Hey guys,

First time home owner here in the Frisco area. Moved in last September but didn't apply any fall fertilizer (mainly bc I had no idea what I was doing) Anyway, I was wondering if anyone else's lawn is still pretty dormant? I bought some fertilizer but I've read that you shouldn't apply anything until after your 2nd mow. I have some spots of my lawn that are growing here and there but the majority of my backyard is still dormant.

Is everyone else is in the same situation or do I need to be doing anything to my lawn. Should I start running the sprinklers yet? Any advice is appreciated.

sw fort worth here...

Bermuda lawns around me are JUST barely starting to come out of dormancy. essentially right now, if they are green...it's weeds.


I leave my Bermuda pretty high during the late fall and winter... as it begins going dormant. Then I scalp it in early/late march (depending on weather). The dramatic cold spells we had in february (imho) has kept it dormant longer this season that normal.


Anyway:
-mowed the front on Fri night
-mowed the back on Sat afternoon
-watered early on Sun morning
-Put down fertilizer immediately after watering on Sun morning




[This message has been edited by edwardsk2003 (edited 3/31/2014 11:01a).]

Type of grass?

I've been running my sprinklers since start of March and my grass is greening up. I also applied 15-5-10 fertilizer and pre-emergent around then too. I have a mix of common bermuda and tif-419 bermuda. I live in North FW.

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then I scalp it in early/late march (depending on weather).

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I've never heard of this method, what does it do?

scalping is supposed to set up your lawn for thick healthy growing season

I have Bermuda grass.

Question - If the grass is still dormant why would you put down the fertilizer? Like i mentioned in my original post, I read its best to put it down after the 2nd mow. Would I be okay putting it down now then?

You can begin mowing your lawn at first sign of green up. You just want to make sure a frost is out of the question when you do. I live in Sugar Land and have Celebration Bermuda and I started mowing around the first week of March. At this point it is almost entirely green.

As mentioned before you can scalp it before it greens up but if the yard is partially greening you had better scalp it off in stages. No more than 1/3 the cutting height at a time at a frequency no more than 2 days. Take it as low as you can. I cut mine down to 3/8" and am keeping it at 1/2" now. It took about 3 weeks to recover but it looks great now and better every day.

To address your post above. You can fertilize as soon as your lawn starts to green up too. You can speed up the process by the scalping technique as mentioned. It opens the canopy allows sun to warm the soil and starts training your grass stolons to grow along the ground and sprout new growth points. Bag clippings when you scalp. Its a pain but necessary. Doing this sets the stage for a thick lawn that rejects weeds throughout the season. Just understand you are also exposing the lawn to weeds during the few weeks of a scalped lawn. Put down a high quality pre emergent herbicide before your first cut. I use Greenlight Amaze with great success.

[This message has been edited by Kceovaisnt- (edited 4/1/2014 1:23p).]

My backyard has quite a few weeds already. Should I scalp the lawn and then apply a weed & feed?

I'd scalp.... put preemergent 1-2 weeks for your broadleaf weeds to recover and then put post emergent.

I agree w everything kc said above...


Also:
I bought a pre and post emergent from ace hardware and put it down twice. Once in like oct and again in Feb. My yard is noticeably weed free..... I'll take a pic of the bag..but it's what I'm going to use 2-3x per year moving forward.

Normally about now(early april) I get (what I feel) is a lot of poa annua grass....so far this year....no weeds... no grassy weeds..no broadleaf weeds.....

No crabgrass andd thanks goodness no poa annua. That stuff kills me.

[This message has been edited by edwardsk2003 (edited 4/1/2014 9:03p).]

^^ Agree.

You can fertilize just after scalping to get your turf to start spreading. The accelerated growth of the weeds actually makes the post emergent herbicide kill the weeds more effectively due to increased plant metabolism.

Also. If you have bermuda in the back I would avoid all weed & feed products as most contain altrazine which is bad for bermuda and simultaneous applications make no sense. Get fertilizer and post emergent separately and apply separately. Usually basic broadleaf weed killers work best about 1.5 to 2 weeks after fertilizing. Try not to use a granular weed killer, spot treat the weeds if you can. If you have persistent grassy weeds, you will likely need some expensive selective weed killer like Image RTU but if you have a real salad in the backyard, use less expensive broadleaf weed killers first. Otherwise, Image is safe to use on bermuda and kills sedges, dallis grass, johnson grass, wild onion, crabgrass and such.

