My Mom and Dad (Class of ’53) got a raw deal from the 12th Man Foundation/Athletic Dept when they pulled a “switch” on the Man’s Basketball season ticket assignments.

Back in August of this year, my folks were sent a ticket application for Men’s Basketball with the following seating chart and “Priority Seating Legend”



They selected 2 season tickets and donated $250 for each seat. Based on the chart, they should have received tickets in either section 120, 121, 122, 104, 105 or 106.

Last week when they received their tickets, they found out that they had been stuck in section 119. (Which according to the chart was at the $100 a seat donation level.)

They both went to the 12th Man Foundation to find out what happened and were told that they had better than anticipated demand for the $1,000 level and bumped everyone accordingly. They even created a new $750 level that no one knew about.

They then presented them the “New and Revised Priority Seating Legend” seen below. Oct 30, 2006 chart




My folks got a raw deal and were not informed at all of the changes and did not get an opportunity to do anything. They essentially were told “Tough crap”.

I think what the University did was dishonorable and unethical.

If you tell people that if they donate a certain level they will get certain seats (as shown in the August “Priority Seating Chart”) you should honor that “agreement”. If you can’t honor that agreement, then you should refund the difference. My folks were placed in the $100 seating area. The right thing to do would be to refund them $150 per seat. Instead, the University is keeping ALL the money and doing NOTHING to rectify their dishonorable behavior. What has happened to my school? Aggies never lie, cheat or steal. I feel like they did a bit of all three to my parents.


They did this to ALOT of people and kept the money.

They did not honor the seating chart that was sent out to the donors. Why isnt anyone doing something about this?

THE 12th MAN Foundation and AD should refund the difference to ALL donors what did not get what was advertised on their application. If you dontated $500 and were placed in a $250 area, you should get $250 in a refund.

That is fair and right.

[This message has been edited by BQbassdrum91 (edited 11/6/2006 9:38a).]

[This message has been edited by BQbassdrum91 (edited 11/6/2006 9:45a).]

doesn't really suprise me. hate to hear it.

Email Byrne and see what he says. I agree that it's crap to pay a certain level and get worse seats without getting a refund. They should have at least been given the option to move up if the demand was as high as they say it was.

wow that's aweful. I would def send a message or two to some people. I would be irate if they did that to me

Maybe they should get the option to donate more...but really, your donation only establishes your priority, it doesnt guarantee you a particular seat. You cant expect to get a seat if thousands of people selected to donate more than you. What are they going to do besides move everybody back? Disnt it even say that those were the expected donation levels and that they may change? I seem to remember something like that.

Basketball Fan

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Maybe they should get the option to donate more...but really, your donation only establishes your priority, it doesnt guarantee you a particular seat. You cant expect to get a seat if thousands of people selected to donate more than you. What are they going to do besides move everybody back? Disnt it even say that those were the expected donation levels and that they may change? I seem to remember something like that.

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I can undertand why they got bumped. But, they should REFUND the difference to the people that paid according to the chart and were placed in cheaper seating. Instead, they are keeping ALL the money.

That is very dishonorable.

A couple things come to mind:

1. Not sure about bball, but with football the dollar amounts are considered the "minimum donation" for seats in a given area.

2. It sucks, but when the higher-level donors step up in a money-driven priority system, the implications for any lower levels is obvious.

3. Is/was this your parents' first year to buy tix? Do they also have football tix? Ultimately, I think the TMF resorts to its new points system to resolve matters of priority.

Having said all that, I agree your folks got the short end. If they haven't gotten a better response from the TMF, they need to go higher up the food chain. I sent in my app with a letter requesting an upgrade in seats, along with the higher payment. I also stipulated that if an upgrade wasn't available that I would keep my seats from last season at the previous donation level. I didn't get my upgrade, but I also got a check refunding the difference. Hope your parents can get things reconciled.

Just look at the 2 charts and you can see how many people were bumped to cheaper seats.

I can fully understand why people were bumped. What I cant understand is why their money was kept when they were put into the lower donation level seating.

Instead, they changed the seating chart after they had all your money.

That is the problem.

REFUND THE DIFFERENCE!


[This message has been edited by BQbassdrum91 (edited 11/6/2006 11:40a).]

wow....that sucks.

I mean, if I underestimate something in my line of work....I cant just tell the customer "sorry, sucks for you".

Seems like the 12th man foundation caused this by underestimating their demand.

