***Official GAME OF THRONES Season 6 (BOOK READERS/SPOILERS ALLOWED)***

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yeahtoast
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AG
Gotta be Dorne.

Hatred of Lannisters. Tepid relationship with Tyrell's. Longstanding animosity for KL in general. Never bent the knee formally to Robert's Rebellion but relied upon Jon Arryn and Doran's diplomatic "truce".

Pair that with book cannon of all the missing sand snake plotlines, Dorne being primarily involved in trade with free cities instead of a part of the seven kingdoms, and Doran's quest to bring back "fire and blood" secretly for years with Quentyn (sidenote: holy **** did D&DB miss the whole god-damn point of Dorne in their show adaptation).

Has to be Dorne.
bangobango
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quote:
quote:
Question for the book readers: is there any smoke to the HS being HR theory? From the show's perspective, this theory is borderline ludicrous. The HS is decades older than Ned was and I would expect HR to be approximately the same age as Ned. Not to mention the HS's story about being a cobbler doesn't add up at all and he doesn't really have a lot of incentive to make that story up.

that video above spend more time debunking HS=HR then supporting it specifically saying the theory.....



quote:
"...doesn't have any strong evidence and is pretty implausible in a bunch of ways. There are some tantalizing facts that "kinda" back it up but all those factors are still compatible with the simpler one, that Howland Reed is still in the North and that the High Sparrow is just what he seems"."


also about this idea as a thought out plan, it says:


quote:
"The biggest problem is it doesn't make sense as a plan. For the theory to be true Howland must have sat down during the war and with winter coming and decided that the best plan of action was for him to go wandering through the Riverlands on foot performing religious ceremonies for a foreign religion (keep in mind he is of the old gods, and would have to have studied the faith of the seven diligently to pull this off) until he manages to become the leader of a popular uprising and then become the High Septon a position with sufficient power to strike at the crown...all the while hiding his identity and faking faith. Like seriously????"


How could that be a plan? You can't just make a popular movement happen or create it and it also relies on the political instability existing by the time he does become High Sparrow to then become High Septon and take control basically at the behest of Cersei herself. The number of variables in that "plan" is staggering.


And let's not forgot, currently Occam's Razor is applicable in pretty much every recent case where fan theories have given very elaborate and complex theories, whereas in reality:


  • Arya was just Arya (not the waif, not Jaqen, there was no Syrio, eyc.)
  • Jon Snow did not warg into his direwolf or any other crazy things - he was just dead and Melissandre brought him back
  • no LSH just the BwoB hanging their rogue members

I mean there are surely manipulations and plot twists at work - mosly due to manipulations by people who have shown they have that capacity or power (the HS, Tommen, Maergery, Cersei, Varys, LF, Ramsay, etc.).....but these wild supernatural type theories or someone is really someone else theories have all pretty much been bunk.








I know I hammer against the crazy theories as much or more than anybody, but Jon warging and LSH, especially LSH, were not crazy theories in my mind since they were all at least supported by textual evidence in the books. They are no more a crazy theory than R+L=J is a crazy theory.

Arya fight club and Arya and Jaquen, etc, were pulled directly from people's asses, however.
SgtBarbarossa
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quote:
quote:
Quote:

Regarding the trial - I wonder if this is a precurser to the Tyrells demanding a Trial of Seven for Loras, since that is also sacred to the gods, and counting on Cersei not being able to find seven champions (while Loras quite obviously could). I just have a hard time believing that these trials won't involve some massive spectacle.


Isn't the trial of seven outlawed as well? It's a trial by combat featuring 7v7 so if 1v1 is out how can 7v7 not be?

I'm hoping that Margaery persuades the High Sparrow to use a hybrid trial by combat, where instead of 7v7 or 1v1, it's 1v7. The Mountain can wipe out 6 men before the Hound comes out as a surprise entrant, Royal Rumble style. The Mountain loses and then Cersei tries to burn the city down. Classic Cersei.
Zombie Jon Snow
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quote:
quote:
quote:
Question for the book readers: is there any smoke to the HS being HR theory? From the show's perspective, this theory is borderline ludicrous. The HS is decades older than Ned was and I would expect HR to be approximately the same age as Ned. Not to mention the HS's story about being a cobbler doesn't add up at all and he doesn't really have a lot of incentive to make that story up.

that video above spend more time debunking HS=HR then supporting it specifically saying the theory.....



