Also, a friend of mine had a pretty intriguing theory afterward. Maybe this is common knowledge/speculation, but...

Eliza's given last name was Esposito (an Argentinian name by way of Italy) and the creature came from South America. Because of that connection, my buddy was saying that the scratches on her neck might not have been just scars that the creature turned into gills, but could have been actual, dormant gills, and the creature essentially "activated" them in the end. In other words, Eliza, an orphan, may have actually been a descendant of one of the creatures, or was the result of a human/creature hybrid, hence her mute-ness. And she was basically returning "home" in the end.

Honestly, the sex thing was pretty minor for me overall. It was more that I guess I expected the breakout to be the final act, and then once that happened halfway through, the narrative just lost so much steam for me. Maybe if I were to watch it again, knowing the structure, I'd have a more positive reaction. That said, I definitely liked it more than disliked it.

Are people defending beastiality? Is my sarcasm meter broken? I admit I might be off since I have been sick and haven't slept the last two nights, but this is plain weird.

And TCCTS, why are you even questioning Natasha Henstridge? Even my wife would be my wingman for her and push me towards Natasha.

Winning the PGA I'd say it might be the front runner now.

I really liked it but agree the sex aspect was unnecessary, but the conversation with Octavia Spencer was funny. Also I've always thought Sally Hawkins was pretty odd looking but after seeing the goods I thought "Wow, she's actually pretty hot!" Lol

It's definitely a weird year. A lot of movies I liked but zero really that just blew me away. There are 6-7 movies that could win BP and I wouldn't be mad. I don't even really have one I'm rooting for.

Pan's Labrynth is a top 10 movie for me. I liked this one and thought the poem at the end was very touching but it doesn't approach Pan's for me.

TCTTS said:

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Hmmm. Finally saw this tonight and while I absolutely loved the first half (a top ten movie of the year at that point), the second half kind of lost steam for me. There needed to be more buildup to the breakout and less of the stuff after. It just kept going and going, and getting weirder and weirder toward the end. I loved the production design and I loved Sally Hawkins' and Michael Shannon's performances, but this one just didn't really do it for me overall. The creature sex didn't help either. I guess I don't have a problem with it in theory, but it just felt weird, forced, and unnecessary.

That said, the movie itself seems to be legitimately gaining steam as a potential Best Picture front-runner. I can't remember a field ever being this wide open this late in the game, especially one where a movie featuring a woman ****ing a fish (multiple times) has a real chance of winning it all.

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It's the weakest Best Picture class in recent memory for sure.

ATM1876 said:

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I have a lengthy post on the previous page on why, in this one particular R-rated fairy tale, I don't consider it bestiality in the sense that most people think of when they hear that word. I'd classify it more as interspecies sex but recognize that a lot of people will fail to see the difference, especially when they haven't seen the movie.

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The two trailers made it look like two different movies. The first made it look like a romance between a fish thing and a human, which was underwhelming. The second trailer made it look Ike a Cold War espionage film, which played like a whole different film. I thought that the change in tone must've been a production move, because no way would there be a love scene between a fish and a woman.

Oh, I was wrong. The uneasiness in the pit of my stomach was painful. We somehow went from Brokeback Mountain to full on fish-human love in a span of barely a decade. I can't help but think people's reactions would be different if it had been a humanoid dog instead of a humanoid fish.

How is the love scene any different from any of their science fiction movie or book? Strange topics c to latch on to. I thought the movie was Ok. It left me wanting more, but not really wanting more just that it felt like somethings my was missing. Much like Three Billboards.

Ragoo said:

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How is the love scene any different from any of their science fiction movie or book? Strange topics c to latch on to. I thought the movie was Ok. It left me wanting more, but not really wanting more just that it felt like somethings my was missing. Much like Three Billboards.

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I agree completely: I thought both films were somehow incomplete. I don't exactly know what though. I know not everyone will have the same opinion, but my wife and I didn't even think twice about whatever it is you guys think was wrong about the amazon fishman and the woman. All of the physical interactions were implied minus an embrace.

And it's funny that so many people, on this thread in particular, are caught up in that. The antagonists aggressively and coldly has sex with his wife...a one way thoughtless encounter while both are people. An old man is considered inhuman or disgusting by a restaurant waiter. And here you see there is more kindness between two beings than two people.

evan_aggie said:

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Ragoo said:

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How is the love scene any different from any of their science fiction movie or book? Strange topics c to latch on to. I thought the movie was Ok. It left me wanting more, but not really wanting more just that it felt like somethings my was missing. Much like Three Billboards.

