I really liked Cottonmouth. It was an interesting choice to take him out when they did.

I loved the look of the series. The music was fantastic. Most of the actors were fabulous (Diamondback was ridiculously bad).

Here's my biggest problem with the series: it lasted about three episodes too long. There truly was not enough story to warrant 13 episodes and it really suffered when Cottonmouth died. The last few episodes were kind of a blur because they really weren't necessary.

Diamondback was probably the worst villain in the MCU. His motivations made sense, but his schemes were just wildly bad and didn't make any sense. At all. That really hurts this series.

Then, there's the ending: well....it was an ending, that's for sure. Not good; not bad...just there.

Here's what I wanted to see: Claire calls up her lawyer-friend while Misty stalls the release of Cage to the feds. Before Cage can be taken outside, his new lawyer (a blind man) stops them and announces that he's filing a federal lawsuit against Seagate Prison and the state of Georgia for their human rights violations against his client. The suit is filed in New York, so Cage will be remanded to a New York prison until the trial. (Of course, I'm not a lawyer so some of this may have to be changed).

Thus, Luke Cage meets Matt Murdock.

I think they're saving those crossovers for later on. I wanted some cameos at the end of Jessica Jones or Daredevil season 2 but I guess it would have been too weird to anyone that hadn't seen the other shows.

They had to get him out of Harlem somehow. Otherwise you have a bonafide superhero and town celebrity that everyone knows, and he's just... hanging around until the Defenders? The government isn't trying to get him on their payroll, or exploit him for the secrets his body might contain, and so on? How does this stay a Harlem story if he's still out and about and everyone knows it - he'd become the biggest name in America since Tony Stark.

But I guess he won't, because he just disappeared one day. May be kind of a folk hero now but not a "oh go talk to that guy down the street" kind of thing.

I dunno, just my interpretation of it. But in my mind they had to get him out of Harlem by the end of it.

Okay, Daredevil is still by far the winner, but I liked Luke Cage more then JJ

I think y'all are crazy, I loved Shades..I just wish that he wore them more often instead of just taking them on and off a bunch,

I HATED Mariah at first and thought she was super whiny and redundant, but by the end I loved her. Great character arch there.

Also loooove the Shades/Mariah kiss. Perfect. The end scene at Harlem's paradise was great to me. (although I would have put Mariah in something just a cinch more sexed up)

I thought the show picked up the pace nicely. I did hate Diamondback and I hope he doesn't come back. He is boring. The only way I like him is if he comes back with bigger friends or being manipulated/controlled by doctor guy or somethnig.

LC and Claire had good chemistry but I was still hoping to get some affection towards JJ. I wish they had at least asked what she was up to right now or something.

Mama Mabel was terrifying and great.

Copperhead was great and I LOVED the shock and twist of his death.

For the most part, costuming was good. Set design was great.

If the entire show had absolutely sucked it would be worth it for the Long Live the Chief intro,

Bobby Fisher's character was fantastic. As was pop. I really ilked the Method Man bit and the bullet hole hoodies, because it felt like something that would really happen. Sway and MM would say that and guys would say yes this is the new fashion. Plus, it looks pretty sick.

Overall, started slow, ended awesome. Some really bade dialogue, but also some pretty great lines.

Yeah the more I think about it, it isn't just that the dialogue is corny, but diamondback may be one of the dumbest marvel villains in the history of their current universe. How he thought he was going to get out of the hostage situation and the fight in the middle of the street is beyond me. Even shades was looking at him like dude are you serious? They tried to play him off as a psychopath, but villains are usually high functioning psychopaths, aka the joker.

Diamondback drags the show down heavily with his dialogue and stupidity making it very boring and his motivations maybe slightly better than Lex Luthor (who had none) from BvS.

I cringed when I saw the doctor go into his hospital room and thought please god let him die during their experiments.

That's why I like Shades so much. He's clever.

Shocked at the overall positive reception. Luke and Claire were the only characters I liked at all.

This felt poorly made for the most part, and as most have said, totally fell off a cliff in the second half.

Overall, not anywhere near as good as Daredevil or JJ. I am looking forward to Luke, Jessica, and Matt Murdock in the same scene. Hopefully Iron Fist will be better.

I agree with you 100%. It felt like a chore having to finish the last few episodes. I liked Luke and Cottonmouth as a side villain but didn't care for anyone else.

I think this one is definitely the worst of the three. I really really enjoyed both seasons of Daredevil and thought JJ was just alright except for Killgrave who was awesome.

