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Who is she gonna summon? She isn't the queen in Dorne or the Reach, she's not the queen of the North, or apparently the Vale, because for some reason all those guys cheered for ******* Jon Snow, deserter of the Night's Watch. No idea who is in charge of the Riverlands since Frey was murdered, but I guess since we seem to be going on the assumption that it's whatever random character takes it or who we happen to have seen before it might be Brutus Tully. Or it could be Arya since it seems like you can just murder someone and everybody will throw down and support you after killing their Lord.

Anyway it's just a very entertaining soap opera at this point, you can pretty much stop assuming that things are gonna make any kind of political or historical sense.

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Jon Snow deserter comment aside, this is fairly accurate. After a blatant terrorist attack on Kings Landing's most powerful aristocrats and religious leaders, Cersei is just able to claim the throne? No muss, no fuss? The show had gone to great lengths to depict how friendless she had become. Other than Franken-Mountain and Qyburn, why would anyone else support her claim after committing such an obvious atrocity? (That was my only quibble in an otherwise perfect season finale)

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I get that and I thought about it.

First, some time has passed between the Sept blowing up and her coronation - she has different outfits on. Not only that but Jamie also is wearing different armor than when he showed up and saw the destruction from the hill.

So I'm quite certain that he and Cersei have talked. He isn't happy about it all. But with the KL forces at his disposal we can assume that gave Cersei the military backing she needed to claim the throne and enforce her will.

In lieu of anyone else to rule Jamie would defer to her, at least in the interim. At least dramatically its the best thing. So potentially a lot went on behind the scenes that we were not shown but can assume for now.


Oh and one more thing......other than Qyburn.....who knows Cersei did it? She could blame it on Pycelle and/or Lancel. Perhaps thats why they made sure they were down below.

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I thought she was wearing the same Romulan cosplay with hairdo on coronation day that she wore on the day of her trial actually.

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No I posted the pics several pages back......

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First, some time has passed between the Sept blowing up and her coronation - she has different outfits on. Not only that but Jamie also is wearing different armor than when he showed up and saw the destruction from the hill.

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Acutally, this is wrong. When Jamie arrives to KLs the Sept is still billowing smoke. He arrived just after it occurred.

Haha, funny thing is that, as Zombie Jon Snow said, they actually DID confuse Raegar with Aerys in the other thread and were quickly shouted down. That got me thinking about how best to prove it wasn't Aerys, but I couldn't really come up with any proof. Then I watched After the Thrones and Jason Conception brought it up as well. Perhaps he's working under the same kind of circumstances, that nothing is PROVEN unless explicitly stated so he also sees the loop-hole in the show's world.

Granted, there's always the possibility that GRRM decides to make Jon's father Raegar in the books and D&D make Jon's father Aerys in the show. Wouldn't really change much, he'd still be a ******* Targ, but I venture to think the love story between Llyana and Raegar makes for better TV anyways so that would be an odd choice.

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Oh and one more thing......other than Qyburn.....who knows Cersei did it? She could blame it on Pycelle and/or Lancel. Perhaps thats why they made sure they were down below.

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Who would do this?
Who had the means to carry it out?
Who had the most to gain?
Why was Tommen and Cersei absent?

The answers to those questions only lead to Cersei. They may not have an corroborating witnesses, but the blame would be impossible to pass off.

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History belongs to those that write it.

Everyone that could be a witness is dead.

Cersei says - Lancel was supposed to come get me, but instead he threw Tommen out the window and then blew up the Sept. I was only protected by The Mountain so I graciously take my sons place as ruler.

Now I doubt that....but it's possible. I think it's just a matter of having the force or backup. Someone originally asked how she could take power with no friends. But as I said before Jamie was back with his army - and he may not be happy but at least now he seems to be supporting her. And the army is his. With the army and the Queensguard...done deal.

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First, some time has passed between the Sept blowing up and her coronation - she has different outfits on. Not only that but Jamie also is wearing different armor than when he showed up and saw the destruction from the hill.

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Acutally, this is wrong. When Jamie arrives to KLs the Sept is still billowing smoke. He arrived just after it occurred.

