Doing a little research. Does removing small cedar trees do anything for the land? I've heard it helps creeks, springs and ponds? Is there any truth to that? Any other benefits of removing them whether first hand experience or articles?

Remove as many as you can, save a few for patches of wildlife cover if that is a concern.

They guzzle groundwater and keep precipitation from making contact with the ground.

And, they seem to grow in clusters at the base of live oaks. Those were always the first to go.

Get rid as much as you can and your water table will go up, native grasses with grow, and native trees will thrive.

One 15FT cedar uses 35 gallons of water a day. So as you can see what damage they do.

Cleared about 700 acres of Ash Juniper on our ranch in the hill country. This was not virgin cedar. It was regrowth from 20-25 years before we bought the place. We had little true virgin cedar…and we opted to leave most of it.
After completing the project we had a creek on the ranch that started running and holding water again. We had two other springs we never knew existed start running.
The native grasses and legumes came back unbelievable in two years.
Small cedars will grow and suck water out of your ground. They will have berries that will spread and create even more. You can sculpt your place to leave some for wildlife corridors or cover…. But native brush and small oaks will grow fairly quickly for cover with the cedar gone.
As was already said get them gone from around your desirable trees.

Wow that's amazing. Was the clearing in mostly flat areas or did you get rid of cedar on any hills too?

Hell it was all over so we did hill sides and flats. I laid out a couple of travel corridors from an aerial map and we had some extremely rough rocky cliff areas that we left because we just could not feasibly get to it.
I had got on the EQUIP program with NRCS. It was not a lot of $$ assistance but a little.
I had to argue with them on the cedar I wanted to leave. They wanted it ALL gone.

We did 80% cutting with a tree shear and stacked with grapples. Small trees we pulled up with a tree puller. Some chain sawing.
When we would burn the big piles our ranch looked like Kuwait in desert storm.

How long until your creek and springs started flowing after you cleared it all?

The creek was within a two week period. That creek would run if we had a 4-5 rain but then would stop. There was a fairly large pool but it would dry up in a week or so. Previous land owner said it had always been that way since he owned it ( the last 16 years). But he said the old timer he bought it from told him the pool stayed there year around for many years.
I cleared the entire watershed of that creek that was on my property and so did my neighbor upstream from me.
Right after we did that we had a good rain and from then on the pool stayed except for the bad drought in 2011.
The springs took longer to show up. They were just seeps but had never been there before.

Love to hear stories like this. I feel like I'm seeing more and more fully clear pieces of property in the hill country. Much more than say 5-7 years ago.

Gunny456 said:

---

The creek was within a two week period. That creek would run if we had a 4-5 rain but then would stop. There was a fairly large pool but it would dry up in a week or so. Previous land owner said it had always been that way since he owned it ( the last 16 years). But he said the old timer he bought it from told him the pool stayed there year around for many years.
I cleared the entire watershed of that creek that was on my property and so did my neighbor upstream from me.
Right after we did that we had a good rain and from then on the pool stayed except for the bad drought in 2011.
The springs took longer to show up. They were just seeps but had never been there before.

---

Incredible. I have a pond that was full to the brim with 6-8lb largemouth bass when we bought the property in the mid nineties, but hasn't had any water in 20 years. The creek on our property just like you said will have water for about a week after a 4-5" rain but gone quickly after that. There are all kinds of cedar growth in the creek. Will be a huge undertaking but I am going to work on clearing it all in 2024. Will report back...gotta get to work!

Hope it turns out good

Same situation with my parents house between Killeen and Georgetown. Growing up the creek and pond almost always had water but have not in several years. Started killing some cedars with brush bullets, seen on this forum. Put some out late September and it worked. Will be putting more pellets out in the spring. Gonna work it from both sides chemical and mechanical. The cedars have just taken over. Was wanting to rent a skid steer with a mulching attachment for a few days.

Your insight on this thread is helpful and appreciated. I'm curious if you would mind sharing any idea of cost involved? Also, any recs on who you used to do the work?

What's the cost on contracting cedar mulchers? I've got 5k acres to clear 2011 cedar at minimum in western Hill Country

Be careful. In some places ('Travis County) it's a capital offense to cut down a cedar tree.

