Excerp:

There are no concerns about Tubbs’ behavior and character, on the other hand, but there are major questions about whether he’s tough and dogged enough to play anywhere near his talent. At least one team rated the 6-foot-4 and 321-pounder as the top defensive tackle talent in this draft because of his potential — he’s bigger than Harris and Wilfork.

But others thought his performance at Texas’ pro day reinforced the possibility that he could be a big bust if drafted in the first round. That day, Tubbs refused scouts’ requests to run a third 40-yard dash and ended his workout because of a minor injury.

“You have to be careful on those (University of) Texas kids,” one scout said. “They don’t reach their potential because they don’t coach them hard there and they don’t push them hard there.”


http://www.packersnews.com/archives/news/pack_15716314.shtml

How can anyone with the name "Tubbs" be expected to be hard working?

quote:

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“You have to be careful on those (University of) Texas kids,” one scout said. “They don’t reach their potential because they don’t coach them hard there and they don’t push them hard there.”

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Damn, that's harsh!

I like it...




[This message has been edited by Eddie Haskell (edited 4/19/2004 2:57p).]

On the downside, they can pretty much beat us on talent alone.

It would sure be nice to be OU, who can match up against them talent-wise and isn't soft.

Which of the first round draft choices under Mack Brown have been busts? Tubbs was a 235 lb. TE coming out of DeSoto High School...rated #59 in the State by Ketchum whom, according to ags, inflates the rankings of Horn recruits. The kid is an overachiever...not an underachiever. He'll play the pros longer than a number of more highly ranked kids from that class that signed with tamu.

[This message has been edited by rightguard (edited 4/19/2004 3:43p).]

It always comes back to recruiting rankings, doesn't it.

Alonzo Highsmith hates Texas, it was him who said it.

Being a top-5 draft pick bust, he should be the one to talk about underachieving. I also believe his wonderlic score was in the low-teen's

Point is, the country-wide perception is that mac and tu are consistent under-achievers, year in and year out. They get the best talent in Texas, and have never won a divisional title, get beat by underdogs like Arkansas and Wash. State routinely, and are Stoops whipping boys.
So, is the perception inaccurate? Is mac really a good coach who just has had a string of bad luck not to win a div. title ( a 19 yr. string )?

schmedpro,

If you mean conference title, you are correct, but tu has won two South division titles under Mack Brown.

rightguard -- no one is saying that the first rounders are busts, they are saying that you must be wary of sips because they come out of college not ready to be pros. See, as an example, two kids ranked #1 in the country on offense and defense out of high school, who after 4 years in the rugged Mack Brown system, were lucky to get drafted in the third round.

Their weakness is our strength. Our coaching is clearly not just good or very good, but great. We won't be having any players under achieving.

You must not follow recruiting very closely if you are holding the #1 player = 3rd round choice against Brown.

Look at the last 20 #1 high school QB's, Simms' draft position and college success would be in the top 3 or 4.

This criticism is about player development and concerns Marcus Tubbs, who was a 235 pound 3-star tight end prospect out of high school who will ost likely be drafted in the first round (second at latest).

Mack Brown also was second to RC Slocum at one time for # of players in the NFL (UNC). Player development for the NFL as a criticism of Brown is a joke - he has just got too many skins on the wall.

If you want to talk about recruiting rankings not corresponding into conf championships or BCS appearances, that is a legitimate and accurate criticism. Player development is not.

Like I said earlier, this criticism is from a "scout" who hates Texas, scored in the low teens on the Wonderlic, and was one of the biggest busts in NFL history (alonzo highsmith who was drafted in the top-5).

He should know about being a bust in the NFL or making a team wary of one's draft pick from his personal experience.

dont know if this has been posted yet, but from the March 27th Comical

http://www.chron.com/cs/CDA/ssistory.mpl/sports/mcclain/2471079

quote:

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Attitude adjustment
-- Unfortunately for the Longhorns, other prospects who worked out for the scouts last week weren't nearly as impressive as Roy Williams. Receiver B.J. Johnson ran in the 4.7s. Cornerback Nathan Vasher ran in the 4.6s. Defensive tackle Marcus Tubbs pulled up with cramps. Their stock plummeted.

Three NFL personnel people who attended the Longhorns' pro day said they were stunned at the attitude some of the prospects showed.

"They spent too much time complaining," one NFL personnel expert said. "One wouldn't broad jump for us. One wouldn't do the vertical (jump). Except for Roy Williams, they acted like they were doing us a favor. Williams was a pleasure to be around.

