I was curious so I did cursory research on the Armata Tank pertaining to the location of the Tank Commander. The TC station is in the hull of the tank. That has to degrade the TC's 360 visibility of the battlefield.
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Russian Armata Tank
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Last: 28 days ago by Tanker123
It is supposed to have 360 degree camera visibility - though given the constant presence of UAVs in Ukraine, 360x180 would seem to be needed.
I know from experience that being inside a fully buttoned up turret as a TC makes it difficult to see, even with periscopes all around, and to keep oriented on the vehicle's movement. Just driving becomes a challenge, let alone fighting.
I remember a CMTC rotation back in 1998. My Bradley company was attached to a tank battalion. We were doing an attack mission, and my company had opened a breach in the OPFOR main obstacle complex for the follow on tank company.
Watching the God's eye view in the AAR, you could watch the nice, organized formation of that tank company moving down the British Cut disintegrate as soon as the OPFOR hit them with gas and they had to button up. They didn't lose any tanks, but they just couldn't drive very well because the TCs couldn't see.
In any case, the T-14 Armata is, like a lot of Russia's supposed cutting edge weaponry, fielded in such small numbers, if they're even in operational service, that they're pretty much vaporware.
I know from experience that being inside a fully buttoned up turret as a TC makes it difficult to see, even with periscopes all around, and to keep oriented on the vehicle's movement. Just driving becomes a challenge, let alone fighting.
I remember a CMTC rotation back in 1998. My Bradley company was attached to a tank battalion. We were doing an attack mission, and my company had opened a breach in the OPFOR main obstacle complex for the follow on tank company.
Watching the God's eye view in the AAR, you could watch the nice, organized formation of that tank company moving down the British Cut disintegrate as soon as the OPFOR hit them with gas and they had to button up. They didn't lose any tanks, but they just couldn't drive very well because the TCs couldn't see.
In any case, the T-14 Armata is, like a lot of Russia's supposed cutting edge weaponry, fielded in such small numbers, if they're even in operational service, that they're pretty much vaporware.
You hit the nail on the head. It is significantly easier to TC with the head out of the hatch. On a few occasions I tried to TC an M1 using the periscope. I would say it degraded my visibility by a good 90%.
M1A2 vision blocks are substantially better than M1A1 and prior.
Snipers in Baghdad cured me of riding around with my head out of a hatch.
Snipers in Baghdad cured me of riding around with my head out of a hatch.
Was it you who shot the tower with a big round? lol Tower
Can't say I shot any minarets with the main gun.
But we coaxed a bunch of JAM dudes trying punch holes in my tank with RPGs.
But we coaxed a bunch of JAM dudes trying punch holes in my tank with RPGs.
Who knows if tanks of the future will essentially be just armored drone vehicles. But I just had an idea. Similar to the F35. What if the TC had augmented reality visors. Sensors all around allowed them to see through the tank in every direction, while just seeing an outline of the tank they were sitting in.Smeghead4761 said:
It is supposed to have 360 degree camera visibility - though given the constant presence of UAVs in Ukraine, 360x180 would seem to be needed.
I know from experience that being inside a fully buttoned up turret as a TC makes it difficult to see, even with periscopes all around, and to keep oriented on the vehicle's movement. Just driving becomes a challenge, let alone fighting.
Of course, sensors would be a weak spot. But seems like it would allow them greater situational awareness while keeping them protected. Could automatically switch between regular camera mode to IR mode to NVG mode as needed.
I am not saying it can't be done. A challenge is the TC has to monitor the terrain to give the driver minute instructions. It would be easier in the defense.
Not really anymore with the SEP. The TC can send the grid of the objective to the driver, through the tanks system, and the driver can then navigate the tank without a lot of input from the TC, ASSUMING you had a good driver. I used to just tell my driver which direction to go and not run us into a large hole or hit massive bumps as I did not feel like losing teeth on the .50.Tanker123 said:
I am not saying it can't be done. A challenge is the TC has to monitor the terrain to give the driver minute instructions. It would be easier in the defense.
A good driver can keep his place in whatever formation, minus a line formation, by knowing which tanks to keep in his vision blocks. It takes a good driver and practice, but if you put effort into training your crew correctly they can take a lot off of the TC's plate when maneuvering.
The problem is in less open terrain, such as woods or rocky terrain. Also hazards that the driver can't see. In the Bradley, the driver's visibility to the right sight is very limited. Also maneuvering at night. The driver's thermal viewer is almost as much like looking through a toilet paper tube as PVS-7s or -14s, but without the ability to move your head.
Everything you said is valid, but again, good training can alleviate a lot of these problems. Also, the thermal viewer can be turned so you can see to the left and right, but not to a large degree.Smeghead4761 said:
The problem is in less open terrain, such as woods or rocky terrain. Also hazards that the driver can't see. In the Bradley, the driver's visibility to the right sight is very limited. Also maneuvering at night. The driver's thermal viewer is almost as much like looking through a toilet paper tube as PVS-7s or -14s, but without the ability to move your head.
The TC's driving instructions become more pronounced in contact drills and maneuvering on the enemy.
Actually, it is during Action Drills that the TC would be more involved with the driver, as Contact Drills are only traversing the turret toward the enemy contact.Tanker123 said:
The TC's driving instructions become more pronounced in contact drills and maneuvering on the enemy.
The TACSOP I studied stated it was much more than just traversing to the enemy. Perhaps the terminology changed.clarythedrill said:Actually, it is during Action Drills that the TC would be more involved with the driver, as Contact Drills are only traversing the turret toward the enemy contact.Tanker123 said:
The TC's driving instructions become more pronounced in contact drills and maneuvering on the enemy.
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