My brother seems to be having some trouble with his local recruiters. I was wondering if you guys have any suggestions about this. Cliff notes listed below.

* Bro is class of 2004, wants to fly kiowas
* Applying for warrant officer program right off the street.
* Has taken and passed his PT test
* Waiting to take the AFAST, did very well on ASVAB
* Clearance interview is coming soon, with credit report being cleared
* No prior arrests or convictions
* Waiting on the flight physical, and here is where the problem is. Recruiters are telling him BAMC or MEPPS in San Antonio are not doing flight physicals until the end of the month because of construction, and there is no definite word on when they will resume.

My question, can the recruiters do more for him? Or are there ways around this? Can he go elsewhere to get a flight physical? I'm hoping maybe somebody knows something we haven't thought of yet. He is wanting to get to basic as soon as possible. Appreciate it!

Ft. Rucker, AL

What about it? I realize that is where the flight school is.

The problem is that it's by region.

The locations I know that do the physicals are:

-Ft. Carson, CO (6th Brigade)
-Ft. Sam Houston, TX (5th Brigade)
-Ft. Knox (3rd Brigade)
-Ft. Rucker (2nd Brigade)
-Walter Reed (1st Brigade)

Since Texas falls under 5th Brigade, by USAREC regulations, recruiters are not allowed to take recruits outside of the Brigade footprint to get these done. (Technically they can, but they won't get funded TDY and will get charged for any mileage put on the GOV).

It's one of many stupid regulations that USAREC has. Also, it's easier to get commissioned under OCS than it is under WOFT because the approving authority for OCS is the Recruiting Battalion Commmander (O5), while the approving authority for WOFT is the Commanding General (O8).

From what you're saying, he hasn't gone to the review board either. Even before his packet goes to Knox, he has to pass a review board at the Recruiting Battalion (usually consists of 2 Captains and a Major). After that's done, then it has to get approved by USAREC, where the packet is ranked against all other applicants NATIONWIDE. This is in contrast to the OCS board, which the Battalion Commander can approve immediately.

[This message has been edited by CGSC Lobotomy (edited 8/19/2010 3:06p).]

So it's best to just keep chipping away at the smaller pieces and wait it out for the physical. He was thinking about OCS, but there is no garantee he would branch aviation. Thanks for the info.

He has to consider the tradeoff:

Either

1. Wait through the process of WOFT but be guaranteed a flight spot.

OR

2. Get a guaranteed commission but have Benning determine the branch based off of needs of the Army.

Go with option 1. If he want to be a 'branch' officer later, he can, and will stay in aviation. I don't know many people having luck getting AVN out of OCS. Most guys already coming through are Warrants already.

It will be well worth the wait. I had to wait a while for my initial flight physical as well. Good luck, the WOFT program is hard to get into.

Thanks for the advice. I'll pass it on!

I don't see how construction is holding up flight physicals, but that's not the strangest excuse I've heard for things.

I'll be at Ft. Sam at MEPS for something else next Thursday, but I'll see if I can make friends with someone down there and ask about them. In the meantime, tell him to study for the AFAST. It's not nearly as hard as the Navy/USMC/Coasties ASTB, but still requires some looking over things. If he wants some info. on what types of things he should be looking at or which study guides are actually worth a crap, he can e-mail me: stephaniegarcia oh-six (numbers) at gmail dot com

Tell him not to give up. In October, it will be two years since I've been trying to get in. Finally going to happen for me, albeit with a totally different branch than I started out with. ANYTHING is worth it to fly in my book.

If he wants to fly, he will have to do the WOC route. OCS does not commission AVN lieutenants (unless prior pilots, of course), at all.

Good luck to him with the Kiowa flying. I've been in 3 big units in the Army and haven't even seen one of those in the inventory.


TXAgChick - are you going to be a 67J dust-off?

[This message has been edited by 1stRangersAg (edited 8/21/2010 9:33a).]

you have not seen a kiowa? am i reading that right?

1stRangers - nope. I'll be a pilot. Just went about it a totally different way than I had ever thought of going.

USMC decided they didn't want me to fly for them after all.

I'll have pictures of the actual ride in my profile after next week

What happened? I thought it was finally working out. What are you going to fly now?

Funny, I almost switched to the Navy to fly...right before I got my Army commission. At the time I thought I didn't really want to be on a ship for 6 months. 6 months....

