very consistent.

---

Answer the question, can we judge actions as sinful? If so, why do you continually tell me I'm judging people, when I'm only referring to actions?

You won't answer this question.

---

I already did. We are to love, Holy Spirit is to convict, and God is to judge.

---

Love means telling people adultery isn't a sin?

---

Never said that.

---

You've implied it, but you're too intellectually dishonest to admit it. Your job is just to love. Iron may sharpen iron, but soft soap feels a lot smoother I guess

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Adultery is sinful.

Why resort to ad Homs?

---

Because you are acting like a joke. You took about 11 posts to say adultery was sinful. Now how do we know that?

---

So now I am a joke?

You ever looked at a woman with lust?

---

Yes. I am a sinner. Was it okay that I did?

---

Sure. What about the people you want judge so bad?

Is your sin less than theirs?

---

Where have I mentioned people? That was my entire point. You refuse to judge both actions and people. We are not to adjudge people as damned, that is not our role. Actions are a different manner entirely

And no, it wasn't okay that I did. It was sinful

---

I am not God. I can judge no one.

Guess you are different.

---

Doc, you are having to twist my words to hide the fact that you're lukewarm. I have literally said we can't adjudge people damned, but we can judge actions sinful; and you respond with " I can't judge anyone but I guess you can"

I understand it is easier and perhaps more fun for you to create arguments out of thin air than it is to address your new age *******ization of the Gospel, but it is intellectually wanting.

---

Okay judge. And you even judge me as being luke warm.

Very consistent.

---

Answer the question, can we judge actions as sinful? If so, why do you continually tell me I'm judging people, when I'm only referring to actions?

You won't answer this question.

---

I already did. We are to love, Holy Spirit is to convict, and God is to judge.

---

Love means telling people adultery isn't a sin?

---

Never said that. And I bet that would occur at the divorce class that started all this.

---

Telling people they're sinners is okay if they're at a divorce class, but not outside of it?

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Adultery is sinful.

Why resort to ad Homs?

---

Because you are acting like a joke. You took about 11 posts to say adultery was sinful. Now how do we know that?

---

So now I am a joke?

You ever looked at a woman with lust?

---

Yes. I am a sinner. Was it okay that I did?

---

Sure. What about the people you want judge so bad?

Is your sin less than theirs?

---

Where have I mentioned people? That was my entire point. You refuse to judge both actions and people. We are not to adjudge people as damned, that is not our role. Actions are a different manner entirely

And no, it wasn't okay that I did. It was sinful

---

I am not God. I can judge no one.

Guess you are different.

---

Doc, you are having to twist my words to hide the fact that you're lukewarm. I have literally said we can't adjudge people damned, but we can judge actions sinful; and you respond with " I can't judge anyone but I guess you can"

I understand it is easier and perhaps more fun for you to create arguments out of thin air than it is to address your new age *******ization of the Gospel, but it is intellectually wanting.

---

Okay judge. And you even judge me as being luke warm.

Very consistent.

---

Answer the question, can we judge actions as sinful? If so, why do you continually tell me I'm judging people, when I'm only referring to actions?

You won't answer this question.

---

I already did. We are to love, Holy Spirit is to convict, and God is to judge.

---

Love means telling people adultery isn't a sin?

---

Never said that.

---

You've implied it, but you're too intellectually dishonest to admit it. Your job is just to love. Iron may sharpen iron, but soft soap feels a lot smoother I guess

---

Very revealing as I already knew.

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Adultery is sinful.

Why resort to ad Homs?

---

Because you are acting like a joke. You took about 11 posts to say adultery was sinful. Now how do we know that?

---

So now I am a joke?

You ever looked at a woman with lust?

---

Yes. I am a sinner. Was it okay that I did?

---

Sure. What about the people you want judge so bad?

Is your sin less than theirs?

---

Where have I mentioned people? That was my entire point. You refuse to judge both actions and people. We are not to adjudge people as damned, that is not our role. Actions are a different manner entirely

And no, it wasn't okay that I did. It was sinful

---

I am not God. I can judge no one.

Guess you are different.

---

Doc, you are having to twist my words to hide the fact that you're lukewarm. I have literally said we can't adjudge people damned, but we can judge actions sinful; and you respond with " I can't judge anyone but I guess you can"

I understand it is easier and perhaps more fun for you to create arguments out of thin air than it is to address your new age *******ization of the Gospel, but it is intellectually wanting.

---

Okay judge. And you even judge me as being luke warm.

Very consistent.

---

Answer the question, can we judge actions as sinful? If so, why do you continually tell me I'm judging people, when I'm only referring to actions?