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Yes but you didn't read what I said or interpret it right....he is wearing something different at the Coronation.

that means time passed between when he showed up on the hill seeing the destruction. Yes that was the same day or soon after (could smolder for days actually). But the Coronation was some time later. Both he and Cersei are wearing different clothing and decor than she was on the trial day and he was when he showed up on the hill.

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First, some time has passed between the Sept blowing up and her coronation - she has different outfits on. Not only that but Jamie also is wearing different armor than when he showed up and saw the destruction from the hill.

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Acutally, this is wrong. When Jamie arrives to KLs the Sept is still billowing smoke. He arrived just after it occurred.

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I think he mean that Jaime is wearing a different outfit when he comes over the hill and sees the smoke than when he walks into the throne room to watch the coronation. Time has passed since he arrived back in KL and the coronation.

Edit: Ya, that ^^^

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First, some time has passed between the Sept blowing up and her coronation - she has different outfits on. Not only that but Jamie also is wearing different armor than when he showed up and saw the destruction from the hill.

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Acutally, this is wrong. When Jamie arrives to KLs the Sept is still billowing smoke. He arrived just after it occurred.

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Actually this is also wrong. You have no idea how long wildfyre will smulder for.

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First, some time has passed between the Sept blowing up and her coronation - she has different outfits on. Not only that but Jamie also is wearing different armor than when he showed up and saw the destruction from the hill.

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Acutally, this is wrong. When Jamie arrives to KLs the Sept is still billowing smoke. He arrived just after it occurred.

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I think he mean that Jaime is wearing a different outfit when he comes over the hill and sees the smoke than when he walks into the throne room to watch the coronation. Time has passed since he arrived back in KL and the coronation.

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BINGO

and I posted the Cersei pics. But I have not posted the Jamie pics. I can if you'd like.

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First, some time has passed between the Sept blowing up and her coronation - she has different outfits on. Not only that but Jamie also is wearing different armor than when he showed up and saw the destruction from the hill.

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Acutally, this is wrong. When Jamie arrives to KLs the Sept is still billowing smoke. He arrived just after it occurred.

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Yes but you didn't read what I said or interpret it right....he is wearing something different at the Coronation.

that means time passed between when he showed up on the hill seeing the destruction. Yes that was the same day or soon after (could smolder for days actually). But the Coronation was some time later. Both he and Cersei are wearing different clothing and decor than she was on the trial day and he was when he showed up on the hill.

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With the timeline discrepancies depicted in the show, we could argue almost any side. I see what you're saying.

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So you think Jon is a deserter? That's cute.

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Ummm, I don't think Jon is a deserter....because I watched the show. Do the other characters around westeros know he isn't a deserter because they watched the reruns or on their DVR too?

Then again the maesters who send and receive ravens all over the kingdom presumably including many from Lord Commander Jon Snow, never bothered to send that little tidbit back to HQ so maybe it's not even widely known that Jon Snow was ever even in the Night's watch with the logic of this show.

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Westeros as a whole is irrelevant, only the North matters in this context and to the North it won't matter if he is an Oath Breaker or a Zombie, he is the son of Ned Stark (as far as they know) and they would rather follow a Zombie ******* than other options at this point.

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Oh and one more thing......other than Qyburn.....who knows Cersei did it? She could blame it on Pycelle and/or Lancel. Perhaps thats why they made sure they were down below.

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Who would do this?
Who had the means to carry it out?
Who had the most to gain?
Why was Tommen and Cersei absent?

The answers to those questions only lead to Cersei. They may not have an corroborating witnesses, but the blame would be impossible to pass off.

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History belongs to those that write it.

Everyone that could be a witness is dead.

Cersei says - Lancel was supposed to come get me, but instead he threw Tommen out the window and then blew up the Sept. I was only protected by The Mountain so I graciously take my sons place as ruler.

Now I doubt that....but it's possible. I think it's just a matter of having the force or backup. Someone originally asked how she could take power with no friends. But as I said before Jamie was back with his army - and he may not be happy but at least now he seems to be supporting her. And the army is his. With the army and the Queensguard...done deal.

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Correct, but I actually believe the Lancel portion was more just to build suspense for the audience. It is odd to think it was all part of the plan to lure him down there, wound him, and then let him ALMOST get close enough to blow out the candle at the last second, just to have his body (and any proof of him being down there) vaporized.

