East of Eden

3,509 Views | 31 Replies | Last: 9 days ago by JDUB08AG
javajaws
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Surprised nobody is talking about this. I admittedly have not read the book, but for me this was a 10/10. Haven't really been a fan of Florence Pugh either but I think she knocked it out of the park on this.

This really leaves something in your head when you're done watching it, highly recommend it.

Its hard to pick a favorite anything out of this...but Hoon Lee as Lee was absolutely great. As was Pugh's psychotic and almost x-rated performance.
"Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety." - Ben Franklin
Philo B 93
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I read the book recently. I was curious how they'd portray the ex-wife. She was the most interesting part of the book. I haven't seen the Netflix series yet
PooDoo
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Isn't that a bad movie with Dan Akroyd and Rosie ODonnell?
FriendlyAg
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Philo B 93 said:

I read the book recently. I was curious how they'd portray the ex-wife. She was the most interesting part of the book. I haven't seen the Netflix series yet


They tried to humanize her slightly. They made it seem like she was the victim of SA as a child as opposed to the one that manipulated and orchestrated it. I thought it was going to be worse based on the previews and the show runner calling her an anti-hero.

I agree with OP. Florence Pugh nailed it.

The actors for Adam and Charles were backwards from a physical appearance stand point.

Otherwise I thought it was pretty close to the book.

Would have liked more Lee and more Samuel, but overall good show.
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citizenkane06
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I love the James Dean version directed by Elia Kazan. I'm curious to see how this compares.
bonfarr
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Ok you sold me at psychotic and almost x-rated. On my watchlist.
StinkyPinky
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One book I still haven't read that surprises me to this day that I haven't. Need to read it, but plan to read Count of Monte Cristo first.
Speaking of Steinbeck, I just finished his novella The Moon Is Down. Quick read that felt over hyped, but goad I read it nonetheless-the-less.
Mat Lanticus
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PooDoo said:

Isn't that a bad movie with Dan Akroyd and Rosie ODonnell?
lol that sh-tshow was "Exit to
Eden."

I read that book probably a few years ago before I should have hot on the heels of the interview with the vampire Anne rice craze.

Reflecting back on Anne Rice, she's just not a very good writer to me.
Queso1
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Florence Pugh is gorgeous
Scotts Tot
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As someone familiar with the book, my perspective here is strongly influenced by Steinbeck's source material. There were some ups and downs for me…

The good:

- Looked beautiful

- Acting was nails. Almost all the characters were spot-on. Much will be said about Florence Pugh, but the others did well too. The actor who played Adam hit the right note of blind idealism followed by gloomy despondency, and back again. Sam and Lee were also both awesome, especially Lee.

- The show stuck to Steinbeck's plot pretty faithfully, with the exception of some small tweaks that drastically altered the narrative (more on that next).

The bad:

- In the source material, Cathy Ames is an unrepentant monster, absolutely heinous, manipulative, and evil. Steinbeck intentionally omits any trauma or victimization in the character, as she serves the overall narrative as a caricature of pure evil, unjustified in her twisted worldview, essentially the serpent in the garden. Zoe Kazan's Cathy is something altogether different. She is a victim. Perhaps this is not surprising, and I won't get too anti-woke here, but in today's environment I guess we can't just have a female antagonist whose evil wasn't the result of some trauma set on by a patriarchal father or abusive man. For someone unfamiliar with the book it probably won't come across as smack-you-in-the-face feminism, but the few small details they added to Cathy's story entirely remade the character in my opinion.

- Sam Hamilton is an awesome character, and he could have received a lot more airtime. In fact the whole Hamilton family arc is pretty much omitted. I know there is a lot of material to cover from an epic novel, but it's really a shame to give that character the short shrift, because he is terrific in the novel. He serves as the virtuous mainstay who anchors the Trasks with his wisdom. In the show he just gets a few minor appearances.
Philo B 93
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Scotts Tot said:




- In the source material, Cathy Ames is an unrepentant monster, absolutely heinous, manipulative, and evil. Steinbeck intentionally omits any trauma or victimization in the character, as she serves the overall narrative as a caricature of pure evil, unjustified in her twisted worldview, essentially the serpent in the garden. Zoe Kazan's Cathy is something altogether different. She is a victim. Perhaps this is not surprising, and I won't get too anti-woke here, but in today's environment I guess we can't just have a female antagonist whose evil wasn't the result of some trauma set on by a patriarchal father or abusive man. For someone unfamiliar with the book it probably won't come across as smack-you-in-the-face feminism, but the few small details they added to Cathy's story entirely remade the character in my opinion.


I don't like hearing this. The one thing I took away from the book is that some people are just born evil. Unfortunately that's the world we live in. The book made me realize this. Over my half century here, I realized I've met a handful of those people. Not a lot, but maybe 9 or 10 people who were just born bad. They were raised right by good people, but their soul is corrupted. We don't need to blame everything on childhood trauma or abuse. If people can be born smart or dumb or with nine fingers or blind, then the book made me realize that someone can be born flat out evil. I'm sad they didn't let that come out in the series.
Scotts Tot
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Indeed. If memory serves, in the chapter Steinbeck introduces Cathy, he dedicates a few introductory paragraphs to describe your point exactly, that some people are simply monsters. Ultimately, Cathy's pure evil serves Steinbeck's narrative by providing Cal a mirror in which to glimpse parts of himself, and finally determine whether the evil in his own psyche is inherited from his mother, or if he has the freedom to be his own man and choose the right path. It's just not as interesting when her evil was actually brought on by circumstances.
tx1c
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PooDoo said:

Isn't that a bad movie with Dan Akroyd and Rosie ODonnell?