quote:
"...doesn't have any strong evidence and is pretty implausible in a bunch of ways. There are some tantalizing facts that "kinda" back it up but all those factors are still compatible with the simpler one, that Howland Reed is still in the North and that the High Sparrow is just what he seems"."


also about this idea as a thought out plan, it says:


quote:
"The biggest problem is it doesn't make sense as a plan. For the theory to be true Howland must have sat down during the war and with winter coming and decided that the best plan of action was for him to go wandering through the Riverlands on foot performing religious ceremonies for a foreign religion (keep in mind he is of the old gods, and would have to have studied the faith of the seven diligently to pull this off) until he manages to become the leader of a popular uprising and then become the High Septon a position with sufficient power to strike at the crown...all the while hiding his identity and faking faith. Like seriously????"


How could that be a plan? You can't just make a popular movement happen or create it and it also relies on the political instability existing by the time he does become High Sparrow to then become High Septon and take control basically at the behest of Cersei herself. The number of variables in that "plan" is staggering.


And let's not forgot, currently Occam's Razor is applicable in pretty much every recent case where fan theories have given very elaborate and complex theories, whereas in reality:


  • Arya was just Arya (not the waif, not Jaqen, there was no Syrio, eyc.)
  • Jon Snow did not warg into his direwolf or any other crazy things - he was just dead and Melissandre brought him back
  • no LSH just the BwoB hanging their rogue members

I mean there are surely manipulations and plot twists at work - mosly due to manipulations by people who have shown they have that capacity or power (the HS, Tommen, Maergery, Cersei, Varys, LF, Ramsay, etc.).....but these wild supernatural type theories or someone is really someone else theories have all pretty much been bunk.








I know I hammer against the crazy theories as much or more than anybody, but Jon warging and LSH, especially LSH, were not crazy theories in my mind since they were all at least supported by textual evidence in the books. They are no more a crazy theory than R+L=J is a crazy theory.

Arya fight club and Arya and Jaquen, etc, were pulled directly from people's asses, however.


Well one difference is we've gone beyond the books specifically regarding Arya. Perhaps there was evidence of some Jon weird stuff - heck it might still be true in the books. And LSH isn't a theory anyway, she is a reality in the books.

Anyway I never said they were crazy theories - I simply said "elaborate and complex" theories.

My only point, which I guess you missed, was that HR=HS is a pretty complex and elaborate theory which also isn't really supported by anything in the books OR the show. It's completely out of leftfield.

Whereas R+L=J is supported by a ton of stuff in the books AND has been alluded to many many times in the show as well (so much foreshadowing that show only watchers have surmised it).....and now we even have the exterior TOJ scene shown - it has importance otherwise it would have been left out of the show completely.

There is zero, nothing, nada alluding to HR and the HS being the same person. And it fails any test of logic.







JJxvi
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quote:
quote:
Just watched the last two eps. This show is dumb. Motivations and actions of characters have stopped making any kind of sense.

Arya - Went from scared, lost girl to worldly killer to aspiring assassin to finally reconciling her need for revenge with her true self.

Jaime - Clearly struggling internally with a pervading perception that he has no honor when in fact he is generally a reasonable pragmatist. The fact that he has moments of ruthlessness are a self fulfilling prophecy and mostly a smoke screen.

Kevan - Clearly bothered by the Faith but also pragmatic. He's not going to threaten a position of power by opposing the king and holds out hope that the shaky truce will hold. Plus, he (rightly) sees Cersei's incompetence as more of a threat than some overzealous religious nuts.

Tommen - Impressionable, naive and not all that bright.

Margaery - Faking it to save her family.

Davos - Prioritizes the coming war with the WW above all else and knows Jon is the right person to hitch his saddle to.

Varys - Softening the ground for Daenerys by allying with Dorne.

Tyrion - Trying to govern a culture he clearly doesn't understand by -- again -- doing what he feels is most practical.

You - Needing an outlet for unfounded nerdrage so coming on here and bashing a critically-acclaimed season of a critically-acclaimed show because you've convinced yourself that a series of 3 great and 2 below average books are masterpieces that should be treated with some sort of reverence.
Sorry bro. I dont get mad at TV shows or even at people who disagree with my opinion on TV shows on message boards. Also, the books are the books, the show is the show. Doesn't change the fact that the writers of this show do not seem to know whether it wants to be character driven or plot driven. Take your Arya explanation above...sounds like a very personal, character driven plot line, except they have to alter the characters to follow the predetermined plot line to add mindless drivel. We had all the information we needed 3 episodes ago when Arya blew out the candle, but they had to make Arya dumb, the waif ineffective, the city inhabitants look like clueless robots, so that the plot could give the viewers some suspense with some gut stabs (which stretches smarter minds past the point of incredulity), and then so that we could get an awkward chase/action sequence with the waif goosestepping through town after her, followed by the resolution already foreshadowed, and then I guess we needed more suspense for the shallow minded by showing Jaqen follow a blood trail to the waif's face. How did Arya know that Jaqen would let her leave, she's seen a guy with his form murder people with ease. I guess she knew he would smirk and let her, go. Maybe she had already read the script.

