The edging is up to define the patio and pathways. @ yards of granite are down and I'l be slinging another 3-4 yards around over the next week or so. I have some questions about next steps.

How important is packing? Will it settle out on its own with normal walking around or do I need to pack the granite in tight? Hand tamper or go ahead and rent a packing machine?

What else should I be worried about so I do not learn lessons the hard way?

Working with stone and gravel is back breaking work. With that in mind, you do not want to cut corners. If you want a professional quality result, than there is physically demanding hard prep work that should be done. First, you should dig at least four inches into the ground for the foundation work (more if you plan install a gravel foundation). Second, I would highly recommend installing some type of edging to define the pathway/patio. This is to separate the yard from the stone area. Grass may eventually take over the gravel (especially if you have bermuda). Third (optional), you may want install some type of weed barrier on top of the cleared area. Forth, place a couple inches of gravel in the defined stone area, if you plan to have a gravel foundation. Use a power compactor that you rented and compact the gravel (hand compactors are useless). Fifth, place a couple inches of decompose granite over the compacted gravel (if you installed a gravel foundation, if not install a minimal of 4 inches of decompose gravel). Use the power compactor to compact the decompose granite. The power compactor help "locks" the gravel/granite together creating a more dense and stable pathway/patio.

A nice jumping jack compactor will do a good job, though is a lot of work to run. I plan on putting down some brick for a smoker area, so my plan is dig down about 6", put down3-4" crushed limestone/caliche and compact it, then my sand and then brick, then border the brick with a cement curb below ground level, it is a lot of work, but will hold level and flat far far longer than just sand/brick.

A plate compactor is best, but you can hand tamp & it will be ok. A few items to warn you about d.g. patios:
1. The granite WILL stick to your shoes. If you have hardwood floors this will act like shrapnel & cut them up.
2. The granite WILL wash if directly under the eaves of the house. Depending on the surface area of roof drained, it could be a minor annoyance or a patio-destroying gully.

Keep some extra granite in buckets to touch up any wash outs. Don't worry about weed fabric, they grow in the dg anyway. Make sure your border is secured & won't allow any wash outs.

Good luck!

The weed fabric is an absolute waste of money.

The weed fabric is not a waste of money.

The weed fabric, which should be a filter fabric, is used to prevent the aggregate from digging down into the subsoil. With Houston's gumbo soil, this is a very important step to prevent constant maintenance. The purpose of the fabric is not to prevent weeds and help the granite (crushed rock) lock together without other forces (like expansive soils) from acting upon it.

Think about it like stepping on a rock in the mud only hoping to keep your shoes clean; the rock will sink without a doubt unless it is fairly large. With a filter fabric it is harder to get that rock to bury itself under the soil.

[This message has been edited by texasaggie2004 (edited 1/7/2010 8:27a).]

I really appreciate all the input fellas.
We opted not to do the fabric after much consideration. Our ground is pretty solid hardpan so not really a concern about compacting into the soil. I know grass and weeds will probably be a problem, but I imagine seed will get spread into it from the top anyway. We finished up most of the granite today with 5 yards. I'll likely need 1 more for the last bit of path and to raise up around the patio once we get the packer.

I plan to rent the motorized packer, probably next weekend. Since we bit the bullet on granite and a packer on the front side, I'm thinking we can go with the thinner ~1-1.5 in. thick limestone. The girl at the landscape place was talking about using yellow sand to level the stone. Does that sound right? Her argument seemed sound to just use a little sand on top of the compacted granite to lock the stone in. I just want to see what you think about that.

Also we plan to use granite in the joints, but I am leary about tracking that stuff around forever and it washing out in spots. Ideally I'd use cement in the joints for a smooth finished look, but with the clay soil and all the trees I believe the concrete would be a mess in a very short time.

Will the granite in the joints eventually pack/lock into place? Any tricks I could use to help keep that locked in tight? I was thinking of maybe using a heavy douse of grout seal or something to kind of glue it in and together. Anyone ever have success with something like that?

Thanks again for the input. I'll have to invite you to the party!

I would not recommend the grouting in unless you excavated a whole lot and came back with a heavy sand bed. I just finished a project like this a couple months ago....I used sand bedding (as you said to "lock" in the stones) and then after I had everything set, I filled in the joists and topped with the granite. It will lock into place and eventually harden up pretty good. I did keep a couple of trashcans of extra granite to fill in when areas wash out. I will just stress one thing.....After the stones have been set in the sand....let it sit for several days, water it in, and compact it, even weeks if you can. The sand will shift a little bit and some of the stones will need to be releveled before the granite goes down. I have many stones that were level when I set them....but only a month or two later were "buckling" and some even cracking. No problems though with tracking in the granite in the house. After a month or so all of the fines will wash out of the granite and you are left with pieces that, are for the most part, hard to pick up with foot traffic. Plus, if you put the stones close enough together your footfall will keep you on top of the stones and never coming in contact with the granite joints.

Sweet Fancy Moses.
The next time some poor ******* comes on here asking about doing a stone patio themselves tell them to RUN AWAY. Each Monday for the past several weeks I've felt like I've been beaten with axe handles.

BUT, it did turn out pretty nicely.



[This message has been edited by cstxag90 (edited 3/30/2010 2:10p).]

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In our defense you didn't ask us if it would be easy. Just for advice on how to do it.

ttt