I wasn't a big fan of the ending either. I'm not sure why Shades is so happy, isn't he out on bail? Even if they can't charge him a lot of stuff he still assaulted a police officer. .

Are there Marvel guys who can speak to the Diamondback character? For me, it was really just him that I didn't like. I loved Cottonmouth but he got a bit fixated on Cage too fast (willing give up too much to get him) plus the cash all in one place was dumb to me. After the flashback scenes, I kept expecting Mariah to turn out to be the big bad. Liked Shades. Oh and I LOVED the swear can although it got forgotten in the last couple episodes - even back in the shop.

I would rank this 4th but mainly because DD is DD (and the Punisher - come on!) and I loved the Bad in JJ - my #1 Bad in the MCU - big or small screen. Still better than most TV though.

And RSJ is a fan. ...

Reflecting on this show now, I would actually rank this behind both DD and JJ. The show just fell apart the second half of the season. That isn't to say it wasn't enjoyable, but *******, Diamondback was turrible.

That said, RSJ needs to go watch Stranger Things.

Uggghh! Just slogged my way through all 13 episodes. I really wanted to like this show, but at best its a 5 out of 10.

I don't even need to mention how horrible Diamondback was - as a villian, as a character, the acting, the writing....just every aspect of him.

Shades and Cottonmouth were decent. But the real villian should have been Black Mariah. She should have been the reincarnation of her mother...a female version of Fisk, scary in her devious machinations and ruthlessness and unpredictability. They made her way too weak. Sure she may have evolved to that at the end, but the show would have been better off with her as the main villian all along.

And I absolutely hated, HATED the Misty Knight character. Extremely cheesy writing (both actions and dialogue) and extremely ham-handed acting.

Just bad writing for 90% of the show....I mean c'mon, when a show uses the tired movie cliche of a SWAT team leader who thinks he just shows up and takes charge, doesn't use his brain, and wants to simply rush in guns a blazing "kicking ass and sorting out the good guys from the bad later", that's the sign of weak, lazy writing.

Gotta agree with a few others, Luke Cage himself was good (could have been better with better writing); Claire was good; but the only memorable standout was the music. That opening scene of Episode 5 - the montage over Long Live the Chief - was fantastic, as was the Method Man bit. But the rest of the show failed to live up to those few scenes.

does the actor who plays Luke Cage walk with a limp? every now and then, it seemed like he had an odd hitch in his gait. though the flashback to his childhood in the church I think also showed young Carl with a mild limp. ps- anyone else notice all the carhartt products?

bearamedic99 said:

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does the actor who plays Luke Cage walk with a limp? every now and then, it seemed like he had an odd hitch in his gait. though the flashback to his childhood in the church I think also showed young Carl with a mild limp. ps- anyone else notice all the carhartt products?

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I want that hoodie.

I really liked Luke Cage overall.
Parts of it were flat.
Diamondback's suit at the end was lousy.
The Priscilla character got better.
The music was pretty good. Liked the scenes where they performed in the club.
Really liked Misty Knight.

I liked that they went for, what felt like, two seasons in one, with the first half of the season culminating in Cottonmouth's death. Unfortunately they didn't pull off the second half as well as they had the chances to. A Justin Hammer is Diamondback reveal, or tighter, clearer involvement of Hammer in all of this would have helped. Maria's development was good, and I am looking forward to her and Shades running the Harlem mob together, and hopefully Fisk coming in and having a say.

Point about Shades: it seems like anyone who has watch Sons of Anarchy hated him, and those who have not liked him. I thought he was great - my favorite villain in the season (might not be saying much). I found interesting the call outs to Obama, although in the MCU there's a different president (completely understand and agree with assuming Obama is the prez in this MCU, though).

I think everyone's points about Diamondback are fair, although I actually like his super-suit at the end. Had an interesting 70s vibe to it, and was a soft, absorbing suit, rather than a hard one.

To me, the issue was around how the production felt at times. It almost felt like there was some difference in editing, or disagreement in how blaxplotation to take it. They tried to balance the blaxploitation homage with a modern look and feel, but they just didn't play it off right. The best time to go full 70s (I mean really commit) would have been in the fight scenes - throw in a few mis-timed camera cuts, a couple fake screams, and a lens zoom and we would, at the least, have been talking about the fight scenes as unique and memorable instead of forgettable and lacking, but likely talking about how cool they were.