These type of "wait, why is the character doing that!? And why is the other side letting them do it?" moments are starting to fill the show. It seems like the writers are falling more and more into a "have the characters follow the plot" the further they get away from simply adapting Martin's source material where character actions push the plot forward. The writers are the equivalent of the guy putting putting on the play in Braavos that didn't know how to write a credible scene with accurate motherly motivation for his actress.
Joe Cole
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Don't want to beat the dead Arya horse anymore, but the whole thing is better for me if waif's first attack only landed a minor blow. Getting stabbed a few times in the gut and almost bleeding out, parkour after 24hrs rest, back to bleeding, back to being fine at FM temple. Whole thing is weak, but oh well at least it's over.

The local theater really needs to work on backstage security


Last couple episodes slower compared to the pace of earlier in the season, but I expect them to finish strong and satisfy viewers.

I think it's funny how a majority of the buzz leading into this season was all about Jon and if he would return. He did and really he has hardly been discussed since episode 3. His character on screen now always looks really weak, which will make it harder to buy if he is suddenly back to taking out Boltons this week
JJxvi
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It was subtle, but I dont think she was actually ever bleeding again after she healed (amazing!). She actually rolled through some blood oranges of some type and got red all over her which she used to draw the waif to her lair.
Brian Earl Spilner
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The whole thing works better for me if Arya had anticipated the attack and had planned to lure her all along.
FightinTexasAg15
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If you want to get pumped for the next episode. This one should be epic!



redline248
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quote:
sidenote: holy **** did D&DB miss the whole god-damn point of Dorne in their show adaptation


Quoted for mother f.cking truth!
Ranger222
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The Wolves Will Come Again?
redline248
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quote:
I think it's funny how a majority of the buzz leading into this season was all about Jon and if he would return. He did and really he has hardly been discussed since episode 3. His character on screen now always looks really weak, which will make it harder to buy if he is suddenly back to taking out Boltons this week


This has really struck me, as well. He's had relatively little screen time, and hasn't really lived up to the awesome level of the "my watch has ended" close to that episode. I suppose part of it is having pretty much this entire upcoming episode involving him, but he's been pretty ineffective at getting any support so far. This might be the most disappointing thing about this season, for me.
Joe Cole
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next episode needs jugs
yeahtoast
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That trailer is doing everything it can to get me Stark-vengeance-hyped.

All Starks will die, confirmed.
AggieSouth06
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Martin's source material where character actions push the plot forward.

Really? Because book 4-5 were mainly about the established characters' complete inaction in service of developing several tertiary characters and plot lines that were suddenly vital to the endgame halfway through the story.

"Need to move around some pieces in the iron islands and Dorne and introduce this random surviving Tagaryen (or not! Such intrigue!), so let's make Jon and Dany mopey, indecisive and unlikeable so they'll stay in one place for 1,500 pages."
Thomas Ford 91
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quote:
We had all the information we needed 3 episodes ago when Arya blew out the candle, but they had to make Arya dumb, the waif ineffective, the city inhabitants look like clueless robots, so that the plot could give the viewers some suspense with some gut stabs (which stretches smarter minds past the point of incredulity), and then so that we could get an awkward chase/action sequence with the waif goosestepping through town after her, followed by the resolution already foreshadowed, and then I guess we needed more suspense for the shallow minded by showing Jaqen follow a blood trail to the waif's face. How did Arya know that Jaqen would let her leave, she's seen a guy with his form murder people with ease. I guess she knew he would smirk and let her, go. Maybe she had already read the script.