Instead, it seems the Pycell murder actually serves a purpose. Someone was asking yesterday who Pycell had to be murdered as he didn't really have any reason to be killed. Well, it makes sense that he was killed closer to the Red Keep, but still somewhere in the tunnels. Cerci will say he was found trying to flee the scene of the crime and he tried to escape the king's guards. If you're going to plan a terrorist attack, make sure you have a dead body to take the fall. Dead people don't talk.

Not reading anything you wrote, just know that you are wrong. Rhaegar "kidnapped her" but based kn anecdotal evidence, its more likely they eloped somewhere. The mad king Aerys has NOTHING to do with Lyanna. Neds father and brother went to kings landing with their demands, and the old coot had them killed. Then ned and Robert have their rebellion.

Totally agree with you.

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First, some time has passed between the Sept blowing up and her coronation - she has different outfits on. Not only that but Jamie also is wearing different armor than when he showed up and saw the destruction from the hill.

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Acutally, this is wrong. When Jamie arrives to KLs the Sept is still billowing smoke. He arrived just after it occurred.

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Yes but you didn't read what I said or interpret it right....he is wearing something different at the Coronation.

that means time passed between when he showed up on the hill seeing the destruction. Yes that was the same day or soon after (could smolder for days actually). But the Coronation was some time later. Both he and Cersei are wearing different clothing and decor than she was on the trial day and he was when he showed up on the hill.

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Sorry, my bad. I guess I don't understand what difference a few days (max) could make it people accepting Cersei as Queen.

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I think we can assume that the majority of the nobility in KL was at the sept to spectate the trial so it's likely there is no nobility left to challenge her outside the Knights of the Kingsguard. This isn't revolutionary France, the peasants aren't going to rise up immediately to deny Cersi the throne. I doubt that who the king or queen is to the matters overly much really. All they know is that some rich person with control of an army and the Kingsguard is on the throne.

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I think we can assume that the majority of the nobility in KL was at the sept to spectate the trial so it's likely there is no nobility left to challenge her outside the Knights of the Kingsguard. This isn't revolutionary France, the peasants aren't going to rise up immediately to deny Cersi the throne. I doubt that who the king or queen is to the matters overly much really. All they know is that some rich person with control of an army and the Kingsguard is on the throne.

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The fact that you think we all should make that presumption is a pretty big indicator of poor writing/depiction from the show writers. We are never shown or told what aristocracy exists in KL and how many of them would be in attendance for the trials. Or at the very least, its a gross convenience for the plot. (Like I said, it was my only quibble. Cersei's coronation should have been somewhat challenged. If for no other reason that she was clearly responsible for the explosion.)

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Instead, it seems the Pycell murder actually serves a purpose. Someone was asking yesterday who Pycell had to be murdered as he didn't really have any reason to be killed. Well, it makes sense that he was killed closer to the Red Keep, but still somewhere in the tunnels. Cerci will say he was found trying to flee the scene of the crime and he tried to escape the king's guards. If you're going to plan a terrorist attack, make sure you have a dead body to take the fall. Dead people don't talk.

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So Pycelle decided to kill everyone? Why? And why would he spare Cersei? Cersei openly mocked him and removed his power. Why would he kill the people who reinstated him to the King's Council? The only body of power he belonged to.

Any scenario you come up with falls apart when you start asking about motivations or capabilities. Cersei is clearly the only one who gained anything and lost nothing. (Obviously preceeding Tommen's swan dive)

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I think we can assume that the majority of the nobility in KL was at the sept to spectate the trial so it's likely there is no nobility left to challenge her outside the Knights of the Kingsguard. This isn't revolutionary France, the peasants aren't going to rise up immediately to deny Cersi the throne. I doubt that who the king or queen is to the matters overly much really. All they know is that some rich person with control of an army and the Kingsguard is on the throne.

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The fact that you think we all should make that presumption is a pretty big indicator of poor writing/depiction from the show writers. We are never shown or told what aristocracy exists in KL and how many of them would be in attendance for the trials. Or at the very least, its a gross convenience for the plot. (Like I said, it was my only quibble. Cersei's coronation should have been somewhat challenged. If for no other reason that she was clearly responsible for the explosion.)

