Have a guy quoting me for my deck steps, which are getting a bit dangerous due to rot. The cedar is obviously a little more expensive than the p.t. Any thoughts on if it's worth paying the extra for the cedar? It works out to be an extra $230.

Aust Ag said:

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It works out to be an extra $230.

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How much is the base bid?

Worth it. Pressure treated always seems to have the green tint to it.

Cedar

TexAg1987 said:

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Aust Ag said:

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It works out to be an extra $230.

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How much is the base bid?

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$340 vs $570

Cedar is not naturally decay resistant anymore because it is all sapwood. You will have to stain it regularly. If he uses cedar make sure they seal all of the cut ends as they go. I cannot stress this enough. If you don't do this, you are leaving the most vulnerable part of the wood exposed to accelerated rot. If they balk at this, they are not worth giving them your money.

Lumber used to be a tree which soaks up water from the ground up. The end of the board were made for pulling in water. If you don't seal the ends you get water in the board and that starts the rot from the inside out. To top it off, the ends of the boards on a deck are typically the places that dry out the slowest, like butt joints, or ends butted up against the house.

What is the deck top surface currently ?


In the real world, On a horizontal surface, cedar almost always fits faster than PT pine.

Get composite deck boards. Done!

Properly maintained, cedar will look better and last longer than PT. So just depends on what you are wanting. If you don't care what it looks like, PT will last a long time too if you seal it regularly with Thompsons or the like. Both need to be maintained.

Does sealing apply to cedar fencing as well?

Of course, but I recommend using a sacrificial horizontal board at the bottom of a cedar fence. That way, the one board is touching the ground and the ends of all of the others are up off the ground where they won't soak up so much water. When the board eventually rots you only replace the bottom one. Staining the ends of cedar fencing is easy. Just use a roller on the stack before it's installed and then hit the rest after it's nailed up.

Aways use a rot board on fencing.

As for stairs, have you considered Pine for the structure and cedar on the treads and risers? That should split some of the cost and PT pine is better next to dirt.

GrimesCoAg95 said:

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Aways use a rot board on fencing.

As for stairs, have you considered Pine for the structure and cedar on the treads and risers? That should split some of the cost and PT pine is better next to dirt.

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This and read up on the newer classifications for pressure treated wood. You would be amazed how many pros don't even know it. You want at least UC4A if it is touching the ground. They all look the same. You have to check the tags on the end of the board to know what it is.

To expand a bit on this...TECHNICALLY it doesn't even have to be in contact with the ground to require UC4A treatment. I believe the actual recommendation is anything within 6 inches, anything that is not easily replaced (structural floor joists on a deck even if 12-18" off the ground), anything that is in a moisture heavy area, etc.

That's why most retailers are moving to pretty much everything in a 2x6 and wider being treated to UC4A.

Builder93 said:

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Of course, but I recommend using a sacrificial horizontal board at the bottom of a cedar fence. That way, the one board is touching the ground and the ends of all of the others are up off the ground where they won't soak up so much water. When the board eventually rots you only replace the bottom one. Staining the ends of cedar fencing is easy. Just use a roller on the stack before it's installed and then hit the rest after it's nailed up.

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Because the ends of the rot board aren't stuck in the ground, it should even last longer than the pickets would have.

squeak79 said:

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To expand a bit on this...TECHNICALLY it doesn't even have to be in contact with the ground to require UC4A treatment. I believe the actual recommendation is anything within 6 inches, anything that is not easily replaced (structural floor joists on a deck even if 12-18" off the ground), anything that is in a moisture heavy area, etc.

That's why most retailers are moving to pretty much everything in a 2x6 and wider being treated to UC4A.

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I've read quite a bit about the distance from the ground and the sources can vary a little about the specifics. I wish everything would just go to UC4A. minimum.

I ask the question about the rating of their PT wood to retailers and most of the people even behind the pro desk have to go ask someone else. In a big city it is probably different, but it gets frustrating in a small market.

I'm in purchasing so I try to stay on top of it as much as possible. The guidelines have changed so much over the years so confusion isnt uncommon at all. Hell the treaters themselves vary on their interpretation from time to time! As a retailer we just get hung in the middle when there are issues which I will admit are actually few and far between, regardless of the guidelines. I will say that I expect more claims in the next few years because of this last change, primarily on decks. People assume that the decks dont have to be ground contact if they are elevated, and that just isnt the case.

I used to build nice decks. Now I just encourage people to do concrete or pavers because people don't take care of them. Why cut down perfectly good trees to lay them out to rot?

Interesting, I've encountered this confusion recently because I get such conflicting advise on a current project.

Bought a kit for a shade sail. It comes with all the brackets, hardware and sails, you buy the lumber and put it together. Pretty nifty.

But I need to mount 4 of 6 of the posts on my concrete patio, and the other two will be on the ground, so I will put them into concrete.

I've gotten exact opposite answers, about half and half, talking to several different lumber yards, I'd say 50/50 split on whether I should use cedar or pressure treated (rated for ground contact) wood.

I have settled on PT as the wiser option (feel free to talk me out of it), but now of course I can't get any.

So I am just working on my suntan instead.

We will is install PT for things on the ground. I would not use it for fences, pergolas or covers. PT will warp and curl and look like junk. You have a little more control when it is being used for decking.

Would 6x6 PT posts warp?

your heavier posts are fine. Its the 2x and 1x material that will look terrible in few years.

For the price of 6x6 PT these days (assuming you can find it), it may be cheaper to go galvanized steel tube or mild steel that you paint.

And for a shade sail, you can just get some drill pipe and paint that. Will outlast any wood.