Edited because I feel like I am probably wrong and wanted to vent.

Long story short, can a person love the Lord, but dislike organized denominations withing Christianity?

[This message has been edited by Son of 73 (edited 1/6/2014 10:35a).]

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My wife keeps mentioning that we need to go back to church

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Does your wife agree that you learn better on your own? Because it sounds like she wants more than what you are doing right now.

I think having a community around you to support your walk is essential. The sermon and music are just a small part of the church. The bible study groups where you learn and live with each other are much more important.

You're probably right. I also know that it is my job to be the spiritual leader in my home and that it is my responsibility to make sure that we both do what we should. I just needed someplace to type out what I was feeling about this stuff and it got put here.

Visit an Orthodox church.

Call and see what time the English service is.

They were started by immigrant communities a hundred or so years ago, and so there are remnants of the original languages in some services, but in others it is all English.

Greek, Antiochian, Russian, Serbian, etc.It will be a different experience for you.

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We read the words of St. Vladimir’s envoys to Constantinople:

When we journeyed among the Bulgars, we beheld how they worship in their temple, called a mosque, while they stand ungirt. The Bulgarian bows, sits down, looks hither and thither like one possessed, and there is no happiness among them, but instead only sorrow and a dreadful stench. Their religion is not good. Then we went among the Germans, and saw them performing many ceremonies in their temples; but we beheld no glory there. Then we went on to Greece, and the Greeks led us to the edifices where they worship their God, and we knew not whether we were in heaven or on earth. For on earth there is no such splendour or such beauty, and we are at a loss how to describe it. We know only that God dwells there among men, and their service is fairer than the ceremonies of other nations. For we cannot forget that beauty. Every man, after tasting something sweet, is afterward unwilling to accept that which is bitter, and therefore we cannot dwell longer here.

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[This message has been edited by primrose (edited 1/6/2014 11:25a).]

If a church rubs you the wrong way you can always try another one. Especially if you are in Texas, there is one on every corner.

Loving the church can be difficult though. I go to a church where you feel pressured to act like you have it all together. It bothers me because I don't and I suck at acting like it.

Frock, I feel like that's a major reason for my being uncomfortable at church.

I go to a church where you feel pressured to act like you have it all together
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I think this happens at most churches because it happens in life generally..... when you go to a larger gathering of people (like a corporate company party) everyone is dressed their best and mostly on their best behavior.... usually you don't see people falling down drunk or dancing on the tables with the shirt off even though that might be how they are..... now if it's a smaller gathering for friends only then people might act a lot more relaxed

anyway, on Sundays at my church most people are on their "best" behavior and acting "perfect" (forgive my lack of using better terms)...... however, the pastors are constantly reminding the people how broken we all are... there is tons of small groups for all kinds of issues and addictions, as well as small groups to just hang out and meet people..... and this is where you can really be yourself

I would not walk up to the front of my church and just spew out all my sins and struggles..... however, I have shared them with my pastors and felt no condemnation, but instead received understanding that these things are shared by them as well in some ways..... and I have 4 close church friends that I have known for many years (through the church we attend) where we share absolutely everything..... definitely no need to be "perfect" with that group of guys

Great points Gordo. I'm jealous about those 4 guys you have. I keep telling myself to ask some guys to form an accountability group but I never do it.

frok.... it took a while (years) for this group to come together..... we were all part of different groups at times and also had other people coming in and out until we settled on this one..... we still have "transient" guys join for a while and then leave as our group is always open to anyone who wants to join..... I encourage you to just start with a few guys and stick with it for a while even if it seems it might not working that great at the beginning.... you never know how it ends up after a while

Why do you need a church? Can't you just be spiritual in your own way?

That was kind of along the lines of my original question.

We've moved on from this "spiritual, but not religious" mumbo jumbo. That happened back in the 70's.

You're obviously going to get a different answers. Me personally, yes. I don't even think you have to call it Christianity.
You will be told that you do, and that if you don't follow the laws and believe in Jesus you will be going to hell, but as I asked in my other thread, says who? How do we know one text is right and another is wrong, or if in fact any are correct.

What kind of deity are we talking about? Do we even need one to be good humanists? I know PLENTY of pretty abhorrent so called Christians, and I also know some lovely ones. Are the a-holes still in luck when they die?

Hmmm.

Why do you need a church?
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I have a suit I have to wear at least sometimes soooooooooo........ oh yeah, and there's free coffee!!!!!

Take your wife/girlfriend/partner out to a nice meal and dress up!

my wife says she prefers looking at my guns while at dinner date so I have to wear one of those tight fitting polo shirts (a few sizes too small).... hence no suit wearing

Oh dear. Polo shirt?

She can't have settled that much can she?

yep settled..... I definitely scored big time in that relationship!

Ha ha.

Still, ditch the polo's.

You missed the biggest benefit, FREE CHILDCARE!!!!!

Especially if you go to the late service in the morning, drop the kids off in child care, then sneak out with your wife for an early lunch while the kids are at church

Church is for women and children.