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More likely that anyone who wanted to oppose her was afraid of the Mountain going and killing them. On paper, she takes control because Tommen is dead and she's just the next in line, but in reality, anyone who suspects Cerci wouldn't blink at killing hundreds of the top people in the capital probably has the wherewithal to know she's not above murdering them as well, especially with the Lannister army conveniently trotting back into town.

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First, some time has passed between the Sept blowing up and her coronation - she has different outfits on. Not only that but Jamie also is wearing different armor than when he showed up and saw the destruction from the hill.

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Acutally, this is wrong. When Jamie arrives to KLs the Sept is still billowing smoke. He arrived just after it occurred.

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Yes but you didn't read what I said or interpret it right....he is wearing something different at the Coronation.

that means time passed between when he showed up on the hill seeing the destruction. Yes that was the same day or soon after (could smolder for days actually). But the Coronation was some time later. Both he and Cersei are wearing different clothing and decor than she was on the trial day and he was when he showed up on the hill.

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Sorry, my bad. I guess I don't understand what difference a few days (max) could make it people accepting Cersei as Queen.

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I think we can assume that the majority of the nobility in KL was at the sept to spectate the trial so it's likely there is no nobility left to challenge her outside the Knights of the Kingsguard. This isn't revolutionary France, the peasants aren't going to rise up immediately to deny Cersi the throne. I doubt that who the king or queen is to the matters overly much really. All they know is that some rich person with control of an army and the Kingsguard is on the throne.

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I guess MC SWAG edited that part above - not sure....anyway to answer ir.....

It isn't that a few days makes a difference to those being ruled. the important things are:

1. Jamie returned with the army by then - she has the military backing.
2. As opposed to how the show seems to display it - since we know time has passed since Jamie returned we have to assume he and Cersei have talked and he has (reluctantly) agreed to support her claim for now.
and therefore
3. She has the military backing because they follow Jamie.

It isn't about friends and whether they believe her or not. Or whether they even support her. She has the power.

Plenty could have happened offscreen to establish her claim (blaming someone else, the military moving in and taking control, her and Jamie talking about what happened, etc.). Agree with others that they could have shown more to establish it - but time constraints and dramatically speaking they just wanted to show that I think.

B/c I understood what you were going to say.

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So you think Jon is a deserter? That's cute.

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Ummm, I don't think Jon is a deserter....because I watched the show. Do the other characters around westeros know he isn't a deserter because they watched the reruns or on their DVR too?

Then again the maesters who send and receive ravens all over the kingdom presumably including many from Lord Commander Jon Snow, never bothered to send that little tidbit back to HQ so maybe it's not even widely known that Jon Snow was ever even in the Night's watch with the logic of this show.

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Westeros as a whole is irrelevant, only the North matters in this context and to the North it won't matter if he is an Oath Breaker or a Zombie, he is the son of Ned Stark (as far as they know) and they would rather follow a Zombie ******* than other options at this point.

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I'm not so certain, I think there should be some pause given to supporting him (like at least throw us some lip service like it was something they considered like they did the wildlings) among the northern houses. Just like wildlings, nights watch deserters are something these Northern houses deal with. The second scene in the show was Ned executing one with what basically seems to be great prejudice and no trial.

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anyone who suspects Cerci wouldn't blink at killing hundreds of the top people in the capital probably has the wherewithal to know she's not above murdering them as well, especially with the Lannister army conveniently trotting back into town.

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Ok, that's a good point. Certainly more believable than someone else taking the blame.

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Instead, it seems the Pycell murder actually serves a purpose. Someone was asking yesterday who Pycell had to be murdered as he didn't really have any reason to be killed. Well, it makes sense that he was killed closer to the Red Keep, but still somewhere in the tunnels. Cerci will say he was found trying to flee the scene of the crime and he tried to escape the king's guards. If you're going to plan a terrorist attack, make sure you have a dead body to take the fall. Dead people don't talk.

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I would be surprised if the writers thought out that plot point as well as that. That requires planning on the part of the characters. Of course, its also stupid to have little kids stab him like a 100 times.

"Ah, so heres the traitor!" Caught red handed fleeing the scene of the crime!"

"Uh, so how did he die? Why does he have 50 stab wounds? Who killed him?"