This guy gets it.
JJxvi
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Again, the books are the books. I'm not arguing which is better. You also make my point. If the plot is boring and lacks intrigue because the characters are mopey, indecisive, and not doing anything...then its the character actions that are driving the plot. The writers of the show have made changes to the plot, but have neglected to keep to the structure by having the new plot be driven by the characters as earlier episodes were and its resulting in inconsistencies in their behavior. They dont act like we expect they should based on past actions.
MW03
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quote:
If you want to get pumped for the next episode. This one should be epic!





bangobango
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quote:
quote:
quote:
quote:
Question for the book readers: is there any smoke to the HS being HR theory? From the show's perspective, this theory is borderline ludicrous. The HS is decades older than Ned was and I would expect HR to be approximately the same age as Ned. Not to mention the HS's story about being a cobbler doesn't add up at all and he doesn't really have a lot of incentive to make that story up.

that video above spend more time debunking HS=HR then supporting it specifically saying the theory.....



quote:
"...doesn't have any strong evidence and is pretty implausible in a bunch of ways. There are some tantalizing facts that "kinda" back it up but all those factors are still compatible with the simpler one, that Howland Reed is still in the North and that the High Sparrow is just what he seems"."


also about this idea as a thought out plan, it says:


quote:
"The biggest problem is it doesn't make sense as a plan. For the theory to be true Howland must have sat down during the war and with winter coming and decided that the best plan of action was for him to go wandering through the Riverlands on foot performing religious ceremonies for a foreign religion (keep in mind he is of the old gods, and would have to have studied the faith of the seven diligently to pull this off) until he manages to become the leader of a popular uprising and then become the High Septon a position with sufficient power to strike at the crown...all the while hiding his identity and faking faith. Like seriously????"


How could that be a plan? You can't just make a popular movement happen or create it and it also relies on the political instability existing by the time he does become High Sparrow to then become High Septon and take control basically at the behest of Cersei herself. The number of variables in that "plan" is staggering.


And let's not forgot, currently Occam's Razor is applicable in pretty much every recent case where fan theories have given very elaborate and complex theories, whereas in reality:


  • Arya was just Arya (not the waif, not Jaqen, there was no Syrio, eyc.)
  • Jon Snow did not warg into his direwolf or any other crazy things - he was just dead and Melissandre brought him back
  • no LSH just the BwoB hanging their rogue members

I mean there are surely manipulations and plot twists at work - mosly due to manipulations by people who have shown they have that capacity or power (the HS, Tommen, Maergery, Cersei, Varys, LF, Ramsay, etc.).....but these wild supernatural type theories or someone is really someone else theories have all pretty much been bunk.








I know I hammer against the crazy theories as much or more than anybody, but Jon warging and LSH, especially LSH, were not crazy theories in my mind since they were all at least supported by textual evidence in the books. They are no more a crazy theory than R+L=J is a crazy theory.

Arya fight club and Arya and Jaquen, etc, were pulled directly from people's asses, however.


Well one difference is we've gone beyond the books specifically regarding Arya. Perhaps there was evidence of some Jon weird stuff - heck it might still be true in the books. And LSH isn't a theory anyway, she is a reality in the books.

Anyway I never said they were crazy theories - I simply said "elaborate and complex" theories.

My only point, which I guess you missed, was that HR=HS is a pretty complex and elaborate theory which also isn't really supported by anything in the books OR the show. It's completely out of leftfield.

Whereas R+L=J is supported by a ton of stuff in the books AND has been alluded to many many times in the show as well (so much foreshadowing that show only watchers have surmised it).....and now we even have the exterior TOJ scene shown - it has importance otherwise it would have been left out of the show completely.

There is zero, nothing, nada alluding to HR and the HS being the same person. And it fails any test of logic.








I 100% agree with you. I just think it's important to distinguish theories like LSH and Jon Snow warging, which are textually supported theories (or reality as you say) from theories like Arya's fight club, which was basically a guess at how people wanted the story to go down not really based on any textual or film evidence. I am only taking issue in lumping those three together as the same thing.

The HS=HR and the Arya fight club should be lumped together as "loony theories," in my opinion.
aggietoolman
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So is that an official trailer?

If so, showed Little finger briefly.

Wolves will come again? Any chance that Nymeria and the large pack of wolves from the book make an appearance and tear Ramsay's army to pieces?

redline248
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quote:
Wolves will come again? Any chance that Nymeria and the large pack of wolves from the book make an appearance and tear Ramsay's army to pieces?
I think it's super unlikely, given the show's unwillingness to spend budget on wolves. Likely, the tagline just means the Starks (whose sigil is a direwolf) could possibly be ready to reclaim their home.

Hoping so much that is the case, and that they don't just all die.
McInnis 03
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Tangent: For those of you show watchers who want to try the books but don't have the literary time, I'd encourage you to try the audiobooks as read by Roy Dotrice. They're done so well, he gives them complete justice for what they are in his reading and you can accelerate it do whatever speed you determine is appropriate for you to accelerate through them.