I think a lot of people got screwed over by this. I donated at the $100 level and was stuck in the public seating area. So I basically got ripped off for $100 more than most people who just bought a season ticket package without a donation. It's very unprofessional conduct and I'm disappointed in the athletic dept and Byrne.

Yeah, but Aggies don't lie, cheat, etc. etc.

Same thing happened to me. I was surprised that I ended up in 119. The foundation employee explained in so many words the demand exceeded supply. Further, I was told that the color chart was only an "estimate" of seats available at the respective donation. No big thing since I ended up with decent seats. But, if the color chart was an "estimate," that should have been made clear in the beginning. A good rule: Say what you mean and mean what you say. And NEVER leave doubt as to the guidelines.

You are right. They should refund the difference if they didn't make it crystal clear that the original chart was just a rough estimate with no guarantee.

BTW; why are so many great seats "unavailable"?

12th Man didn't pull a switch or screw anybody!!! It is a matter of supply and demand. We put together a group and ordered tickets. Yes, we rolled the dice and pitched in to get the $500 per seat tickets. We were bumped as well. If more people than expected donated $2k and $1k, then to bad for us. We were excited to see there was that much enthusiasm for the b-ball program.

As a side note, be prepare to not be able to attend games this year if you do not hold season tickets and wait until the last minute to try to get tickets.

Oh, that's right. You will just b****about that as well since they didn't save tickets for you to buy.

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12th Man didn't pull a switch or screw anybody!!! It is a matter of supply and demand. We put together a group and ordered tickets. Yes, we rolled the dice and pitched in to get the $500 per seat tickets. We were bumped as well. If more people than expected donated $2k and $1k, then to bad for us. We were excited to see there was that much enthusiasm for the b-ball program.

As a side note, be prepare to not be able to attend games this year if you do not hold season tickets and wait until the last minute to try to get tickets.

Oh, that's right. You will just b****about that as well since they didn't save tickets for you to buy.

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-Did you look at the 2 different charts? How can you even say that things were not switched?
They took our money and THEN changed the chart. How is that not some sort of fraud? How can you say that they should not at least refund the difference when they place you in the lower donation level seats?

That's one that sucks about the donation thing. You are basically putting up a bid based on a guestimation of seating. You are not buying seats you are donating.

unavailable seats are for special people, like the players families and recruits and whatnot and whoever else the team and coaches wan;ts to come.

It doesn't seem like what they did was fair. You should have been informed that your donation no longer matches the required donation and that you are being moved to a different section and you should be offered a refund if you don't want to move to the new section. If it wasn't stated that the donatin leves can change than what they did seems illegal.

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. Further, I was told that the color chart was only an "estimate" of seats available at the respective donation.

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Can I just estimate the amount Im gonna donate for a section?

Seems like they shouldn't estimate what section you'll be in (based on $$$ spent).

That does suck. What is worse is that this type of thing might drive away people that would support the basketball program if they didnt have to deal with this kind of crap.

Ouch.

Although, I don't think you were frauded or cheated.

(Heck! Look at the charts. There's a few rows of $1000 donation level seats where previously they were marked as $250 donation. They "lost" $750 bucks each!)

Outside of an optional refund and losing my tickets altogether, if I was in your situation I really don't know what I would expect aTm to do about it. I would be upset, but moreso at myself for not being able to afford a higher donation.

The donation schedule makes ticketing priority based on the ammount donated. The more you pay, the higher priority you get. Your competition is the other ticket buyers/donators. Considering the fact that so many people donated more than $1000 - they all, by right, get a higher seating priority than you. That pushes you back. We don't actually expect that aTm would go back to the extra $1000 donators when the $1000 donation section is full and tell 'em "Your section is full, and we can't move the people that paid less, so here's your seat in the nosebleeds, and thanks for your donation." No, we know that everyone gets pushed back. If you expect everyone should get a refund and seated by priority based on their original donation, you're dreaming. Then next year you'll get people "donating" way more than what's listed just to get a higher priority, then when it comes time to pay up, they'll say, "But, I didn't think I'd actually have to pay the whole eleventy billion dollars!!!". If you want a refund, you're going to have to be put behind in priority to everyone else that kept their $250 donation, and you'd move back even further.

I suggest you complain about the lack of the word "estimate" on the ticket ordering system to the althetic department. Then try to come to terms with how far $250 dollars goes in this situation. Then get out there and support the men on that team. If the best revenge is living well, then you'll get 'em good!!!

I'm not against you. I just don't see what can be done.

That sucks and is a slippery slope. What's next, student sections being reduced/moved so that they can fill those seats with big money donors?

locals being phased out sucks. they were some of the only diehards back in the days of melvin and co.