WRONG... they had no way to put the fire out. Just like in "Roman" times it burned and smoldered till is was out, weeks or even months.

I just watched all relevant scenes, again. I thought that there was something different b/w the opening shot of Cersei and a few moments later. The only difference was they added that little chain.

Then at her coronation she's wearing something so similar that I can see why it's easy to think it all happened on the same day. The dress and shoulder ornaments are only slightly different.

Well he went around to many of the houses asking them personally for their support. I assumed they discussed this at that time, which kept them from executing him at that time.

Furthermore, they probably assume this is the responsibility of the leader of the North. In other words, why in season 1 they brought the deserter all the way to Ned so that as Ned said "the one that issues the order, must also carry it out". So... maybe they COULD have taken him to Ramsey for execution? But then Ramsey was killed so, who's the new leader? And what do they do with all these Wildlings that are across the wall? "Oh, I guess we're changing up the rules a little bit".

I agree, a little bit odd how they totally don't talk about it, but oh well.

Sorry, I forgot that Roman history was a prerequisite for GoT fictious wildfire explosions

Dude, any old civilization society like this doesn't have a way to put out fires, besides buckets of water.

They burn until they are done burning. The amount of fire power used and leveled city blocks leads me to believe it would be smolder for months.

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Sorry, I forgot that Roman history was a prerequisite for GoT fictious wildfire explosions

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lol....but come on. it's a big fire.....even Bonfire smoldered for days, usually until the weekend sometime. Unless it rained a lot.

No need to be snarky. I know this is a fictitious world but it's not a stretch to assume an explosion that massive would be burning for a while.

My problem with the explosion was that there wasn't an alarm going off signifying to the rest of the city that there was a fire. We saw an alarm system in place in Mereen when the harbor caught fire, so I would assume something similar would be going on in KL. Only real explanation would be that the sept is where the alarm bells are kept.

Or that it was such a massive explosion that it killed the bell ringers?

We did see the church bell being thrown around and smash a body.

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Sorry, I forgot that Roman history was a prerequisite for GoT fictious wildfire explosions

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lol....but come on. it's a big fire.....even Bonfire smoldered for days, usually until the weekend sometime. Unless it rained a lot.

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Ok, so either the ruins of the sept have been smoking for weeks (or months) and Jamie arrived to find Cersei somehow still in control of KL.

Or

It had just occurred and Jamie arrived just in time to help Cersei secure her tenuous claim of the Iron Throne.

It can't be both.

And I often wonder how many of you actually believe these explanations or are just fishing for any plausible exuse to deflect any criticisms of the show, no matter how minuscule.

You'd have to be pretty insane, or have an army of your own, to challenge Cercei at this point. She just killed half of the nobility including the Queen, High Septon, and eliminated all heirs to a major house. How the heck would you even challenge her right to the throne....?

My original complaint was 2 part:
1) Cersei has no allies in Kings Landing, and if fact, she is despised by practically everyone.
2) Cersei carried out a deadly and atrocious attack on KLs most important political and religious leaders.

Combined, she should be public enemy #1. Common folks and Aristocrats alike should be calling for her head.

I found it hard to swallow that they would so quickly bend their knees to her.

Now, ZJS did raise the point about Jamie's arrival. He does have an army in tow and would easily be able to secure KL and protect Cersei from the mob.

My point: That's a fairly big ask for us to assume happened. We are never shown how the people of KL react to the Sept explosion. We are never shown whether it caused widespread panic or discord. And thus, we are never shown Jamie, nor his army, reinstating any semblance of order.

Now, maybe all that happened off-screen and they intentionally left those dots to be connected by the viewer. At best, I think that's poor writing. Especially when we are all dealing with the inconsistent timeline aspect. We have no clue how much time has passed between certain pivotal moments, and thus we are forced to make our own conclusions.

I understand what ZJS and others are saying, but I disagree. I think the writers dropped the ball on this one. I think they overlooked this aspect and were a little too hasty in putting that crown on Cersei's head. And thus, my criticism.

Either way, I'm cool if y'all want to disagree. There were some good points raised and ultimately, I think the show is more compelling with Cersei on the throne than off it. So while I thought the journey could have been a little less clunky, I'm all aboard the destination.