I go through them at roughly 1.5x real-time and the 40 hr books take me some 25+ hours to get through.
smokeythebear
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quote:
We had all the information we needed 3 episodes ago when Arya blew out the candle, but they had to make Arya dumb, the waif ineffective, the city inhabitants look like clueless robots, so that the plot could give the viewers some suspense with some gut stabs (which stretches smarter minds past the point of incredulity), and then so that we could get an awkward chase/action sequence with the waif goosestepping through town after her, followed by the resolution already foreshadowed, and then I guess we needed more suspense for the shallow minded by showing Jaqen follow a blood trail to the waif's face. How did Arya know that Jaqen would let her leave, she's seen a guy with his form murder people with ease. I guess she knew he would smirk and let her, go. Maybe she had already read the script.

So you would have had the Waif, an extremely talented and experienced super assassin wander into a dark room with a fully healthy Arya and needle for an obvious confrontation in the pitch black? Arya learned some skills, but she wasn't anywhere CLOSE to being as skilled and knowledgeable as the Waif. Yes, it was foreshadowed to us that Arya COULD have an advantage if she were able to fight the Waif in the dark, but the Waif wasn't going to be dumb enough to do that if none of the other stuff happened. For all we know, Arya spent a year hiding in that dark room before finally emerging to try and buy passage back to Westeros.

As for Jaqen, I don't think Arya ever feared him trying to kill her. It was pretty evident that the MFG didn't care who's life was given, just that a life was given and she provided that life and the face to prove it. She knew she was off the hook with him.
Goose06
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quote:
Tangent: For those of you show watchers who want to try the books but don't have the literary time, I'd encourage you to try the audiobooks as read by Roy Dotrice. They're done so well, he gives them complete justice for what they are in his reading and you can accelerate it do whatever speed you determine is appropriate for you to accelerate through them.

I go through them at roughly 1.5x real-time and the 40 hr books take me some 25+ hours to get through.


I just finished book 1 listening during my commute and completely agree. I listen at normal speed as I find it difficult to pay attention to the faster speeds while driving. But if you have a 25 minute commute or more, most chapters are about 25 minutes so it's perfect. My commute is 40 minutes so sometimes I listen to 1, sometimes 1.5, sometimes 2.
Zombie Jon Snow
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quote:
Anyway I never said they were crazy theories - I simply said "elaborate and complex" theories.


My only point, which I guess you missed, was that HR=HS is a pretty complex and elaborate theory which also isn't really supported by anything in the books OR the show. It's completely out of leftfield.

Whereas R+L=J is supported by a ton of stuff in the books AND has been alluded to many many times in the show as well (so much foreshadowing that show only watchers have surmised it).....and now we even have the exterior TOJ scene shown - it has importance otherwise it would have been left out of the show completely.

There is zero, nothing, nada alluding to HR and the HS being the same person. And it fails any test of logic.

quote:

I 100% agree with you. I just think it's important to distinguish theories like LSH and Jon Snow warging, which are textually supported theories (or reality as you say) from theories like Arya's fight club, which was basically a guess at how people wanted the story to go down not really based on any textual or film evidence. I am only taking issue in lumping those three together as the same thing.

The HS=HR and the Arya fight club should be lumped together as "loony theories," in my opinion.

I gotcha. Although I thought Arya fight club had a small chance of being true it was less likely than it being just as presented at face value (despite the issues of surviving those stabbing wounds so easily) . And I think HR=HS is really really unlikely.


My only intention was to point out that in cases where they could have gone with some wild explanation, the show writers have shown thus far to be pretty straight forward - thereby Occam's Razor seems to apply a lot more than not. They've even made certain things more simple than in the books (no LSH for example, there have been ample opportunities and they have not done it).

We have had plenty of plot twists if you will, but primarily they were just actions driven by characters manipulations (red wedding plot, joffrey's death, jon's death, even myrcella and the sand snakes revenge) and not of the supernatural variety. And even the few supernatural things (jon resurrected, and dany walking out of fire, creation of the WW's by the CotF) are presented in almost the most simplistic way. It's rarely as complex as people imagine. Even Hodor which was a great surprise to all was nothing more than something he was told in a warging/time travel thing that became his name.

We haven't had any characters who were really other characters other than Jaqen at times and the waif a few times. But thats what the faceless men do. It wasn't some grand conspiracy where they were really someone else all along....they were just as presented to us but have the ability to change their faces for specific purposes.