Jumping in on this thread to add or ask. I am seeing a lot of older and young cedars dying in Brazos and washington counties. Fine with me as I do not have to chemically or mechanically kill. Think it is the drought or something else?

Likely Eastern Red Cedar.

cahoots said:

---

What's the cost on contracting cedar mulchers? I've got 5k acres to clear 2011 cedar at minimum in western Hill Country

---

How far west? You can run into red berry juniper in the western hill country, and mulching it will be a disaster.

drred4 said:

---

Jumping in on this thread to add or ask. I am seeing a lot of older and young cedars dying in Brazos and washington counties. Fine with me as I do not have to chemically or mechanically kill. Think it is the drought or something else?

---

I'm seeing the same thing in McLennan County. I'm surprised, because they've always seemed pretty hardy and difficult to control, but I'll shed no tears.

I've also wondered if it's due to drought or perhaps instead some insect or fungus. Not all of them are showing it, but enough are that I know its not an isolated thing.

Yes same here. Good riddance. Have to move my tree stand to an oak, but that's fine with me

Other than the Toolbox story, this is by far the best one!

I'm seeing the same thing in Lavaca county. I'm always attacking cedars but it's a real uphill battle. Then the youpon takes over lol

Gunny, what's your opinion on mulching vs shears and stacking vs grubbing?

Where are you located in central Texas? I'm in Gatesville and could help you devise a plan or even help do some of that clearing if you needed. I've done a good bit of clearing for folks on this board. I've been running a tree shear on a skid loader for over 20 years. I don't do it full time but it's something I'm pretty good at it. I'd be happy to even just put together a quick map for you with my recommendation. You can find my contact info in my profile or at CrossTimbersW.com

We made a pretty good stab at some ash junipers down here on the Guadalupe a couple years back......


It actually finishes out really well and makes for some fine looking furniture. This book cabinet is cypress with ash juniper as the door inserts.

Mulching leaves a heck of a mess and those deep layers of cedar mulch make it hard for native grasses to make it up through.

Eventually it will break down. But may take years.

It's been about 14 years ago since we finished the project. At that time the tree shear and skid steer was running me about 50/hr.
My neighbor owned a business called Texas Tree Shear…he has since retired . I had dirt working equipment and traded him work for work on some of it before I got on the NRCS program.

Our area was rocky in places so the tree shear was much cleaner and easier. On small little trees (3" and less diameter) we pulled them with a puller.
The grapple was just to grab and stack the cut trees. Never used a root grapple due to the rocky terrain.
Before we started I had a bull dozer guy come and push some……totally brought rocks up and made shell crater holes everywhere that he had to back drag and fill… way to costly and tore the ground up very badly.

Same on our place in Wash Co and Brazos. Hearing more than few folks saying they were just dying.

Do you know Jose Cano? My dad used to work with him on the property many years ago. We are in southern Bosque County

barnag said:

---

Do you know Jose Cano? My dad used to work with him on the property many years ago. We are in southern Bosque County

---

You could say that I know him. Myself and a buddy took over his business in 2021 once he retired (again). Amazing guy that I'm proud to call a friend.

Gunny456 said:

---

Our area was rocky in places so the tree shear was much cleaner and easier. On small little trees (3" and less diameter) we pulled them with a puller.
The grapple was just to grab and stack the cut trees. Never used a root grapple due to the rocky terrain.
Before we started I had a bull dozer guy come and push some……totally brought rocks up and made shell crater holes everywhere that he had to back drag and fill… way to costly and tore the ground up very badly.

---

The prior owner of the place next door decided he was going to clear most of the cedar off his lot and came in with big tractor and front end loader and proceeded to push them all over. I tried to talk him out of it for the very same reason you mentioned. He went ahead and did it and wound up rock all over the place.

Does anyone chain them anymore? My dad bought 900 acres in Coryell County 60 years ago and had a lot of it chained. Made for some fun rainy weather bonfires when I was a kid.

The 2011 drought and then a freeze killed some, but not enough, of the ash junipers in the hill country. You can still see the dead trees across the countryside today.

Could be what has happened to other species of cedar/junpier in other places more recently.