Still, it was enjoyable (except nearly every Misty Knight scene, which all seemed to drag [I mean how many times can she f up and expect us to think of her as a good-guy?]), although felt more like it was preparing for future seasons.

And how good was that Long Live the Chief scene?


A better rendition than the original, too.

aTmLoKi said:

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The only other thing that really bothered me was how BLM this series was

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Anybody mind explaining this thought to me (seen a couple posts about it)? It's Luke Cage, I'm not sure what else would be expected. I mean, his very origin is textbook blaxploitation.

Set in a Harlem that was under the thumb of gang violence and such, I thought the tone was appropriate. In fact, good for Marvel for not putting the rich white guy behind the scenes, pulling the strings.

Completely agree. The undertone and statements on society made in Luke Cage belong there, and if not in a show like this then where?

I thought if they succeeded at anything, it was having a delicate balance of BLM and blaxploitation without making viewers feel like they were looking at propaganda. They didn't make cops or white people look evil, but they didn't make them look particularly good either. Even the dirty white cop wasn't portrayed as a racist.

I thought they did a GREAT job with that and the Method Man scenes were totally realistic.

Like everyone else, I loved the first 2/3 of the series. Totally hooked and was great. The "ending" was awful. Best thing about Daredevil and JJ first runs were the completely contained storylines. They weren't expecting another run, so they tied everything up. This time around they clearly expected to have more than one season, so they left a ton of cliffhangers. Every scene after the Diamondback/Cage fight could have ended with a "to be continued", and that always drives me up the wall.

I liked the uniqueness of each series. Daredevil did the brooding, conflicted, vulnerable hero thing really well. JJ did the hero with PTSD facing down her past thing really well. Luke Cage did cheesy blaxploitation really well. Cage is supposed to be an unstoppable badass, his villian is supposed to be cheesy as hell, the costumes are supposed to be terrible, and the BLM stuff was right up that alley. Those are all genre call-backs to cheesy 70's blaxploitation movies. Fisher making fun of Diamondback "what are you supposed to be, a pimp stormtrooper?" was awesome and spot on. It was a tribute.

Fingers crossed for Iron Fist as a Marvel tribute to kung fu movies

the terribleness of the Diamondback costume actually didn't bother me at all. This guy was kinda oddly twisted in a southern baptist old fashioned preacher sorta way, so to have a costume that looked kinda dated and over the top in his own fashion seemed kinda fitting...the fact taht it was immediately made fun of also made it really okay.

swimmerbabe11 said:

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the terribleness of the Diamondback costume actually didn't bother me at all. This guy was kinda oddly twisted in a southern baptist old fashioned preacher sorta way, so to have a costume that looked kinda dated and over the top in his own fashion seemed kinda fitting...the fact taht it was immediately made fun of also made it really okay.

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Didn't think about it that way before, but this makes sense.

Quote:

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"what are you supposed to be, a pimp stormtrooper?"

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So terrible. I don't know how any of you liked that. I feel like you're blinded by the Marvel logo. This is proof they aren't infallible... Just awful all around. Cheesy and cheap looking. Crappy fights, horrible acting and dialogue.... Misty Knight was terrible. Diamondback? Good lord that guy sucks... Hell Luke Cage wasn't even that good. Felt like I was watching Carlton Banks try to be "Harlem"... That big dude on Agents of Shield would've been a way better choice.

Only good things were Cottonmouth (and they killed him halfway through), the music, and Shades was actually ok.

Really hope Iron Fist doesn't suck like this. But Pops would've been pissed because Marvel/Netflix just went way backwards.

A lot of what you didn't like, is what I really liked. The show had a blaxploitation feel to it that was fun to watch. Diamondback felt like he was intentionally a throwback corny villain which was going to be hit or miss with fans. I do agree that Cottonmouth was a more compelling villain and should have been the main focus. Sucks that he can't be used anymore.

By no means is it perfect (could have benefitted from less episodes), but I very much enjoyed it and will probably enjoy it more and more on rewatches.

No, I actually liked what they were attempting with the Blaxploitation stuff. That had me excited. They just sucked at it... Diamondback wasn't corny on purpose. He was terrible because he was a terrible villain and actor. I've watched that guy be painful on screen since season 2 of Boardwalk Empire. I'm sure that's how the story goes down in the comics, but the midseason switch from Cottonmouth to Diamondback was clunky and contrived. And they aren't even in the same ballpark of actors.

The Blaxploitation was a good try. All of the Netflix shows feel the same, but each has their own unique niche they're taking on with an emphasis on the 70's it feels like.