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I agree completely: I thought both films were somehow incomplete. I don't exactly know what though. I know not everyone will have the same opinion, but my wife and I didn't even think twice about whatever it is you guys think was wrong about the amazon fishman and the woman. All of the physical interactions were implied minus an embrace.

And it's funny that so many people, on this thread in particular, are caught up in that. The antagonists aggressively and coldly has sex with his wife...a one way thoughtless encounter while both are people. An old man is considered inhuman or disgusting by a restaurant waiter. And here you see there is more kindness between two beings than two people.

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If you're asking which is more disgusting between:

1. Aggressive, mindless sex with the wife
2. A homophobe
3. A woman having sex with a fish.

I'm going to take fish every day of the week and twice on Sunday. Acceptance is great and all, but the line has to be drawn somewhere. I draw it at sex with fish.

I get your point but do you see them have sex? I don't actually remember them locking lips either. I know they hug each other while naked.

Sex Panther said:

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I didn't want to see it at all because it just didn't look interesting to me, and I haven't enjoyed a Del Toro movie in a while.

Then I started hearing about how great it was, so it piqued my interest again.


But then I started hearing about the bestiality stuff... that is just ****ing weird.

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Odd since your handle is sex panther.

MW03 said:

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Sex Panther said:

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Ok, new thread topic for the E-Board

Name all the things, animals, and fictional creatures you would ****

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I always thought this scene was ad-libbed by Dana, Mike's reaction and laugh seemed too genuine. Awesome.

annie88 said:

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MW03 said:

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Sex Panther said:

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Ok, new thread topic for the E-Board

Name all the things, animals, and fictional creatures you would ****

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I always thought this scene was ad-libbed by Dana, Mike's reaction and laugh seemed too genuine. Awesome.

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From a Rolling Stone article about the movie:

Quote:

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At the Academy's Wayne's World reunion, Carvey says that Spheeris's best contribution to the project was her willingness to let everyone improvise, so long as they kept to her tight schedule. ("If you can do it in 26 seconds, we can keep it in the movie" was her motto.) As a result, a lot of the picture's most-quoted jokes weren't in the script. When Wayne orders "Cream of Sum Yung Guy" for Chinese takeout, none of Myers' cast-mates knew that was what he was going to say; and Spheeris and her editors later had to find a way to cut around the other characters' guffaws, while also piecing together enough silent reaction shots to allow the viewers a chance to enjoy one of the film's biggest laugh-lines.

Neither Carvey nor Myers had much experience with film shoots prior to Wayne's World, so Spheeris tried to keep them comfortable by letting them work they way they did on SNL, where they could change sketches right up to the moment they went on the air or even sometimes while they were live. One of the movie's sweetest and funniest moments has Wayne and Garth lying on the hood of a car and philosophizing ("Did you ever find Bugs Bunny attractive when he put on a dress and played a girl bunny?") while watching planes overhead. This was all shot quickly on the last day, and almost completely improvised one last chance for the actors to throw in whatever else they wanted to before wrapping production.

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Dana Carvey and Mike Myers are brilliant.

I knew it! Hadn't read that before, but his reaction was just too real. Thanks for posting.

Just saw it tonight and really did not care for it. Maybe I had too high of expectations. I wouldn't say I hated it but I definitely can't say I liked it very much either. And I thought the sex with the fish was pretty offputting, or at least distracting. I don't think it added anything to the film other than my wife looking over at me and saying "what the ****" a few times.

Just watched it on a flight. All the sex scenes were deleted. Didn't realize this until I read this thread.

Boooooo Delta!

Southlake said:

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Just watched it on a flight. All the sex scenes were deleted. Didn't realize this until I read this thread.

Boooooo Delta!

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Saw it on Delta tonight so i missed out on the fish sex.

It was Splash except the genders were reversed. When Dr. Doback/Giles fell asleep i kinda expected them to find Aquaman at Bloomingdales learning English.

*shrug*

So this is on HBO for anyone that hasn't seen this yet and has any interest, I saw it this weekend. I don't know how this won best picture, and I found plenty of positives. I really thought the acting was solid, super impressed with Sally Hawkins, she was so good. As far as the story goes it's just nit-picky things, nothing major. Overall it was good, definitely a love story from Guillermo del Toro. I haven't seen Pan's Labyrinth in a while so I don't know if that or The Shape of Water is better, perhaps I need to watch it again.

I'd give it a solid B+, but how this won best picture I don't get it. Of the pictures I saw last year I definitely thought Dunkirk and Ladybird were better. Three billboards had a shot, but it was just missing something to take it over the top.

It's worth your time to check it out if you're slightly interested, the potential turn-offs are well documented in this thread so I don't need to go through them.