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By Tom Horn & Chris Putnam
"L.U.C.I.F.E.R., which stands for "Large Binocular Telescope Near-infrared Utility with Camera and Integral Field Unit for Extragalactic Research," is a chilled instrument attached to a telescope in Arizona. And yes, it's named for the Devil, whose name itself means "morning star" [and which] happens to be right next to the Vatican Observatory on Mt. Graham in Tucson"
It was approximately 11: AM (PST) as we rounded the final bend and saw just ahead the towering edifices housing the Large Binocular Telescope (LBT), an optical telescope for astronomy and currently one of the world's most advanced systems. Near it was the Submillimeter Telescope (SMT) or as it is also known, the Heinrich Hertz Submillimeter Telescope building, a "state-of-the-art single-dish radio telescope for observations in the sub-millimeter wavelength range the most accurate radio telescope ever built." [ii] And last but not least about a block away from them we observed our primary reason for trudging to the top of this peakthe Vatican Advanced Technology Telescope or VATT.
Of course we had read the official story from the Vatican Observatory Website before making the trip, how VATT truly lives up to its name:
"Its heart is a 1.8-m f/1.0 honeycombed construction, borosilicate primary mirror. This was manufactured at the University of Arizona Mirror Laboratory, and it pioneered both the spin-casting techniques and the stressed-lap polishing techniques of that Laboratory which are being used for telescope mirrors up to 8.4-m in diameter. The primary mirror is so deeply-dished that the focus of the telescope is only as far above the mirror as the mirror is wide, thus allowing a structure that is about three times as compact as the previous generation of telescope designs."
Such technical language aside, the "Observers" who are approved to operate VATT and what they are using it for these days is what would take us through the looking glass. This was confirmed minutes later by the Jesuit Father on duty that day (whom we got on film) who told us that among the most important research occurring with the site's Vatican astronomers is the quest to pinpoint certain extrasolar planets and advanced alien intelligence. He then proceeded (as did our guide) to show us all around the observatoryfrom the personal quarters of the Church's astronomerswhere they ate, slept, relaxed, studiedto the control rooms, computer screens and systems, and even the telescope itself. While we were given complete and unrestricted opportunity to question how the devices are used and what distinctives set each of the telescopes on Mt. Graham apart, we had not expected the ease with which the astronomers and technicians would also speak of UFOs!
This was especially true when we walked up the gravel road from VATT to the Large Binocular Telescope (LBT), where we spent most of the day with a systems engineer who not only took us to all seven levels of that mighty machinepointing out the LUCIFER device and what it is used for (which he lovingly referred to as "Lucy" several times and elsewhere as "Lucifer") as well as every other aspect of the telescope we tried to wrap our minds aroundbut who also stunned us as we sat in the control room, listening to him and the astronomers speak so casually of the redundancy with which UFOs are captured on screens darting through the heavens.
Our friendly engineer didn't blink an eye, nor did any of the other scientists in the room, and we were shocked at this, how ordinary it seemed to be.
But as much as the commonality of UFO sightings on Mt. Graham's telescopes intrigued, this was not the primary reason for our being there. We had come with deeper questions concerning high-level Vatican astronomers and what they had been leaking to, and discussing with, media in recent years. Captivating comments from Jesuit priests like Guy Consolmagnoa leading astronomer who often turns up in media as a spokesman for the Vatican who has worked at NASA and taught at Harvard and MIT and who currently splits his time between the Vatican Observatory and laboratory (Specola Vaticana) headquartered at the summer residence of the Pope in Castel Gandolfo, Italy, and Mt. Graham in Arizona.
Over the last few years, he has focused so much of his time and effort in an attempt to reconcile science and religion in public forums specifically as it relates to the subject of extraterrestrial life and its potential impact on the future of faith that we decided to contact him. He agreed to be interviewed from Rome, and over the numerous exchanges that followed he told us some things that seemed beyond the scope. He even sent us a copy of a private pdf, a literal goldmine of what he and the Vatican are considering regarding the ramifications of astrobiology and specifically the discovery of advanced extraterrestrials in which he admits how contemporary societies will soon "look to The Aliens to be the Saviours of humankind."