Daredevil = Gritty
Jessica Jones = Pulpy Detective Noir
Luke Cage = Blaxploitation
Iron Fist = Kung Fu

But Luke Cage was awful and just boring. And I think it starts with Mike Colter. I just didn't think he was good at all. Him trying to act "street" was as fake to me as his terrible wig in prison. He also gave one of the worst line deliveries in tv history. Episode 4 when he's in the prison and fights off Shades and the other guy. Something like, "I'm not gonna take **** just cuz you're dishing it out ya hear!" I literally laughed out loud and rewound it a few times it was so comical.

Oh and don't get me started on the EVERYTHING IS CONNECTED!!! trope, that made this plot go from not good to embarrassingly horrible.

I liked Luke Cage in Jessica Jones. This show just honestly sucked. I keep trying to find redeeming qualities, but I can't. It's actually a shame that they even misused Cottonmouth's actor, because he was excellent in House of Cards.

Completely agree with SP and PatAg, this show was just plain bad. You can pretend it was corny on purpose but corny writing is different than bad writing and it doesn't excuse bad acting.

If this show came first, everybody would be rolling their eyes over Marvel missing the mark. But since it followed two awesome seasons of Dardevil and an above average season (villian especially) of Jessica Jones, everyone is giving it a pass and making excuses for it. If I never see the Diamondback actor or Misty Knight actress in something again it'll be too soon.

Misty is going to be in the Defenders in some capacity. I'll be curious to see if she's suddenly a lot more natural of an actress under better writing and direction.

I can't really disagree with anything said above. I wonder sometimes about Colter. He seems like a different character from the first episode of Jessica Jones to the rest of that show and this one. He's so straight that a lot of the street dialogue seemed forced. Like I didn't really buy that he was a Knicks fan or that he really preferred Bruce Lee to Jet Li. Maybe he's a huge fan - it just came across like someone wrote that dialogue for him, and it didn't really fit.

I've seen it said that he's so straight that he's like the Defenders' Captain America. I think that makes sense - it's just jarring to see Cap nerd out because he meets Method Man. Like it barely matches the character.

I don't know - I'm going to rewatch at some point. I think the problems are all in the writing and direction. A more skilled show runner might have elevated the series to what it intended to be, the MCU's Wire. Instead it's more like the MCU's Empire.

I guess I'm in the minority that actually liked Coulter as Cage. He reminded me of the character from the comics that I really like. He had a charm that I liked throughout the series that I didn't really see in Matt Murdock or Jessica Jones. That's just me though.

For me, the chemistry between Iron Fist and Luke Cage will be huge for future seasons as they transition to Hero For Hire.

So in the comics, he ends up charging people for his services correct? That is the only problem I had with Coulter, is that he seems to "Captain America-y" to ever make people pay for his help.

Yup, and we will see how they get that idea to come to fruition. Maybe it will be Iron Fist or Jessica Jones to get over that Captain America-ness.

Yeah, I worry about that a bit, themeatically. I felt like they HAD to get Luke out of Harlem by the end of this season, because having a legitimate superhuman just down the street from everyone is asking for trouble. The government would definitely try and use you, or recreate your secrets, or something like that.

There's literally no other case like it in the MCU, and for good reason. Tony Stark is the exception, but he's a high-level, inventor billionaire type. Someone down the street can't come asking him for help, and the government already tried in Iron Man 2. Also, any non-sanctioned superhero activity is now illegal.

Luke being out in the open and recognizable would be a problem, but now he's disappeared and is probably more of a folk legend than a guy you can legitimately go ask for help.

(I know Jessica may seem like the same thing, but I don't know how many people legitimately realize she can jump over a building or punch down a door. As far as most know, she's probably just a really good P.I. And maybe she's freaky strong, but not Hulk strong.)

Heroes for Hire seems like a point that we're not quite at yet in the MCU. You'd be world-famous for that, not just Netflix-famous. Probably more famous than half of the Avengers. What reporter wouldn't come knocking at your door? And how would that affect the film side of things? It wouldn't, and I think that would cause a bit of a continuity error.

My two cents.

I actually didn't like Jessica Jones that much.


Also,
Please remember, in the show, Luke Cage is not FROM Harlem. Reva was.

I actually like the actor as Cage. I think the writing/directing probably is to blame for a lot of this.

THe show creator/writer is Cheo Hodari Coker. From what IMDB says, he basically co-wrote Notorious, and then some other episodes for ****ty tv. Maybe they should have gone another route.