Anyway long story short....until proven otherwise I think the simplest explanations will generally be true. They've got enough material and enough plot and battles to show they don't need to be making up convoluted plot devices.

smokeythebear
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Y'all tell me if I'm wrong, but do you think this week's episode gave us a "what if" scenario from the books in terms of the LSH? Basically, what if LSH was never brought back to life? Well Lemoncloak would still be a **** and would be going around killing people just for the fun of it, but without LSH there to give purpose to his ruthlessness, he was quickly disposed of by the rest of the brotherhood.

I don't have any other specific examples, but it's kind of a cool way to imagine how the story would have been different if, for instance, Bran went back in time and stopped LSH from being reanimated.

I know, I know, that's not why she's not in the show, but a fun side effect, I imagine, for the book readers.
Zombie Jon Snow
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In a way I suppose it's a what if....but I don't tend to think of show differences that way.

I basically look at them like simplifications of the very long story with so many characters and I'm usually fine with the removal of characters for simplicity if it makes sense and if the role is handled just as well by some other character. Or plots that simply aren't needed (fake Aegon, Jon Connington, Quentyn Martell for example).

Although the only negative from a book reader perspective to me now is that characters and plotlines that are left out are telling me whats important or not important from the masive books. I have the feeling I'll read the next book now skimming certain things that aren't that important (apparently). Assuming its all still headed in the same direction and the overall result.
PMD03
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It will be interesting to see how much longer Stannis survives in the books.
JJxvi
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Is Lem Lemoncloak even a bad guy type at all in the books?
redline248
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I don't remember him being a bad guy, but that doesn't mean much. I honestly don't remember much of anything about him.

As to the what if question...Beric is planning to take a bigger role in the fight against the walkers, it seems. So, should we assume that's what LSH will be doing? Personally I don't think so.
AggieSouth06
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It will be interesting to see how much longer Stannis survives in the books.

Long enough to burn Shireen, which we know for sure is from the books. And I assume he still gets whipped by the Boltons given that winter is wrecking his army in the books even worse than it did in the show.

I wonder where Theon and Yara go next in the books. Does Stannis turn them loose for some reason? Do they escape during the battle? Are they recaptured by Ramsay for more thrilling torture porn?
redline248
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quote:
quote:
It will be interesting to see how much longer Stannis survives in the books.

Long enough to burn Shireen, which we know for sure is from the books. And I assume he still gets whipped by the Boltons given that winter is wrecking his army in the books even worse than it did in the show.

I wonder where Theon and Yara go next in the books. Does Stannis turn them loose for some reason? Do they escape during the battle? Are they recaptured by Ramsay for more thrilling torture porn?


I predict Mel and Selyse burn Shireen without Stannis knowing. He is on the march while they all stayed at castle black, correct?
yeahtoast
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Speaking of torture porn, I can't wait for the Missandei/Grey Worm scissor-session.

Riveting story-line over in Mereen, I tell yah...
redline248
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Will totally watch if it means Missandei gets naked again.
yeahtoast
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quote:
quote:
quote:
It will be interesting to see how much longer Stannis survives in the books.

Long enough to burn Shireen, which we know for sure is from the books. And I assume he still gets whipped by the Boltons given that winter is wrecking his army in the books even worse than it did in the show.

I wonder where Theon and Yara go next in the books. Does Stannis turn them loose for some reason? Do they escape during the battle? Are they recaptured by Ramsay for more thrilling torture porn?


I predict Mel and Selyse burn Shireen without Stannis knowing. He is on the march while they all stayed at castle black, correct?
This is shaking loose memories from the books that could foretell the upcoming show battle...

Stannis plans to use sell-swords he doesn't have yet to carry out his action regardless of death and place Shireen on the throne if he dies. Wonder what he'll think if Mel burns her in tribute prior to even losing the battle?

ALSO, doesn't he go through a nonconventional travel plan to get to Winterfell and round up a bunch of mountain clans before taking Asha prisoner? I remember that he wins over House Glover and Mormont (SHOW! Glovers to the rescue late?) and the whole North begins to rally. I guess this is Jon's plot line now?

Which also reminds me that he uncovers the Karstark betrayal from Jon via fake Arya! I'm pretty much 100% that someone on Bolton's side is going to betray him, thus saying somewhat true to the books for Stannis' plot line, and also being able to pick up "The North Remembers" plot line along the way, as D&DB tend to do in combining everything.
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