To illustrate the theological soundness of this possibility, Consolmago argues that humans are not the only intelligent beings God created in the universe, and, he says, these non-human lifeforms are described in the Bible. He starts by pointing to angels then surprises us by actually referencing the Nephilim:
Other heavenly beings come up several times in the Psalms. For example, look at the beautiful passage in Psalm 89 that calls out, "Let the heavens praise your wonders, 0 Lord, your faithfulness in the assembly of the holy ones. For who in the skies can be compared to the Lord? Who among the heavenly beings is like the Lord? The heavens are yours, the earth also is yours; the world and all that is in it -you have founded them." Likewise, God asks Job (38:7) if any human can claim to have been around at the creation, "when the morning stars sang together and all the heavenly beings shouted for joy ."
Are these "heavens," "holy ones," those "in the sky," the "morning stars and heavenly beings" more references to angels? Or do they refer to some other kind of life beyond our knowledge?
And these are not the only non-human intelligent creatures mentioned in the Bible. There's that odd, and mysterious, passage at the beginning of Genesis, Chapter 6, that describes the "sons of God" taking human wives. With it is a frustratingly oblique reference to "The Nephilim the heroes that were of old, warriors of renown ."
Most Biblical scholars suggest that the Nephelim and the Sons of God in Genesis can be explained away as a left-over reference to the creation stories of the pagans who surrounded ancient Israel, that they were written by the kind of people whose culture saw anyone Not Of My Tribe as being unspeakably alien. Likewise, the references to heavens and stars singing and praising the Lord can be seen simply for the beautiful poetry that it is.
But whether you interpret these creatures as angels or aliens doesn't really matter for the sake of our argument here. The point is that the ancient writers of the Bible, like all ancient peoples, were perfectly happy with the possibility that other intelligent beings could exist.
Read that again, then ask yourself: Did the Vatican's top astronomer actually mean to use the story of the Nephilim from the Bible as an example of the kind of "space saviors" man could soon look to for salvation? This incredible assertion is only topped by what he says next. In quoting John 10:16, which says, "And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one fold, and one shepherd," Consolmago writes: "Perhaps it's not so far-fetched to see the Second Person of the Trinity, the Word, Who was present "In the beginning" (John 1: l), coming to lay down His life and take it up again (John 10: 18) not only as the Son of Man but also as a Child of other races?"
Do Vatican scholars actually believe Jesus might have been the Star-Child of an alien race? Does Consolmagno and/or other Jesuits secretly hold that the "Virgin Birth" was in reality an abduction scenario in which Mary was impregnated by ET, giving birth to the hybrid Jesus? As incredible as that sounds, you should prepare for the unexpected answer as this series unfolds.
All this would seem impossible theology if not for the fact that other high ranking Vatican spokespersonsthose who routinely study from the "Star Base" (as local Indians call it) on Mt. Grahamhave been saying the same in recent years.
This includes Dr. Christopher Corbally, Vice Director for the Vatican Observatory Research Group on Mt. Graham until 2012, who believes our image of God will have to change if disclosure of alien life is soon revealed by scientists (including the need to evolve from the concept of an "anthropocentric" God into a "broader entity"), and the current Vatican Observatory director, Father Jos Funes who has gone equally far, suggesting that alien life not only exists in the universe and is "our brother" but will, when manifested, confirm the "true" faith of Christianity and the dominion of Rome.
When the L'Osservatore Romano newspaper (which publishes nothing that the Vatican doesn't approve) asked him what this meant, he replied: "How can we rule out that life may have developed elsewhere? Just as we consider earthly creatures as 'a brother,' and 'sister,' why should we not talk about an 'extraterrestrial brother'? It would still be part of creation" and believing in the existence of such is not contradictory to Catholic doctrine.

