24V Cummins trouble shooting help

1,449 Views | 19 Replies | Last: 8 mo ago by EskimoJoe
MTTANK
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Looking at a 2001 ram with 250k miles on it. Starts up and sounds great, no blow by. Was told when driving it that it loses power and makes noise like it's not getting enough fuel, and it blows white smoke. Truck was pinned so unable to drive it. When in neutral I brought the RPM's up a few times and could not replicate, it ran strong and no smoke or loss of power. I wrench quite a bit, but diesels are unfamiliar ground to me. Have a chance to buy it pretty cheap, but know diesels are expensive to work on. Any idea what I'm looking at? Pictures of codes it throwing below

GIG 'EM
buddybee
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Just sold a 1998 24 valve that I had for 485,000 miles. Looks to me you are either looking at an injector pump or a PCM. How many miles on the injector pump? Have you done a fuel pressure test? PCM that old can be rebuilt but find the right company that does it. If you can find someone who has a similar truck, see if you can borrow his PCM to and see if anything changes.
buddybee
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On 2nd generation (1998.5-2002) Dodge Cummins trucks, "death codes" often refer to specific fault codes related to the VP44 fuel injection pump, such as P0216, P0251, P0253, P0370, P1688, and P1691, which can lead to catastrophic engine failur
Centerpole90
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Given the clues you have listed here - I am with buddybee that the engine is probably going to require the VP44 injector pump. The common factors for the bad injector pump are: loss of power, smoke (black or white - not blue oil smoke), and of course the codes above. I hoped that a lift pump might fix it - but given it is already getting the smoke and P0216... I think it's past just needing a lift pump. If the truck is bone stock I would suggest replacing the lift pump as part of the fix since that is what likely caused the injector pump to fail in first place. Great opportunity to throw on the Fass or AirDog and join the club. lol. I am not surprised you can't replicate the loss of power or smoke when the truck in parked - it needs some load to give those clues.

https://www.cumminsforum.com/forums/

That was shared with me when I started the Cummins project and it is an amazing resource. It's the ih8mud of the Cummins world. There isn't a problem that hasn't been discussed there.

I don't know what the rest of the truck looks like or what configuration the truck is (4x4, long, short, rusty, cherry..) or what your goals are for it. I do know the dollar amount you shared via text. Consider this; the CORE CHARGE for that block is $1600. I'm only using that as a point of reference because, yes, the diesel game is expensive - but a clean running second gen has value.

What's the dash look like?
1agswitchin4lanes
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Check fuel pressure?

87IE
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0217 - could be the coolant temp sensor.

1693 should be a companion code. don't worry about it.

0216 is "normally" the VP-44 taking a dump but like 1Ags stated, check the fuel pressure.

When mine crapped out I had the 1688 code, which was the death code.

Quote:

I wrench quite a bit, but diesels are unfamiliar ground to me


The rebuilt pumps run from 1200 - 2k depending on where you get them. Like Centerpole stated, replace the lift pump or put a FASS on it if you replace it. I used to get the lift pumps from the local freightliner dealer for 1/3 of what the dealership wanted.

I replaced VP-44 in my driveway with a buddy. It took us probably 7 hrs (not including getting the gasket for the air horn I tore). The second time we probably could have done it in 4 the second time because we wouldn't have had to go back an look at the instructions.

Check the front end for play.

MTTANK
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Centerpole90 said:

What's the dash look like?


Dash? What dash?
GIG 'EM
MTTANK
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Instead of worrying about how much it's going to cost to fix, I figured the Aggie thing to do would be to just go ahead and buy it.


GIG 'EM
MTTANK
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Got an airdog lift pump thrown on this thing, and it did not fix my problem. Next step was VP44. PIcked one up off marketplace for $500 from a guy going to P pump setup. Got it on the truck last night, and it runs good now.

GIG 'EM
MTTANK
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Test drove the truck some today, and it is running a little hot when cruising. When I come to a stop, it cools back to normal pretty fast. I have a water pump and thermostat, but am waiting on a fan clutch to come in. It's throwing some codes still:

GIG 'EM
milkman00
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How much did you have to pay for it? Have a similar looking '00 myself.
MTTANK
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milkman00 said:

How much did you have to pay for it? Have a similar looking '00 myself.
I paid $3200
GIG 'EM
milkman00
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So what is the likely culprit of a pretty good oil leak? 2000 with about 210k on it.

Any places you trust around Richardson? Dollar bill size leak in 5 minutes of idling .

I'm 200 miles from it but I hear it has 25 years of built up oil on engine.....typical Cummins.

Didn't burn much or any oil but now is leaking it as it went back to daily driver use for family member.

Thoughts? What else to fix/replace when getting seal repaired?
MTTANK
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milkman00 said:

So what is the likely culprit of a pretty good oil leak? 2000 with about 210k on it.

Any places you trust around Richardson? Dollar bill size leak in 5 minutes of idling .

I'm 200 miles from it but I hear it has 25 years of built up oil on engine.....typical Cummins.

Didn't burn much or any oil but now is leaking it as it went back to daily driver use for family member.

Thoughts? What else to fix/replace when getting seal repaired?
DIsclaimer- I am not super familiar with these trucks, this is my first time around one. With a leak that is that bad, It's likely going to be very easy to identify. I typically give one a good power washing and cleaning and then find the source of the leak. As far as other things to replace, it's a cummins so I doubt it needs anything. I would be sure and add an upgraded lift pump/filter setup. The VP44 pumps are just too expensive to have to replace.
GIG 'EM
EskimoJoe
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Cummins motors like to leak around the lower corner of the front cover, front main seal, oil pan gasket, and rear main seal.

The front cover leak and front main seal are hard to tell apart. We usually do both at the same time.
milkman00
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milkman00
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Made arrangements for it to get back towards home to a shop we trust in farm country. Thanks for the thoughts guys.
Centerpole90
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https://www.cumminsforum.com/threads/p1690-missing-and-white-smoke.463364/

Some detailed info in that thread about the P1690 code. That's one I haven't seen, but mine is common rail so it's a totally different animal.

Question (kinda). I googled the VP44 to see if it was timed to the cam and my understanding is that it is internally timed, not externally timed. So you jam it in there and tighten the gear up anywhere that suits your fancy, just like the CP3 on my CR injected Cummins; because the injection timing relative to the crank is not mechanical - it's electronic. So is there a timing procedure you have to do in the computer when you change the pump? To fine tune the timing? Did the PO mention overheating at all? (getting WAAYYY out in the weeds here...) I know its not likely, but might slightly advanced timing cause your overheating under load? (on my truck timing is done at the injector, so I'm not familiar with the controller on the VP44)

That said, I am in constant cam shaft position sensor hell myself and my problem is probably 99.99% wiring harness related. It's a known issue on my year model that the engine harness will miss the 5v input to the sensor and eventually throw a code. However, since it happens randomly and honestly, rarely, I just wipe the code to make the light go out and figure I'll work on it someday. Ask EskimoJoe... he's had to suffer me grumbling about it.
Centerpole90
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Guess who correctly spotted a groove in the front of his crank and installed a repair sleeve to stop that leak - but might have underestimated the fine line on the rear seal journal???? and might should have put a repair sleeve on there too....
EskimoJoe
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Oof! Pulling the transfer case and transmission is fun right?
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