"No wonder Texas loses to Oklahoma. When we went to Oklahoma, those kids were fired up to see us. They were ready to work out. They did every drill we asked them to do and asked if we wanted more. That's the kind of attitude you expect to see when a kid's future as an NFL player's at stake. You expect them to be excited and cooperative. You'd think those other Texas players would have followed Roy Williams' lead."

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htown...were the first round draft choices not coached by the Texas staff this thread attempts to criticize? Which highly recruited UT players that have been drafted out of the Brown program have been busts? The answer is that there haven't been any. The unnamed scout is mouthing an opinion not backed up by fact...it is not a shock that this group any for a way to feel superior to the Horns...would jump on anything to support their bruised egos. Try again.

As to #1 players in the country "lucky" to be drafted in the 3rd round...neither were lucky to be drafted and they will both have a long career playing football for a living...barring injury. Why don't you do a study and determine how many #1 national recruits went in the first round of their drafts? It would be interesting...but of course you won't do it because you're scared it won't show what you want it to show.

BJ Johnson = college bust... what happened to that guy.

BTW, rightguard, you might want to go argue your points on your own board. It seems they are much more negative than most ppl here.

[This message has been edited by CJS4715 (edited 4/19/2004 6:48p).]

rightguard -- you are right, the opinion expressed above is completely coming out of left field from a person with obvious bias. It's not as if anyone else has ever said such things before. For example, absolutely no one had anything to say last year about a certain 6'5" QB with a cannon arm and NFL pedigree's development last year.

Ouch! That statement is rough....but funny.

Whereas none of this stuff is exactly news and holds some truth, I'd be weary of anything Alonzo Highsmith says.

Man I only wish out team could underachieve like t.u. It must suck beating your rival 4 years in a row and finishing in the top 10 for 3 or 4 years in a row. We need to get our own house in order before we start calling out the sips since they have kicked our butts with ease over the last 4 years.

quote:

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We won't be having any players under achieving.

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Exactly.

Alonzo Highsmith has been an agent and has many financial ties to the 'caines program and to the agents who represent 'caines players. Guess who is ranked in a competing spot with Tubbs? Vince Wilfork of Miami. Would Highsmith be talking like that in an attempt to damage Tubbs draft position in return for Jack from Wilfork's agent? I wouldn't put it past him.

As to underachieving, Vince Wilfork was a bona fide stud comining out of high school and was on many of the High School all-american teams...was second team DL on the 1999 USA Today All-USA team (following)

1999 USA Today All-USA first team DL:

E - DARRELL LEE, Kirkwood (Mo.), 6-5, 225. Despite being double- and triple-teamed, he had 57 solo tackles (26 for losses) and 27 assists. He recovered four fumbles and caused one. “He’s the best I’ve ever coached,” says Mike Wade. “He has great explosion off the ball and wonderful backside pursuit.” College choice: Florida.

E - GREG PAULY, South (Waukesha, Wis.), 6-6, 270. Had 40 solo and 65 assisted tackles, along with 17 sacks and 20 other tackles for losses. Caused and recovered two fumbles and made two interceptions. Set school records for sacks in one year (17) and career (31), career solo tackles (142) and assists (226). College choice: Notre Dame.

L - ANTHONY BRYANT, Sunshine (Newbern, Ala.), 6-4, 324. Had 92 solo and 74 assisted tackles in 11 games. Caused eight fumbles and recovered four. Made two interceptions. Has good quickness and bench-presses 430 pounds. College choice: Alabama.

L - TRAVIS JOHNSON, Notre Dame (Sherman Oaks, Calif.), 6-4, 260. Had 48 solo tackles, including 30 for losses, and 35 assists. Forced six fumbles, blocked four kicks and returned an interception for a 71-yard touchdown. Set school career records for sacks (40), tackles for losses (77), forced fumbles (14) and blocked punts (5). College choice: Florida State.