I guess I can somewhat sympathize. But, this is what happens when you wait until the team is good before supporting them and buying season tickets. You don't necessarily get your pick of prime seats. You have to "get in line" with everyone else that now wants season tickets.

People who have bought season tickets for years don't play the guessing game. Yes, they now have to pay more for their tickets but they know how much they have to pay to renew their seats.

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Outside of an optional refund and losing my tickets altogether, if I was in your situation I really don't know what I would expect aTm to do about it. I would be upset, but moreso at myself for not being able to afford a higher donation.

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I think the issue here, is the fact that his parents did pay for 'higher level' seats, but now are bumped back to the lower level, and aren't refunded any of the money.

If the ticket office wants to adjust the seating, fine.....but accomodate the people you're having to bump.

sad

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I guess I can somewhat sympathize. But, this is what happens when you wait until the team is good before supporting them and buying season tickets

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FWIW- They are being bumped for these type of people. The ticket office didnt realize there would be as much demand for higher level seats......obviously because of the renewed interest in the program, and the number of new people willing to buy higher level seats.

And I know multiple people that supported Aggie basketball through all the horrible years by buying season tickets, but can't afford them now. I wish we grandfathered them in, or made some type of consideration for their years of support.

Like I said, if they made a mis-calculation on the demand for seats, fine....but do something to accomodate these people who purchased season tickets.

call the state attorney general's office for consumer issues

(800) 621-0508

this is bait-and-switch. even if the demand did go up, they advertised a product at a price and then substituted a lower value product at the same price. if they underestimated the demand, then they flunk marketing 101 but the law doesn't allow what they did ... not even close.

from the state AG's website:

§ 17.46. DECEPTIVE TRADE PRACTICES UNLAWFUL. (a) False,
misleading, or deceptive acts or practices in the conduct of any
trade or commerce are hereby declared unlawful and are subject to
action by the consumer protection division under Sections 17.47,
17.58, 17.60, and 17.61 of this code.
(b) Except as provided in Subsection (d) of this section,
the term "false, misleading, or deceptive acts or practices"
includes, but is not limited to, the following acts:

(7) representing that goods or services are of a
particular standard, quality, or grade, or that goods are of a
particular style or model, if they are of another;

(9) advertising goods or services with intent not to
sell them as advertised;
(10) advertising goods or services with intent not to
supply a reasonable expectable public demand, unless the
advertisements disclosed a limitation of quantity;

(24) failing to disclose information concerning goods
or services which was known at the time of the transaction if such
failure to disclose such information was intended to induce the
consumer into a transaction into which the consumer would not have
entered had the information been disclosed;

(27) taking advantage of a disaster declared by the
governor under Chapter 418 {I believe this applies to our football coach}

[This message has been edited by XL2Win (edited 11/6/2006 4:58p).]

happened to me too. last time I checked 'bait and switch' scheme was illegal in Texas. AttorneyGeneral needs to look into this one.

Are you sure people who made the listed donation and were RENEWING season ticket holders got bumped????? If so, that is horribly wrong. I can understand prioritizing the NEW season ticket holders and having to bump them if the demand exceeds available seats. (You can't just magically create more seats than there are.) But, to bump RENEWING season ticket holders who make the listed donation is just wrong. I would like to hear it directly from someone it happened to - it is my understanding that renewals are not being bumped.

Yes, they had to pay more this year. And if they choose NOT to make the new listed donation, they obviously did get bumped.

I would also like to have seen some sort of grandfathering for people that had season tickets for say 5 or more years. Lord knows we suffered through some almost unbearable years. (We have our tickets for 12 years.)

DEPENDING on the wording of the letter, it may or may not be a "bait and switch" scenario. I personally did not memorize the letter we got with the renewal packages and certainly don't know what new season ticker holder were told. Sometimes people don't really read those things carefully. It may have been worded in such a way that the donation does NOT guarantee a seat in that particular section.

Does anyone know the EXACT wording that was given to new season ticket applicants?

it's still without conscience

[This message has been edited by XL2Win (edited 11/6/2006 4:59p).]

at a minimum they should be notified and given the option of taking or refusing the
'new" seats.

next, $Will will have fill-in-the-blank tikcet prices with a dutch auction

12th Man renewals were not bumped. Some of you should have been donating through the lean years.

so screwing new guys is okay?

i don't want an athletic dept that works in this manner regardless of whether it's new or renewal. it's just not right and unethical if not outright illegal.