You won't answer this question.

---

I already did. We are to love, Holy Spirit is to convict, and God is to judge.

---

Love means telling people adultery isn't a sin?

---

Never said that.

---

You've implied it, but you're too intellectually dishonest to admit it. Your job is just to love. Iron may sharpen iron, but soft soap feels a lot smoother I guess

---

Ver revealing as I already knew.

---

You're just supposed to love me dude

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Adultery is sinful.

Why resort to ad Homs?

---

Because you are acting like a joke. You took about 11 posts to say adultery was sinful. Now how do we know that?

---

So now I am a joke?

You ever looked at a woman with lust?

---

Yes. I am a sinner. Was it okay that I did?

---

Sure. What about the people you want judge so bad?

Is your sin less than theirs?

---

Where have I mentioned people? That was my entire point. You refuse to judge both actions and people. We are not to adjudge people as damned, that is not our role. Actions are a different manner entirely

And no, it wasn't okay that I did. It was sinful

---

I am not God. I can judge no one.

Guess you are different.

---

Doc, you are having to twist my words to hide the fact that you're lukewarm. I have literally said we can't adjudge people damned, but we can judge actions sinful; and you respond with " I can't judge anyone but I guess you can"

I understand it is easier and perhaps more fun for you to create arguments out of thin air than it is to address your new age *******ization of the Gospel, but it is intellectually wanting.

---

Okay judge. And you even judge me as being luke warm.

Very consistent.

---

Answer the question, can we judge actions as sinful? If so, why do you continually tell me I'm judging people, when I'm only referring to actions?

You won't answer this question.

---

I already did. We are to love, Holy Spirit is to convict, and God is to judge.

---

Love means telling people adultery isn't a sin?

---

Never said that.

---

You've implied it, but you're too intellectually dishonest to admit it. Your job is just to love. Iron may sharpen iron, but soft soap feels a lot smoother I guess

---

Ver revealing as I already knew.

---

You're just supposed to love me dude

---

And I do. You are my brother in Christ.

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Adultery is sinful.

Why resort to ad Homs?

---

Because you are acting like a joke. You took about 11 posts to say adultery was sinful. Now how do we know that?

---

So now I am a joke?

You ever looked at a woman with lust?

---

Yes. I am a sinner. Was it okay that I did?

---

Sure. What about the people you want judge so bad?

Is your sin less than theirs?

---

Where have I mentioned people? That was my entire point. You refuse to judge both actions and people. We are not to adjudge people as damned, that is not our role. Actions are a different manner entirely

And no, it wasn't okay that I did. It was sinful

---

I am not God. I can judge no one.

Guess you are different.

---

Doc, you are having to twist my words to hide the fact that you're lukewarm. I have literally said we can't adjudge people damned, but we can judge actions sinful; and you respond with " I can't judge anyone but I guess you can"

I understand it is easier and perhaps more fun for you to create arguments out of thin air than it is to address your new age *******ization of the Gospel, but it is intellectually wanting.

---

Okay judge. And you even judge me as being luke warm.

Very consistent.

---

Answer the question, can we judge actions as sinful? If so, why do you continually tell me I'm judging people, when I'm only referring to actions?

You won't answer this question.

---

I already did. We are to love, Holy Spirit is to convict, and God is to judge.

---

Love means telling people adultery isn't a sin?

---

Never said that.

---

You've implied it, but you're too intellectually dishonest to admit it. Your job is just to love. Iron may sharpen iron, but soft soap feels a lot smoother I guess

---

Ver revealing as I already knew.

---

You're just supposed to love me dude

---

And I do. You are my brother in Christ.

---

Seems a little judgey

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

---

Adultery is sinful.

Why resort to ad Homs?

---

Because you are acting like a joke. You took about 11 posts to say adultery was sinful. Now how do we know that?

---

So now I am a joke?

You ever looked at a woman with lust?

---

Yes. I am a sinner. Was it okay that I did?

---

Sure. What about the people you want judge so bad?

Is your sin less than theirs?

---

Where have I mentioned people? That was my entire point. You refuse to judge both actions and people. We are not to adjudge people as damned, that is not our role. Actions are a different manner entirely

And no, it wasn't okay that I did. It was sinful

---

I am not God. I can judge no one.

Guess you are different.

---

Doc, you are having to twist my words to hide the fact that you're lukewarm. I have literally said we can't adjudge people damned, but we can judge actions sinful; and you respond with " I can't judge anyone but I guess you can"

I understand it is easier and perhaps more fun for you to create arguments out of thin air than it is to address your new age *******ization of the Gospel, but it is intellectually wanting.