L - MAC TYLER, Jess Lanier (Bessemer, Ala.), 6-6, 325. Had 29 solo tackles, including 11 for losses, and 16 assists. Runs 40 yards in 4.9 seconds and bench-presses 450 pounds. “He forces everybody into new offenses,” says coach Carrol Cox. “We saw a lot of shotguns.” College choice: Alabama. [see the type of talent Franchione had at 'bama when he arrived]

1999 Second team:

E Teyo Johnson Mira Mesa (Calif.) 6-7 245
E Antwan Odom Alma Bryant (Ala.) 6-7 255
L Lynn McGruder Cheyenne (Nev.) 6-3 285
L Marcus White Theodore (Ala.) 6-5 270
L Vince Wilfork Santaluces (Fla.) 6-3 300

http://www.usatoday.com/sports/preps/football/99allusa.htm

1999 DCTF Super Team DL (1st team):

DL - Marcel Moses, 6-4, 285, Texas City
DL - Alton Wright, 6-5, 235, Houston Jones
DL - Eddie Brown, 6-3, 290, Aldine Eisenhower
DL - Jesse Sias, 6-3, 310, Dallas Kimball

1999 DCTF Super Team DL (2nd team):

DL - Jodie Solomon, 6-3, 230, Aldine
DL - Brian Dunn, 6-2, 240, Mesquite Poteet
DL - Colby Clark, 6-3, 245, Austin Westlake
DL - Richard Murphy, 6-3, 280, DeSoto

1999 DCTF Super Team DL (3rd team):

DL - Ernest Duncan, 6-3, 240, Alief Elsik
DL - Sonny Davis, 6-2, 290, Austin Lanier
DL - Chris Henry, 6-5, 215, Houston Jones
DL - Adarius Palmer, 6-2, 210, Sulphur Springs

http://www.walksports.com/dctf1999.htm

Note: Marcus Tubbs wasn't named to any of the three DCTF Super Teams at TE or DL...but one of his own teammates from DeSoto was named to the 2nd team DL.

Tubbs will go in the first day of the draft...he's an overachiever, not an underachiever.

My new signature!

______________________________________________________
“You have to be careful on those (University of) Texas kids,” one scout said. “They don’t reach their potential because they don’t coach them hard there and they don’t push them hard there.”

None of you sharp-eyed ags noticed that I posted the wrong DCTF Super Team. Marcus Tubbs was part of the 1999 recruiting class, but his senior football season was 1998 and would've been listed on that team.

1998 DCTF Super Team:

QB - Colby Freeman, 6-3, 205, Brownwood
RB - Shaud Williams, 5-8, 180, Andrews
RB - Reggie Duncan, 5-8, 215, Killeen Ellison
WR - Artie Ellis, 6-3, 190, Spring Westfield
WR - Sparky Hamilton, 6-4, 200, Lufkin
TE - Fred Spiller, 6-4, 250, Aldine Nimitz
OL - Alfio Randle, 6-6, 265, Houston Yates
OL - Tre Mathis, 6-3, 333, Garland
OL - Derrick Dockery, 6-6, 311, Garland Lakeview Centennial
OL - Kelvin Banks, 6-3, 290, Aldine
C - Dan Zoch, 6-3, 260, Austin Westlake
UB - Carl Crawford, 6-1, 190, Houston Davis

First Team Defense
DL - Ty Warren, 6-5, 275, Bryan
DL - Shannon Mitchell, 6-4, 255, Navasota
DL - Cedric Hilliard, 6-3, 290, Arlington Lamar
DL - Paul Broussard, 6-3, 298, La Porte
LB - Damien West, 6-1, 230, Fort Bend Dulles
LB - Jason Frederick, 6-0, 205, Cypress Falls
LB - Cory Redding, 6-5, 235, Galena Park North Shore
DB - Sam Davis, 6-0, 180, Humble
DB - Monti Collier, 5-11, 185, Dallas Carter
DB - Sterling Kazee, 6-2, 175, Irving MacArthur
DB - Gerome Sapp, 6-1, 200, Houston Lamar
UB - Ivan Williams, 6-2, 225, Cleveland

Second Team Offense
QB - Adam Hall, 6-3, 195, Austin Westlake
RB - Kenny Hayter, 6-0, 205, Cypress Falls
RB - Fred Talley, 5-10, 175, Longview
WR - Jarvis Smith, 5-10, 175, Aldine Nimitz
WR - Tarron Brooks, 6-1, 190, Austin McCallum
TE - Pete Putnam, 6-3, 230, Corsicana
OL - Danny Murphy, 6-5, 270, Flower Mound Marcus
OL - Robbie Doane, 6-7, 270, Coppell
OL - Cedric Fields, 6-3, 270, Corsicana
OL - Rex Richards, 6-6, 281, Midland Lee
C - Greg Barnum, 6-3, 270, Killeen Ellison
UB - Eric Giddens, 6-2, 180, Tyler John Tyler