Be mindful of the labels. Products like Roundup will kill your lawn if not dormant.

Good hunting.

Thanks guys I appreciate the info. Edwards if you could let me know the name of the pre emergent you buy at Ace that would be great!

Rage, the weeds you are now seeing are from the lack of a pre-emergent last fall. Any pre-emergent you put down now are for the warm weather summer weeds. It's getting a little late for the summer prevention application but I think you still have time. Make sure your pre-emergent has either halts or dimension.
Wait until the grass is actively growing before you put down the fertilizer.

Great so does this mean I'll be dealing with all these weeds through the summer?

there are post emergent herbicides that will stop some weeds, mostly broadleaf. But once you fertilize and thicken your yard most of those weeds will die. If you have a weed that is in your yard year around, then yes you are probably stuck with it this year. Put a pre-emergent down in the fall.

It's the maddening (to me, at least) part of lawn care - when it doesn't look bad, there's work to be done. When it looks horrible, you've missed your chance.

I'm trying to catch up on the maintenance/schedule as well and have a ton of weeds because I didn't get anything down until a few weeks ago, so I feel your pain.

go to Home Depot and get a simple bottle of Ortho Weed-Be-Gone and spray it on your lawn and it will take care of most of the weeds you are seeing now.

Remember weeds are growing now and grass is (at least in DFW) just starting to come out of dormancy, so yes it will look bad right now if there are weeds present. Just mow it low (1.25 to 1.5) and often, put a post emergent down and fertilize and it will start to look much better in a couple of weeks.

I do kinda the same as edwardsk.

But esk2003-why do you water THEN put out fertilizer? Is it a slow release? I always do the opposite so my water can break down my fertilizer and “water it in”

I’m about to scalp mine today or tomorrow and catch all the grass clippings. Then, I’m going to bring in some sand to level it out. I did this last year (you can search for my thread on it with pics) and it worked great. I just want to level out a few more areas this year.

As for fertilizer timing, I usually put some out every 2 months during the mowing season and probably 2 times during the winter. During the mowing season, I usually get higher Nitrogen fertilizer. (N is the first value in the N-P-K…not sure how new all this is for you). Nitrogen makes it green and grow faster. P and K are more for root development (reason why I don’t care to put out N during the winter. It’s dormant and not green).

Also, about every other time I fertilize, I put out some pre-emerg. Don’t waste your $ on the weed/feed. Buy them separately. I but the big 50# bag of Lesco Pre-M pre-emerge (yellow and white bag). Last me all year. Make sure you don’t get any in your flower bed or in tree beds. Keep it in your grass ONLY. And blow off your driveway and sidewalks after spreading any of this. Also, spread a little on your neighbors yard, where yours and his meet. That way, when he has an ugly yard with weeds, your property line will still be weed free!!

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That way, when he has an ugly yard with weeds, your property line will still be weed free!!

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And if he's like me and neglected his yard for too long, he'll appreciate the fact that at least 1 foot of his property is "nice".

Thanks guys, I appreciate the good advice on this thread.

AggieWH08P - thanks for the N-P-K break down as well. I did not know what those numbers meant.

no problem
do some googling and you can learn more about it.

As for pre-emerg timing, try to do it around the major holidays. Jan (new years), April (easter, June (Memorial Day-even though its May), Sept (Labor Day).

to make it easy for me, I just set a reminder in my calendar for ever 3-4 months to apply it.

Is putting it down 4 times a year overkill though? I've been told to put it down in October & February. I guess a summer application wouldn't hurt.

I dont know if it can hurt. With that said, if you mow it at the correct cutting height, fertilize appropriatley, and don't over-water, your grass should be thick enough to prevent weeds until a year from now. Any small weed issues can be dealt with by pulling early or spot treating with a post emergent.

The best weed prevention is a strong and healthy lawn. It might be a good idea to keep it mowed at the minimum recommended height for your bermuda for the rest of spring. If it's common, mow it at 1", if it's hybrid, mow it at 0.5" or as low as you can if your mower cannot get that low. Keeping it at the lower range of cutting height encourages horizontal growth patterns which yeilds a dense carpet of turf. Once the heat of summer arrives, keep it at the high end of the reccomended height range. If common: 2", if hybrid: 1.5". I am assuming you do not have an ultrdwarf cultivar. You would know if you did.

