I live in B/CS and planted four Savannah Holly shrubs last Spring and they all grew fairly well until the end of Summer, when one of them shed most of its leaves in a one-week span (the third from the left in the photo below). I figured it was a watering issue, so I began watering that one slightly more and it seemed to at least survive. I was hoping it would come back more this spring.

HOWEVER, just last week, the one second from the left has done the exact same thing out of nowhere. Is this just a watering issue, or something different? I really haven't had them on a watering schedule because of the weather, but maybe I should have? I'd love to save this and prevent it from happening to the others, so any help would be appreciated!

Also, I have them on a drip watering system, so if anyone has recommendations for how many gallons at each irrigation they should be getting per season, I'm all ears. I've tried to research it and have gotten varied info, so I've just been guessing (which...uhh...doesn't seem to be working out very well).

What did you do to prepare the soil before you planted them?

It was previously grass, so we removed all the sod and tilled the soil. I had a landscape guy actually plant the hollies, though, so I'm not 100% sure if he added anything around the root ball when he planted them. We also planted some Viburnum in the shaded areas to the right and left of the hollies, and those seem to be doing really well.

So you just tilled up native soil and planted them?

Stick your finger in the ground near the base of the shrub. It is probably very wet. You don't want that.

Builder93 said:

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So you just tilled up native soil and planted them?

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No, sorry, I just forgot that I did bring in new soil for the beds and mixed it with compost.

I will test the base of the shrub when I get home today, although it's misting this morning and it might rain. Are you thinking the soil is TOO wet?

- My initial thought is that they were allowed to get too dry. The vast majority of times when we lose a holly it a result of it getting dry.
- Are you saying that you didn't water them at all during the fall/winter?
- Do you have a sharp shooter spade or soil probe? If you do pull back the mulch and insert the sharp shooter where the rootball meets the native soil. Go down as far as you can. Pull it out and see how wet the shovel is.
-Hollies will drop a portion of their older (interior) leaves every spring but your leaf drop is more than normal.
- re: drip irrigation, we will need to find out what size emitters you have in the drip tubing. Find the end of the drip tubing and cut out a emitter and then cut the tubing so you can see the back side of the emitter. It should have a number on it.

ftworthag02 said:

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- My initial thought is that they were allowed to get too dry. The vast majority of times when we lose a holly it a result of it getting dry.
- Are you saying that you didn't water them at all during the fall/winter?
- Do you have a sharp shooter spade or soil probe? If you do pull back the mulch and insert the sharp shooter where the rootball meets the native soil. Go down as far as you can. Pull it out and see how wet the shovel is.
-Hollies will drop a portion of their older (interior) leaves every spring but your leaf drop is more than normal.
- re: drip irrigation, we will need to find out what size emitters you have in the drip tubing. Find the end of the drip tubing and cut out a emitter and then cut the tubing so you can see the back side of the emitter. It should have a number on it.

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Thanks for your help!

I can't remember exactly when I turned my sprinkler system off, but I'm pretty sure I watered through most of the fall, maybe until mid-November. Then I watered very intermittently (maybe once every 3-4 weeks or so) through the winter. I've never watered any of my beds consistently Nov-Feb, and haven't had a problem other than these hollies. Should I be watering more than that?

It's now pouring here, so it may not be a great day to test the soil, but I will do that. Ideally, how wet should the shovel be (to what depth)? And should I test it after watering, or before?

I will also look at the emitter, but I'm pretty sure it's this one. I tested how much water was coming out the other day and it filled up a gallon in about 6 minutes (10 gallons/hour).

you're welcome!