http://www.timetobelieve.com/2013/01/l-u-c-i-f-e-r-project/

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Vatican hoping to establish contact with "aliens"? The Bible speaks of hybrid (human-angelic) creatures who the Israelites were commanded to wipe out when they invaded Canaan.

Is there a credible source for this? I googled the long name of the telescope, and only got WND, infowars, and several other pages like the one linked in the OP.

Don't need to read to spot the crazy.

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Lucifer is part of the Large Binocular Telescope, which happens to be right next to the Vatican Observatory on Mt. Graham in Tucson. That's right, the Vatican has an observatory in Arizona, manned by Jesuit astronomers. Now its next-door neighbor is named for the Devil.

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http://www.popsci.com/science/article/2010-04/devil-named-telescope-helps-astronomers-see-through-darkness

http://www.lsw.uni-heidelberg.de/news/lbt-comm.php?lang=en

One site I found said the acronym had been shortened to LUCI in 2013. I wonder if that still counts, or is it now the telescope version of:

Thank you so much for posting this. This reminds me of the time Tyson linked to a website that accused the Catholic Church of putting tracking devices in the Eucharist so they could mobilize their manchurian Catholic army at a moment's notice.

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Thank you so much for posting this. This reminds me of the time Tyson linked to a website that accused the Catholic Church of putting tracking devices in the Eucharist so they could mobilize their manchurian Catholic army at a moment's notice.

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I am just curious why the Vatican would be so interested in astronomy when NASA, the ESA and many universities already have ongoing, cutting edge research.

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Thank you so much for posting this. This reminds me of the time Tyson linked to a website that accused the Catholic Church of putting tracking devices in the Eucharist so they could mobilize their manchurian Catholic army at a moment's notice.

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I am just curious why the Vatican would be so interested in astronomy when NASA, the ESA and many universities already have ongoing, cutting edge research.

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Okay, that may be a genuine curiosity, but the OP said nothing about being curious as to why the RCC would be interested in astronomy. It came across as an attempt to link the RCC to Satan.

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Thank you so much for posting this. This reminds me of the time Tyson linked to a website that accused the Catholic Church of putting tracking devices in the Eucharist so they could mobilize their manchurian Catholic army at a moment's notice.

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I am just curious why the Vatican would be so interested in astronomy when NASA, the ESA and many universities already have ongoing, cutting edge research.

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We like science?

I don't think it is; I think it may be some sort of attempt to develop theology consistent with the existence of ETs, but I am curious as to the bottom line.

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Thank you so much for posting this. This reminds me of the time Tyson linked to a website that accused the Catholic Church of putting tracking devices in the Eucharist so they could mobilize their manchurian Catholic army at a moment's notice.

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I am just curious why the Vatican would be so interested in astronomy when NASA, the ESA and many universities already have ongoing, cutting edge research.

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We like science?

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Thank you so much for posting this. This reminds me of the time Tyson linked to a website that accused the Catholic Church of putting tracking devices in the Eucharist so they could mobilize their manchurian Catholic army at a moment's notice.

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I am just curious why the Vatican would be so interested in astronomy when NASA, the ESA and many universities already have ongoing, cutting edge research.

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The church has been on the cutting edge of science and research forever, especially astronomy as it was originally used to develop calendars (namely the Gregorian Calendar) which determined when holy days and Easter fell. It's not to look for angels or demon hybrids or whatever the article claims; Catholics don't believe Heaven is in outer space.

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Catholics don't believe Heaven is in outer space.

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Duh! Everyone knows it's in the clouds.

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Thank you so much for posting this. This reminds me of the time Tyson linked to a website that accused the Catholic Church of putting tracking devices in the Eucharist so they could mobilize their manchurian Catholic army at a moment's notice.

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I am just curious why the Vatican would be so interested in astronomy when NASA, the ESA and many universities already have ongoing, cutting edge research.

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To keep those meddlesome Jesuits occupied?

You're on a roll! Keep it up!

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The Bible speaks of hybrid (human-angelic) creatures who the Israelites were commanded to wipe out when they invaded Canaan.

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Well if the Bible says it... then its got to be true. No matter how asinine the story sounds.

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From the title I was expecting a better thread. Instead I just got a novel that appears to be about an acronym.

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Father Georges Lemaitre says hi! Not only did Lamaitre discover the Big-Bang, he also was the first to derive what is now known as Hubble's Law & made the FIRST estimation of the Hubble Constant, which Lamaitre published in an article in 1927, 2 years BEFORE Hubble published his work. He is TRULY the Father of The Big Bang (pun intended).

Mentioned again for the umpteenth time. Thanks for the update.

Because it's funny...

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Thank you so much for posting this. This reminds me of the time Tyson linked to a website that accused the Catholic Church of putting tracking devices in the Eucharist so they could mobilize their manchurian Catholic army at a moment's notice.

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You make up some of the most bizarre lies. I'd love a link to that thread

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Thank you so much for posting this. This reminds me of the time Tyson linked to a website that accused the Catholic Church of putting tracking devices in the Eucharist so they could mobilize their manchurian Catholic army at a moment's notice.

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You make up some of the most bizarre lies. I'd love a link to that thread

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Regardless of how many lies you catch yourself in, you always have the gumption to call others liars; even when nobody else believes you.