I've seen Kiowas during training events and while deployed, but the units I've been in haven't had Kiowas in their inventory. Not every division has them.

I thought Kiowas were only in Cav Squadrons, not ATK AVN units.

Well, 82nd's CAB used to have a CAV SQN and ATK BN both made of 58s. Part of the airborne package deal..and now just one CAV made of 58s. Without going into too much detail WRT who is going where, yes, 58s will be all CAV units.

[This message has been edited by Fly Army 97 (edited 8/22/2010 3:15p).]

TXAGChick06, Basically they were saying no flight physicals were being done until the end of the month because BAMC is all over the place disorganized with construction going on. Having worked on Fort Sam, I believe it. I also see that being a problem, because the fiscal year is coming to a close and it gets harder and harder to get in at that point. So, he was hoping he could hurry up and get it over with. He has been studying for the AFAST, all in all I think he is ready and looks like a good candidate, but I'm biased. He has completed his security clearance so, now he is just waiting on the flight physical, the AFAST, and the board. I think they have a work around now, I believe they are sending folks to the TMCs, normallly reserved for already in processed Soldiers, I think they saw a need for it.

Also, because the approving authority is CG-USAREC, the board at Battalion HQ won't be the only board he has to contend with (trust me on this, I was a Recruiting Company Commander until summer 2009)

quote:

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he is ready and looks like a good candidate, but I'm biased

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Yes, you are biased. Don't let that get in the way of making sure he has a strong packet. Any CW4 can tell you if you have a strong packet or not. In the Aviation community, recruiters (not the command) have a really bad rep when it comes to street-to-flight school guys.

One of the critiques for the national board are guys sending up LORs from high ranking dudes for whom they never worked...if you are gonna do that, at least make sure the LOR has substance vs. 'I met this dude and he looks like a stud'. I have an article about it from the Chief WO of the Army if you are interested.

[This message has been edited by Fly Army 97 (edited 8/23/2010 1:39p).]

Fly brings up a good point. He really would help his cause if he has a recommendation from a Warrant Officer who was/is a pilot in the Army.

He does have a LOR from a WO4. Someone he knows and has associated with.

My experience with the WOCS from civilian is if he doesn't blow the the AFAST out of the water and/or have some pretty amazing accomplishments in the civilian world he won't get selected.

Whoops - sorry just now following up. Did he ever get a class 1? If not, tell his recruiter to try Ft. Hood. I just called today and got in for Monday/Tuesday. That said, I'm currently considered active reserves so YMMV.

Ft. Sam was going to make me wait until mid-October and then I'd have to find a flight surgeon to ok it (second part.) Apparently they don't currently have a permanent one on staff in the area.

quote:

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2. Get a guaranteed commission but have Benning determine the branch based off of needs of the Army

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Despite warnings to the contrary, this might be the way to go. If his AFAST score is "blown out the water" and he's qualified in all other ways, he can still apply for flight school, even as an infantry, or quartermaster officer. It's a risk, but it ain't impossible to be selected. Good luck to him.

Thanks for checking back. With the new fiscal year close now, everything is pretty much tied up because of the Army being full. At least that is what the recruiters are telling him. They say unless he is immaculate on paper and a superstar he will not get picked up. Personally, I think this is just a way for recruiters to get people to enlist. And that is exactly what my brother is thinking of doing in order to get his foot in the door. I enlisted once, but I wanted him to start off better than I did. Sometimes you just can't make them drink, so to speak. Anyway, he is getting his flight physical while he is at basic, but he won't be able to get to basic until January. Absolutely ridiculous. His enlistment is not a bad idea, but I guess he feels like he doesn't have a better option if he wants to fly. So he'll go in as a specialist and maybe become a crew chief at some point, then apply for the WOC program from the inside. I'll let you know when he raises his right hand and what MOS he'll have.

It's January probably so he backs right up to AIT training. Everyone is just backed up now with budget cuts, end of year "we have no more money because we spent it all" etc. They'll front load a lot of classes after October.

I couldn't get a BCT date until Nov 1 when I signed end of August, but they pushed me to Nov 22 so I head straight to Benning for OCS (well, have a couple weeks in between) without having to come back to TX first.

What's he going to do MOS wise as enlisted?

15T, 15U, 15S, OR 68W. I depends on what is available at MEPPS at the time he raises his right hand.

15T, 15U, 15S, OR 68W. I depends on what is available at MEPPS at the time he raises his right hand.