The poster above corrected the name.
But you must not have watched long enough to enjoy Dana Delaney.
veryfuller
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Staff
AG
Interestingly, Zoe Kazan, the writer/showrunner is his granddaughter.
MookieBlaylock
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PooDoo said:

Isn't that a bad movie with Dan Akroyd and Rosie ODonnell?


Rosie ofoneel in bondage leathers can never be unseen

horror story
surfandturfsbisa96
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tx1c said:

PooDoo said:

Isn't that a bad movie with Dan Akroyd and Rosie ODonnell?


The poster above corrected the name.
But you must not have watched long enough to enjoy Dana Delaney.

She is hot, but not the best actress. I love Tombstone, but her scenes I skip over.
Rigs
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It's been 25 years, but I loved this book for some reason.
Queso1
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Pretty good so far. On around episode 4 or 5.
The Milkman
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javajaws said:

Surprised nobody is talking about this. I admittedly have not read the book, but for me this was a 10/10. Haven't really been a fan of Florence Pugh either but I think she knocked it out of the park on this.

This really leaves something in your head when you're done watching it, highly recommend it.

Its hard to pick a favorite anything out of this...but Hoon Lee as Lee was absolutely great. As was Pugh's psychotic and almost x-rated performance.

Its X-rated level raunchy? With Florence Pugh maybe I will tune in afterall
anaggiemom
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S
I am an oldie but goodie - read this book probably 60 years ago. One of my all time favorites. If you can find the James Dean movie watch it.
javajaws
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The Milkman said:

javajaws said:

Surprised nobody is talking about this. I admittedly have not read the book, but for me this was a 10/10. Haven't really been a fan of Florence Pugh either but I think she knocked it out of the park on this.

This really leaves something in your head when you're done watching it, highly recommend it.

Its hard to pick a favorite anything out of this...but Hoon Lee as Lee was absolutely great. As was Pugh's psychotic and almost x-rated performance.

Its X-rated level raunchy? With Florence Pugh maybe I will tune in afterall


It's actually not too bad. A few good scenes here and there. She does show off some riding skills...without a horse lol.
"Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety." - Ben Franklin
docb
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Just finished the series last night. I thought it was really good.
Trident 88
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I'm not reading this thread in case there are spoilers. I have 2 episodes left, and I'm enthralled. It would be very difficult for the casting and acting to be improved. However, I especially wanted to say that while I've enjoyed Hoon Lee in Your Friends and Neighbors and other shows, THIS is the performance that has made me a true fan of this actor.
Mayor West
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You should watch Warrior
Trident 88
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I have and really enjoyed it. He has always been good, but for w/e reason, East of Eden is where I finally recognized how much I enjoy his acting.
GoAgs92
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Queso1 said:

Florence Pugh is gorgeous

I find her lip filler and botox a bit distracting.

she is still hot but doesn't need those things at all...she doesn't even have thin lips in the first place
Queso1
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I didn't find her as attractive in this show. She pulled a kind of Drew Barrymore - hot one day and not the other. But she was pretty good looking in the Thunderbolts.
Btron
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Scotts Tot said:

Indeed. If memory serves, in the chapter Steinbeck introduces Cathy, he dedicates a few introductory paragraphs to describe your point exactly, that some people are simply monsters. Ultimately, Cathy's pure evil serves Steinbeck's narrative by providing Cal a mirror in which to glimpse parts of himself, and finally determine whether the evil in his own psyche is inherited from his mother, or if he has the freedom to be his own man and choose the right path. It's just not as interesting when her evil was actually brought on by circumstances.

I'm not directly quoting, but in this series of pages Steinbeck describes humans as having birth defects, then asks the question: are souls defective? Can someone's soul be made evil or deformed at birth? Also, when we first get introduced to Cathy, she's half dead. As a reader, it was probably because she wronged the wrong person and paid for that. It's her own doing. I never interpreted it as though she was a victim in that sense, but as a result of her evil actions.

If you all like Lee, another recommendation for Warrior, which all episodes are on HBO. Think of Warrior is Gangs of New York, but in San Franscio and more Chinese. But great political, action, sexy drama. There is lots of sex fyi.

KidDoc
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Really good movie and I agree that Lee was a really good character and well acted.

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JDUB08AG
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For those that read the book, how did you feel about Cal's portrayal? I didn't read the book, but it seemed like they tried to portray him as having similar traits as Cathy but it just didn't seem to hit the mark like it may have in the book. I could be way wrong but just an observation.
Scotts Tot
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JDUB08AG said:

For those that read the book, how did you feel about Cal's portrayal? I didn't read the book, but it seemed like they tried to portray him as having similar traits as Cathy but it just didn't seem to hit the mark like it may have in the book. I could be way wrong but just an observation.

I thought the handling of Cal was fine, but having already known the character from Steinbeck, I could see how someone new to the story might not really see how he is supposed to fit into the overall narrative.

In the source material, he realizes he has a wicked streak (unlike his brother), and is kind of tortured by this question of whether it's just in his nature and beyond his control. It become exacerbated by meeting his mother and learning her nature, which I won't describe for the sake of spoilers, but if you've watched the show you get the idea.

The whole theme relating to the Cain and Abel story and the Hebrew translation of "timshel", which is the major underlying theme of the novel, comes to a head with Cal.
JDUB08AG
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Yeah I definitely got that from the show. I guess my point was I don't think they portrayed that very well. He never really showed an evil streak anywhere close to Cathy. But again, maybe I'm just missing something.

Regardless, I thought it was very well done. Great acting all around.
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