---

Okay judge. And you even judge me as being luke warm.

Very consistent.

---

Answer the question, can we judge actions as sinful? If so, why do you continually tell me I'm judging people, when I'm only referring to actions?

You won't answer this question.

---

I already did. We are to love, Holy Spirit is to convict, and God is to judge.

---

Love means telling people adultery isn't a sin?

---

Never said that.

---

You've implied it, but you're too intellectually dishonest to admit it. Your job is just to love. Iron may sharpen iron, but soft soap feels a lot smoother I guess

---

Ver revealing as I already knew.

---

You're just supposed to love me dude

---

And I do. You are my brother in Christ.

---

Seems a little judgey

---

How so?

Because I'm a racist and homophobe

Dies Irae said:

---

Because I'm a racist and homophobe

---

Wait you called me a joke?

Enjoy your night.

dermdoc said:

---

Dies Irae said:

---

Because I'm a racist and homophobe

---

Wait you called me a joke?

Enjoy your night.

---

No, I feel judged because im a racist and homophobe

Amongst college educated divorcees, women initiate the divorce 90% of the time. But I can't find the exact link. In all, women initiate the divorce 70% of the time.

https://www.thejimenezlawfirm.com/why-women-initiate-divorce-more-often-than-men/

I just wanted to balance things out.

Here it is:90%

https://www.whitleylawfirmpc.com/3-reasons-why-women-initiate-divorce-more-often-than-men/amp/

Dies Irae said:

---

dermdoc said:

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Dies Irae said:

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Because I'm a racist and homophobe

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Wait you called me a joke?

Enjoy your night.

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No, I feel judged because im a racist and homophobe

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After reading through this again, I want to apologize.

There is a difference between loving correction for the person's own good and being judge mental.

I used that word "judge" in the wrong context.

I certainly think adultery is a sin and would explain that to any Christian engaging in adultery.

Please forgive me. Thanks.

dermdoc said:

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Dies Irae said:

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dermdoc said:

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Dies Irae said:

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Because I'm a racist and homophobe

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Wait you called me a joke?

Enjoy your night.

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No, I feel judged because im a racist and homophobe

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After reading through this again, I want to apologize.

There is a difference between loving correction for the person's own good and being judge mental.

I used that word "judge" in the wrong context.

I certainly think adultery is a sin and would explain that to any Christian engaging in adultery.

Please forgive me. Thanks.

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Nothing to forgive

Dies Irae said:

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dermdoc said:

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Dies Irae said:

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dermdoc said:

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Dies Irae said:

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Because I'm a racist and homophobe

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Wait you called me a joke?

Enjoy your night.

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No, I feel judged because im a racist and homophobe

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After reading through this again, I want to apologize.

There is a difference between loving correction for the person's own good and being judge mental.

I used that word "judge" in the wrong context.

I certainly think adultery is a sin and would explain that to any Christian engaging in adultery.

Please forgive me. Thanks.

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Nothing to forgive

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Thanks my brother in Christ.

This might be the only time I've ever heard anyone refer to you as lukewarm

trouble said:

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This might be the only time I've ever heard anyone refer to you as lukewarm

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It is okay. He does not know me and misconstrued what I was saying about adultery. And I misunderstood what he was saying about judgement.

As a former DC attendee and volunteer, the concerns about mixing different sex divorcees in a class are not unfounded. The same holds true for an open door policy to those with clear unrepentant fault in the marriage. But DC does a lot more good than harm, and is the best option and format out there I have seen as long as the small groups are separated by sex. The leaders are taught to be on the lookout for wolves in the henhouse and to safeguard the others accordingly.

The statement on withholding forgiveness seems off, but maybe there's a miscommunication or misunderstanding here.

Matthew 6:14-15 New International Version (NIV)
For if you forgive other people when they sin against you, your heavenly Father will also forgive you. But if you do not forgive others their sins, your Father will not forgive your sins.

dallasattnyag said:

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As a former DC attendee and volunteer, the concerns about mixing different sex divorcees in a class are not unfounded. The same holds true for an open door policy to those with clear unrepentant fault in the marriage. But DC does a lot more good than harm, and is the best option and format out there I have seen as long as the small groups are separated by sex. The leaders are taught to be on the lookout for wolves in the henhouse and to safeguard the others accordingly.

The statement on withholding forgiveness seems off, but maybe there's a miscommunication or misunderstanding here.

Matthew 6:14-15 New International Version (NIV)
For if you forgive other people when they sin against you, your heavenly Father will also forgive you. But if you do not forgive others their sins, your Father will not forgive your sins.