There's pretty much no perfect church...or, at least perfect enough for me

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7thGenTexan
posted 10:08p, 01/07/14



Church is for women and children.

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I love you, man. Half the joy of reading threads lately has been to see why 2 cents you have decided to grace it with.

Good stuff.

Appreciate it Silent. We forgot about covered dish dinner Sundays though. Attendance by men is almost obligatory.

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You're obviously going to get a different answers. Me personally, yes. I don't even think you have to call it Christianity.
You will be told that you do, and that if you don't follow the laws and believe in Jesus you will be going to hell, but as I asked in my other thread, says who? How do we know one text is right and another is wrong, or if in fact any are correct.

What kind of deity are we talking about? Do we even need one to be good humanists? I know PLENTY of pretty abhorrent so called Christians, and I also know some lovely ones. Are the a-holes still in luck when they die?

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London, it is Not that difficult to understand. Let me lay it out for you.

1) For everyone across the world are all born born different with unique talents/gifts and challenges to overcome. One size does not fit all. There are lots of ways to Pray, Lots of Way of Love.

2) God (Jesus) whatever you call him wants you to Love. That is it. Just love. This means obeying the natural laws that are written in your heart- " The Golden Rule". This also includes loving God (letting him into your heart).

3) So do the best you can with the life God has given you (no matter how long you live, when you live, if you are healthy or sick, rich or poor, black or white, or born with great affable/social skills). Be the Light to the world. Agape Love is wanting the good of others; Love is also letting God into your heart. Are you serving yourself(ME/ME) or rather are you serving others?

When you have Anger, Hate, Worry in your heart you are on the wrong path. When it is All about Me (Power, Fame, Glory, Lying and Cheating) you are on the wrong path.

4)Let God/ Jesus into your heart and start the process of Loving.

bb91 always takes the concrete literal path...

I go to a church where you feel pressured to act like you have it all together
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Like everywhere else...

I recommend you do a shot of Bacardi 150 before you walk into the early service.

You should attend a non-denominational church, the Catholic Church (we are NOT a denomination). Only there can you get the grace filled sacraments, a share in divine life from Jesus Christ.

Thad,

Yes the Catholic church has so much to offer (on this we agree), but it is not the only way to salvation, when we say this we limit what Jesus/God can do. Jesus himself says that we are all Brothers in Christ. We need to unite all Christians, not divide.

Mark 9 38-41

John said to him,l “Teacher, we saw someone driving out demons in your name, and we tried to prevent him because he does not follow us.” 39Jesus replied, “Do not prevent him. There is no one who performs a mighty deed in my name who can at the same time speak ill of me. 40For whoever is not against us is for us.m 41Anyone who gives you a cup of water to drink because you belong to Christ, amen, I say to you, will surely not lose his reward.

Paul says the same thing 1 Corthinans 1: 10-13
I urge you, brothers and sisters, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ,
that all of you agree in what you say,
and that there be no divisions among you,
but that you be united in the same mind and in the same purpose.
For it has been reported to me about you, my brothers and sisters,
by Chloe’s people, that there are rivalries among you.
I mean that each of you is saying,
“I belong to Paul,” or “I belong to Apollos,”
or “I belong to Cephas,” or “I belong to Christ.”
Is Christ divided?
Was Paul crucified for you?
Or were you baptized in the name of Paul?
For Christ did not send me to baptize but to preach the gospel

I agree....But since Jesus did set it up, I don't see why anyone would prefer a tradition of man denomination from Luther or Calvin to it...

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Edited because I feel like I am probably wrong and wanted to vent.

Long story short, can a person love the Lord, but dislike organized denominations withing Christianity?

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I have a degree in Bible so my opinion counts more. Just kidding, it was a waste-o-time.


But yeah, Christ's Bride (the Church) is, well, she can be a heinous bi tch.


You are not alone in your difficulties; however there is NO simple bumper-sticker-answer to your question. I recommend investigating Henri Nouwen and Philip Yancy’s Soul Survivor: How my Faith Survived the Church.


It’s always weak when someone poses a question of real spiritual dilemma and then your minister says, “oh you should read this.” It’s usually because they don’t know how to handle the subject matter. But I’m NOT a minister anymore and I don’t know you from Adam so I’m say’n, “oh read this book.”

Only the Catholic Church offers the daily bread from heaven we all pray for in the Our Father...

To oversimplify: shop.

Visit several churches and find one that's a good fit for you. That's why there are so many different churches. Even though I'm a Baptist myself, I'm certainly not going to tell you that it's the answer for you. It works for me, and that's where I'll be in ten hours and fifty minutes.

Happy hunting.

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Only the Catholic Church offers the daily bread from heaven we all pray for in the Our Father...

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Bread of life seems quite different than our daily bread, which seems to be physical food for the nourishment of our physical body.

While many Catholic churches have soup kitchens, so do many nonCatholic churches.