So you can't back up your accusation again... How completely expected

Does anybody even remember a thread discussing what bustup describes? I don't. Winags, Tampa and Utex are the conspiracy nutters around here

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So you can't back up your accusation again... How completely expected

Does anybody even remember a thread discussing what bustup describes? I don't. Winags, Tampa and Utex are the conspiracy nutters around here

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I do, it was when you were trying to prove that Catholic Dogma had changed, you linked to some conspiracist Canadian bible website, wherein in addition to some ridiculous statements about changing doctrine; it included charges that the Pope put tracking devices in the Eucharist, and worshipped a Satanic fish god. Can you list all of the handles that you've used on this board? It'll make it easier for me to remember which iteration it was in order to provide you with a link.

I just tried to google an article with that content and can't find it though I do see a few sites discussing the fish God thing. That's new information to me. Never heard of that before. I don't see anything about the pope putting tracking devices in the Eucharist at all.

Sounds like another bs claim by bustup attributed to me.

I welcome any evidence you can provide. At least posters like 747, frok, slave, buster, etc criticize me things I've actually said. You have a trump like need to make up completely unnecessary lies

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I just tried to google an article with that content and can't find it though I do see a few sites discussing the fish God thing. That's new information to me. Never heard of that before. I don't see anything about the pope putting tracking devices in the Eucharist at all.

Sounds like another bs claim by bustup attributed to me.

I welcome any evidence you can provide. At least posters like 747, frok, slave, buster, etc criticize me things I've actually said. You have a trump like need to make up completely unnecessary lies

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What about AstroAg? Does he not count?

Find this article about communion tracking devices and fish gods and use it to find the thread or at least to provide evidence such an article exists. You brought up this claim out of nowhere for no reason. Back it up.

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I just tried to google an article with that content and can't find it though I do see a few sites discussing the fish God thing. That's new information to me. Never heard of that before. I don't see anything about the pope putting tracking devices in the Eucharist at all.

Sounds like another bs claim by bustup attributed to me.

I welcome any evidence you can provide. At least posters like 747, frok, slave, buster, etc criticize me things I've actually said. You have a trump like need to make up completely unnecessary lies

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Truth be told, I've never had to endure accusations from another member of the TexAgs community such as those experienced by BUAC. No one has ever gone so low as to "target" my family with their comments. The worst I've endured is Ag_Believer, who seemed upset that I don't automatically line up GOP because of my Catholic faith. Also, he did not appreciate the R&P Brew Crew. And really, all that amounted to was mild criticism of my beliefs and behavior.

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Find this article about communion tracking devices and fish gods and use it to find the thread or at least to provide evidence such an article exists. You brought up this claim out of nowhere for no reason. Back it up.

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I'm just waiting for you to finish the last of your 5 daily posts. You've got 1 left, I know you're too cheap to purchase stars.

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Find this article about communion tracking devices and fish gods and use it to find the thread or at least to provide evidence such an article exists. You brought up this claim out of nowhere for no reason. Back it up.

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I'm just waiting for you to finish the last of your 5 daily posts. You've got 1 left, I know you're too cheap to purchase stars.

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With all the handles, that could get pretty expensive.

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No one has ever gone so low as to "target" my family with their comments.

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Yes, this is largely why I try to avoid certain subjects here now. Tired of the deeply personal attacks. It's a shame because I would think that those who wish to discuss issues of religion and philosophy would be more prone to do so in respectful ways.

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The worst I've endured is Ag_Believer, who seemed upset that I don't automatically line up GOP because of my Catholic faith.

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Was he the "pot pollen on donuts" poster?

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No one has ever gone so low as to "target" my family with their comments.

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Yes, this is largely why I try to avoid certain subjects here now. Tired of the deeply personal attacks. It's a shame because I would think that those who wish to discuss issues of religion and philosophy would be more prone to do so in respectful ways.

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The worst I've endured is Ag_Believer, who seemed upset that I don't automatically line up GOP because of my Catholic faith.

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Was he the "pot pollen on donuts" poster?

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I apologize for the personal attacks I have made in the past towards you; this board gets me worked up sometimes. Normally it's just Tyson getting me worked up and then I take it out on other people.

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I apologize for the personal attacks I have made in the past towards you; this board gets me worked up sometimes. Normally it's just Tyson getting me worked up and then I take it out on other people.

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No worries man, but thank you. It's something we all fail at. I know I've said things out of anger towards you and others here, so please accept my apologies as well. I have noticed that our engagements have been much less antagonistic (from both directions) the past few months, so that's always a good thing.