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That's a great answer to the original question. It addressed what I saw as an obvious concern.

No one stated anyone should withhold forgiveness.

Forgiveness of sin can only come after repentance. It's available to everyone but it's not free.




I am well aware of the scripture. There is a great deal, some which I posted above, about holding one another accountable and not associating with the unrepentant.

In totality, and not cherry picking the feel good scripture, we are expected to be held accountable and to hold accountable (not judge) those in our Church community and offer forgiveness willingly upon repentance.

The "against you" part of that scripture also seems relevant here.

TheGreatEscape said:

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Amongst college educated divorcees, women initiate the divorce 90% of the time. But I can't find the exact link. In all, women initiate the divorce 70% of the time.

https://www.thejimenezlawfirm.com/why-women-initiate-divorce-more-often-than-men/

I just wanted to balance things out.

Here it is:90%

https://www.whitleylawfirmpc.com/3-reasons-why-women-initiate-divorce-more-often-than-men/amp/

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Women often initiate the divorce because the men won't do it. They'll separate or make things miserable, but won't actually file.

swimmerbabe11 said:

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TheGreatEscape said:

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Amongst college educated divorcees, women initiate the divorce 90% of the time. But I can't find the exact link. In all, women initiate the divorce 70% of the time.

https://www.thejimenezlawfirm.com/why-women-initiate-divorce-more-often-than-men/

I just wanted to balance things out.

Here it is:90%

https://www.whitleylawfirmpc.com/3-reasons-why-women-initiate-divorce-more-often-than-men/amp/

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Women often initiate the divorce because the men won't do it. They'll separate or make things miserable, but won't actually file.

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There's not a right answer here. It's both. And it happens the opposite way too. And the bar for marital incompatibility is very low now.

Quote:

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I don't know what Bible you use, so I'll just pull from the KJV, but in Matthew; Christ say "Verily I say to you; UNLESS YOU BE CONVERTED, and become as little children, you will not enter the kingdom of heaven".

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Except, you're leaving out important parts of that scripture.

Quote:

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1 At that time the disciples came to Jesus and asked, "Who, then, is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven?"
2 He called a little child to him, and placed the child among them. 3 And he said: "Truly I tell you, unless you change and become like little children, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven. 4 Therefore, whoever takes the lowly position of this child is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven. 5 And whoever welcomes one such child in my name welcomes me.

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Jesus is saying that whoever lowers and humbles themselves (as a child) to welcome the "lowly" in His name are also welcomed by Him. Consider who Jesus is addressing here, His disciples...the foundation of the early church...asking Jesus who the greatest in heaven is. Jesus didn't ask if the child they brought him had repented before instructing his disciples to welcome a child.

This is an example of Christ calling on His followers to be humble and lower themselves...not a hard-line set of conditions that people need to approach Him with.

CrackerJackAg said:

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Forgiveness should be reserved for those who are repentant.

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Sorry to be so bold, but this isn't YOUR decision to make. But, in truth, ultimately, forgiveness only works for those that ARE repentant. If I do something to you and you forgive me with telling me, how does that affect me? It doesn't, but it affects you -- which is the point of interpersonal forgiveness.

In terms of spiritual forgiveness, the author of Hebrews (in my opinion, Paul, but that's highly debatable) made it very clear that without the shedding of innocent blood -- in the new covenant, that's acceptance of Jesus Christ as your personal Lord and Savior -- there is no forgiveness of sin. Therefore, one MUST be repentant to be forgiven (Hebrews 9:22). Further, all the Gospels make it clear that one must forgive others to be forgiven themselves, an extension of what I said earlier.

Not that I'm perfect in this area. Far from it. I'm still holding some personal baggage that I won't go in to (long and soap opera-ish), but that's the scripture right there. Take it or leave it -- its your choice to believe or not. Not sure it has much to do with Divorce Recovery, though I'm not familiar with the content of that program.

That's not scriptural. It's a nice feel good story but plenty of Paul's writings say otherwise. Repentance is required for forgiveness.

CrackerJackAg said:

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That's not scriptural. It's a nice feel good story but plenty of Paul's writings say otherwise. Repentance is required for forgiveness.

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Honest question, how do you know someone has truly repented? And is there a work or task they have to do?

Repentance comes from the Greek metanoia (forgive my spelling) that means a change of mind or direction. Ir is not a list of tasks one must do.

I do not understand how anyone can tell if someone has truly repented except for their fruits.

In a perfect world it would happen before any marriage.