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Littlefinger is still a little **** and I'm still hoping someone takes him out. Plus he is way to creepy of a guy with his thing for Sansa since he can no longer have Catelyn.

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I agree, it's disgusting. But I hope Sansa uses it to her advantage before someone offs him.

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while it might be creepy from the standpoint that he was in love with her mother, the age difference was extremely common. hell, it's still very common in many parts of the world today.

Yeah... Who knows if those spoilers are true or not (didn't read them), but being a book reader I'm enjoying not knowing what is going to happen for once

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How long were LF and Lysa Arryn ****ing? Any chance of Robin being his kid?

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No. They did not hook-up until she moved back to the Vale after Jon Arryn's death.

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No, Petyr took Lysa Tulley's virginity when they were when they were younger (before the Rebellion) after he got drunk when Cat rejected him. He even called Lysa "Cat" and said he loved him. They hooked up again and he knocked her up. Petyr was sent back to the Fingers and when Lysa revealed her pregnancy to her father in hopes of getting married to Petyr, Lord Tully had the child aborted.

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Did you not see my 921pm? My initial response was to the question of whether Littlefinger might be young Arryn's father.

The events you describe predate his conception by more than ten years.

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I did. But the way you worded made it seem like they had never been together prior to Jon Arryn's death. I was just putting correct info out there. And you are correct in regards to Robin being LF's son. That boy is an Arryn and Lysa didn't get back with LF until after Arryn died.

Agreed

I wrote a really long post in reply but then hit cancel instead of post by accident.

So are you saying, please don't post info from websites which may be leaks about the tv show and or book; that may be possible to infer, but are not otherwise even on most peoples radar?

Like say (and note this is my own made up scenerio)...

They find out a major character is alive who was thought dead and kills ghost.......... and flays him, then turns cloak and sides with Ramsay?

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They find out a major character is alive who was thought dead and kills ghost.......... and flays him, then turns cloak and sides with Ramsay?

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gonna flay you just for thinking that.

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I wrote a really long post in reply but then hit cancel instead of post by accident.

So are you saying, please don't post info from websites which may be leaks about the tv show and or book; that may be possible to infer, but are not otherwise even on most peoples radar?

Like say (and note this is my own made up scenerio)...

They find out a major character is alive who was thought dead and kills ghost.......... and flays him, then turns cloak and sides with Ramsay?

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Yea, so theories and postulations with support from the show or book are cool in my mind, but outright narrative spoilers that have leaked I'd put in the "Not Cool" section.

I kinda wish I hadn't clicked on that Reddit article, but whatever, we'll see what happens. If true there's some things I'm not sure I like.

Oh well. Temptation to click too much.

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I kinda wish I hadn't clicked on that Reddit article, but whatever, we'll see what happens. If true there's some things I'm not sure I like.

Oh well. Temptation to click too much.

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Guilty.

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while it might be creepy from the standpoint that he was in love with her mother, the age difference was extremely common. hell, it's still very common in many parts of the world today.

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Like Hollywood.

The "spoilers allowed" part being in the thread title of this thread has always annoyed me.

Was listening to a review of the episode and someone made an interesting point. What if the letter was sent by Littlefinger to rally the Wildlings around Jon and add strength to his own army?

Granted, it's kind of a shot in the dark with nothing to back it up. And how would he know about Rickon, unless of course he orchestrated that as well.

Possibly, but Ramsay was pushing for an attack on the Wall in an earlier season, wasn't he? Seems perfectly in character.

Hahahahaha

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Possibly, but Ramsay was pushing for an attack on the Wall in an earlier season, wasn't he? Seems perfectly in character.

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It absolutely does seem like Ramsey, and goes along with what he told Smalljon Umber he'd do.

Wait, little finger couldn't know that Ramsey has Rickon, right? Wouldn't that bash thst theory?

Like I said, he wouldn't know unless that was orchestrated by LF as well.

But even for him I think that is way too elaborate.

Ramsay, being a b.stard that has been newly legitmized, (and being the psycho that he is) would find great joy in constantly using b.stard to refer to Jon. Like he's convincing himself he is better than Jon, even though he's still a b.stard himself.

Jon's response to Ramsay.

NSFW language.

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Like I said, he wouldn't know unless that was orchestrated by LF as well.

But even for him I think that is way too elaborate.

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I think it's perfectly plausible he orchestrated the entire thing. The only part I would find hard to believe is that he even knew the whereabouts of Rickon. However, had he discovered their hiding refuge, this would be a perfect LF ploy.

Because the way I see it, Ramsay had no reason to make an enemy out of the wildlings, right? Like why would he explicitly call them out in his letter? All that would do is rally their cause with Jon's.

LF, however, would definitely want to instigate a war between Castle Black+Wildlings and Ramsay's winterfell army. "Chaos is a ladder"

Right, but he didn't actually HAVE to do that. And certainly not in the manner of which he did.

First, are we talking strictly about the show here?

Ramsay would bring up the wildlings in the letter bc, like I assume most in Westeros, he thinks they are lesser beings. He doesn't give a crap about hurting their feelings, and thinks it's another way to degrade Jon.

I guess you can rationalize it like that, but it still seemed like a huge tactical miscalculation. Ramsay is certainly impulsive but he's no idiot. Like, he could have easily left it at "Give me back Sansa, or I'll torture the **** out of your brother Rickon." No need to threaten the Wildlings. Hell, if anything, he could be all like, "Hey Wildlings, I'll grant you asylum if you bring me Jon Snow and Sansa." (Obviously with the intent to betray the wildlings. Idk, I'm just spitballing.

I just find the idea of LF plotting the conflict as more plausible than Ramsay making an error in judgment. But like I said, that would require LF to know Rickon was even with the Umbers.

Btw, wasn't it LF that spurred Lysa Arryn to write the letter to Catelyn in S1? Isn't he responsible for kicking off this entire war? Or am I misrembering? (This would make setting up Ramsay v Jon Snow look like child's play if so)

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Re: ramsay has no need to make an enemy of the wildlings.

Fully disagree. As warden of the north, and trying to solidify that title, northern houses have been beset by wildlings for a thousand years. Whether they climb the wall or circumvent by sea, wildlings are always raiding where it's warm.

By killing the newly southern hordes of wildlings, minor and major houses in the north will appreciate the new occupant at winterfel a whole lot faster than if he did not.

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I get that...but Ramsay's first problem is Sansa and Jon Snow. As long as they live, his claim in the north is in question regardless of how he handles the Wildlings. It would be the smarter move to deal with 1 at a time than give the Wildlings cause to throw their support in with Snow and a girl they've never met.


EDIT: I'd like to re-emphasize my point that Ramsay had no need to make an enemy of the wildlings AT THIS MOMENT. He'd eventually set out to kill them all, but its probably a mistake to do so at the time he did.

That's funny.

I do hope that Ghost plays a part in maiming or subduing Ramsay. Dude needs some ****-your-pants fear.