You don't want the shovel to be bone dry but also you don't want it to be absolutely dripping wet. Sometimes you can stick a shove or probe down into a hole and hear the water in the bottom of the hole (you definitely don't want that)

link doesn't work

for right now lets just test it before you water and after the rains stop

Sounds good, I'll give that a try. Not sure why that link didn't work, but I think I fixed it. See if this works: https://www.lowes.com/pd/Mister-Landscaper-3-Pack-10-GPH-Adjustable-Spray-Drip-Irrigation-Multi-Stream-Dripper-Stake/1086995

The problem in our area is that the native clay soil creates a bathtub effect. The loose soil holds the moisture and the clay acts like a liner. The roots stay wet and they rot. A lot of times it can appear that they are dry because the surface is dry but if you did down a little further you might have a mucky smelly mess where the water has settled. Most plants in our soils do best when the beds are raised significantly and the soil is allowed to drain.

First, I never use the micro bubblers for shrubs or trees. The only time we will install those is for pots or hanging baskets. When we install drip we only use either netafim drip or rainbird drip tubing. [url]https://www.netafimusa.com/landscape/products/product-offering/driplines/[/url]
You could also use flood bubblers but they really need to be on their own zone for accurate watering.
[url]https://www.rainbird.com/products/1400-series-pressure-compensating-bubbler[/url]

(since you're not using drip tubing you won't need to cut out a emitter)

Builder93 said:

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The problem in our area is that the native clay soil creates a bathtub effect. The loose soil holds the moisture and the clay acts like a liner. The roots stay wet and they rot. A lot of times it can appear that they are dry because the surface is dry but if you did down a little further you might have a mucky smelly mess where the water has settled. Most plants in our soils do best when the beds are raised significantly and the soil is allowed to drain.

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Interesting. I'll be curious to see if that's the case after the soil dries up from this rain today!

ftworthag02 said:

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First, I never use the micro bubblers for shrubs or trees. The only time we will install those is for pots or hanging baskets. When we install drip we only use either netafim drip or rainbird drip tubing. https://www.netafimusa.com/landscape/products/product-offering/driplines/]https://www.netafimusa.com/landscape/products/product-offering/driplines/
You could also use flood bubblers but they really need to be on their own zone for accurate watering.
https://www.rainbird.com/products/1400-series-pressure-compensating-bubbler]https://www.rainbird.com/products/1400-series-pressure-compensating-bubbler

(since you're not using drip tubing you won't need to cut out a emitter)

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Gotcha. So do the micro bubblers focus the water too much in one concentrated spot? I would assume the advantage of the drip line is to water the area more evenly?

I think the microbubblers don't put out enough water for a large rootball plus you would need several of them around the rootball. Yes the drip tubing will have better coverage since the emitters are spaced 12-18" apart. If you were to install the drip tubing throughout the bed it will need to be on its own zone with a pressure reducer and filter installed next to valve. You can't install it on a existing pop up spray or rotor zone.

We just completed a install where we installed 13 65gal Nellie R. Stevens and we installed a new bubbler zone w/ 2 bubblers per Nellie.

Gotcha. So if I determine that the soil is too dry and install the correct drip system, what is the best way to know if I'm watering enough/too much? Just the same thing with the spade/soil probe? Is there a certain moisture depth that I should aim for, or is it more about the consistency of the soil overall?

I have an oak holly (30 gal) that was planted in 10/18.

Around 9/19, noticed a spot in the middle that browned and looked like it was dying. This happened on 2 others planted at the same time. Those 2 recovered but one continued to brown and now roughly a third of the plant has died. Rest of the plant appears healthy

Any idea on what happened or how to handle?

Pics below, from original planting, late last year, and recent.

Thanks.

Anyone have any thoughts?

I would pull the mulch away from the base of the plant. Particularly with woody plants you want to keep the mulch from the base so it doesn't transfer molds or other pathogens to the plant. And I would cut off the dead part. That's not coming back.

Hey Builder93 and ftworthag02, I pulled out some soil that was about 8-10" beneath the outside of the root ball of our savannah holly that lost all its leaves. I tried to show you how it looks loose and clumped together (see below). The last time I watered was Sunday (6 days ago) and it did rain on Monday, but I think the Brazos Valley only got 0.18" (according to this).

BTW, the two healthiest ones have now started dropping a lot of leaves as well and many of the leaves have yellowed.

This is the soil that was 8-10" below the holly - is it too wet?