Just food for thought. Most people here in Sugar Land keep theirs around 3" and seem dumbfounded why their yard looks like crap.

just caught back up on this thread...

to answer a few questions directed asked specifically of me:

@AaggieRage
this is what i used this year.
Manuf Product Page:http://www.bonide.com/products/product.php?category_id=60476

Label: http://www.bonide.com/lbonide/backlabels/l60476.pdf


AggieWho8p: I bought a simple weed/feed fertilizer from Ace. http://www.acehardware.com/product/index.jsp?productId=11227198. I did feature/cost comparison to Scott's (in the store) and found this to be a much much better deal. One bag, entire front and back.

Regarding the watering before fertilizing. I always do this... water a bit first, get the leaves of the broad-leaf weeds wet/moist. This allows the fertilizer to literally 'stick' to the weeds leaves. Most weed/feed that I've consistently suggest this. The directions on this package was no different.


I REALLY wish I'd have taken picture of my yard on Fri/Sat before scalping, then another pic on tues, and another pic today. Grass was 2-3% greening-up on Friday when I scalped it. It's probably 40% greened up today.

I was going to mow today (2nd mowing), but the rain/thunder-storms that came through the Metroplex will make me push it off until sometime this weekend.



Couple of thoughts on a few comments above:

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"Why do you water THEN put out fertilizer? Is it a slow release? I always do the opposite so my water can break down my fertilizer and “water it in."
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Don’t waste your $ on the weed/feed.

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I find it extremely easy to understand why you don't see the value in weed/feed. If you put weed/feed down, and immediately water, you're essentially feeding the weeds. I believe the vast majority of weeds are killed by absorption through their leaves. Watering immediately after putting granular weed/feed down, rinses the killer off the weeds.


With the above said: I absolutely agree that you should do pre-emergent separately from weed+feed. The weed/feed is usually very good for broad-leaf weeds, but terrible for grassy weeds. No reason not to kill a few random broad-leaf weeds while your putting down fertilizer.



Oh (and again in 100% agreement with Kceovaisnt)... mowing height is critical. The 3" Bermuda made me chuckle.

[This message has been edited by edwardsk2003 (edited 4/3/2014 8:01p).]

alright you guys talked me into scalping - never done that. my wife walked outside and said, "uh.....what are you doing to the lawn??" "don't worry, honey, TexAgs said it's okay!"

Sure, weed and feeds great for some folks, but the majority of guy that probably spend to much time on their lawns typically only spread them separately. They are intended for "quick fixes". Also probably the reason why lawn care companies don't use it. At least not in my neighborhood. I asked my neighbor who has 3-4 lawn crews and he was the one that changed my line of thinking about weed and feeds.

This is why I don't use weed and feed:
- The herbicide in the weed an feed goes to work quickly and then dissipates quickly. Not giving you much residual.
- The fertilizer in weed and feed goes to work relatively slowly, and then dissipates. Not always bad, but take longer to "green up" sometimes.

Don't get me wrong, they work fine and do a good job. I just prefer to break mine out.

I buy this bag of Lesco pre m for $20 and it last me all year. http://www.homedepot.com/p/LESCO-0-0-7-Pre-M-0-86-Crabgrass-Preventer-052388/100121942?keyword=Lesco+pre+m

Then with some fertilizers like this for $30-35 gets me through all mowing season. http://www.homedepot.com/p/Vigoro-Lawn-Fertilizer-15-000-sq-ft-52209A1/203081575

If I have any weeds pop up, I'll just pull them or spray some 2,4-d or msma on it.

I'll still put out my p and k in the fall and spring.

Bottle rocket.

Here what I did with my lawn leveling.
http://forums.texags.com/main/forum.reply.asp?forum_id=34&topic_id=2298611&page=1&nomobile=1

I did it again yesterday afternoon. Still have the backyard to finish today. This time I got only sand, not the Compost/sand mix. I like it much more!

[This message has been edited by AGGIE WH08P (edited 4/5/2014 10:13a).]

Where can you find 2-4-d in Dallas?

I found a bottle that fits on to the hose at my local nursery in rowlett. It has 2,4-d in it. With that and dimension I've realized that you look for it as an ingredient rather than a product name (I believe)

Weed b gone has 2,4-D in it. Several herbicides at lowes have it in there.

Or go find a farmer friend and bum some off of him.

Bump. Some good info in this thread.

Our yearly "purge"

bookmark

Bump for Labor Day application of pre-emergent in DFW.