Second Team Defense
DL - Kevin Young, 6-3, 240, Duncanville
DL - Bo Schobel, 6-4, 235, Columbus
DL - Lamont Anderson, 6-3, 255, Irving Nimitz
DL - Chad Pugh, 6-5, 265, Saginaw Boswell
LB - Devon Davis, 6-2, 225, Austin McCallum
LB - Teshambi Irving, 6-4, 220, Dallas Lincoln
LB - Derrick Cash, 6-1, 205, El Campo
DB - Terrence Kiel, 6-0, 190, Lufkin
DB - Kendrick Turner, 6-0, 175, Dallas Kimball
DB - Marvin Jackson, 5-10, 160, Galveston Ball
DB - Brandon Ward, 6-5, 195, Dallas Kimball
UB - Tory Mitchell, 6-1, 168, Big Spring

Third Team Offense
QB - Eli Roberson III, 6-1, 190, Baytown Lee
RB - Tim Parker, 6-0, 218, La Marque
RB - Ryan Beard, 5-9, 200, Cy-Fair
WR - Cody Cardwell, 5-9, 175, Stephenville
WR - Jerel Myers, 6-1, 178, Houston Madison
TE - Chad Stevens, 6-4, 240, Cy-Fair
OL - Alex McDonald, 6-5, 320, Dallas Bishop Dunne
OL - Alan Reuber, 6-7, 260, Plano
OL - Derek Long, 6-6, 310, Celina
OL - Matt Lazerine, 6-5, 305, Tyler Lee
OL - Gene Harlin, 6-4, 260, Saginaw Boswell
UB - Rufus Brown, 5-9, 185, Fort Bend Austin

Third Team Defense
DL - Floyd Dorsey, 6-3, 215, Tyler John Tyler
DL - Donald Burrell, 6-2, 220, Fort Worth Wyatt
DL - Steve Mascorro, 6-7, 290, El Paso Del Valle
DL - Richard Evans, 6-4, 250, Duncanville
LB - Randall Hendley, 6-2, 225, Dallas Carter
LB - Jared Morris, 6-4, 220, Brownwood
LB - LaMarcus McDonald, 6-1, 210, Waco
DB - Kobina Amoo, 5-10, 170, Alief Hastings
DB - Caleb Miller, 6-4, 208, Sulphur Springs
DB - Roderick Babers, 5-10, 175, Houston Lamar
DB - Carlos Banks, 5-10, 175, Arlington Lamar
UB - Derrick Strait, 5-10, 165, Austin Lanier
(Source: Dave Campbell's Texas Football, 1998 Edition, Pages 158-159, 162.)

Oh, Marcus wasn't named on this team either.

Rightguard & Mr. Randy Watson,

The original statement said nothing about how they progressed from high school to college. The concern of the scout was how they didn't seem to care to work out for the scouts. What does that have to do with all the stats you are throwing out there?

quote:

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None of you sharp-eyed ags noticed that I posted

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Catch the hint

Ag1-

The quote criticized the players for not reaching their potential - such a statement about Marcus Tubbs, who was a 235 pound TE prospect who did not even play football until his junior year of high school, is a joke.

I would say that Marcus Tubbs, an unheralded recrtuit who will most likely be drafted in the 1st round, reached his potential.

He is anything but lazy, he worked his tail off (with some help from former Aggie player Steve McKinney) to lose weight and get his 40 time in the 4.9 range (good for a 321 pound defensive tackle).

Marcus Tubbs statistics at Texas speak for themselves - he had 77 tackles this year, 12 TFL's, and 5.5 sacks. He garnered all Big XII recognition as a junior and senior. The dude produced in college and was a 3 starter on a team that lost very few games. What exactly has he done that has not reached his potential?

He is supposed to be lazy because he only wanted to run 1 40 sprint? I would guess that since he ran such a great time, he did not want to take a chance to run again (when he likely could have done nothing but run a slower time).

This was just a case of a guy running his mouth and making a fool out of himself. Why not focus on guys who have been busts (drafted much higher than they should have)? Because we haven't had many of those.

sips will lose (5) this year....one to us...
Aggies will win (9) bowl game included...

mark it down.

98-
Why do you pollute every post with this 5 loss nonsense? I think if you had the sack to call it a wager, you'd have a line around the door.

Shoot!

GREATNESS!!!

I nearly fell out of my chair!

quote:

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he had 77 tackles this year, 12 TFL's, and 5.5 sacks

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But for how much of that does he have us to thank?

Baylor probably deserves a lot of credit too, I don't want to forget about them.