Received 30 doe tags, 9 buck tags and 6 "unbranched" buck tags this year. Problem is we need to shoot about 30 cull bucks and 15 does. Landowner said he didn't care if we shot more bucks and used our hunting licenses for them.

My question: Is that illegal as in game warden can take your guns, write tickets, etc. or is it against the MLD program and they could take away the MLD3 designation if they found out?

2nd question: In 10 years, this is the first we've seen "unbranched" tags. Is this new or just new to us? Thanks.

You are not allowed to use tags from your license on MLD properties. As for the penalty I don't know, but I also wouldn't want to find out.

And I'm assuming the GW would at the very least write tickets for improperly tagged animals. Same as using a mulie tag on a WT or antlerless tag on a buck, etc.

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Received 30 doe tags, 9 buck tags and 6 "unbranched" buck tags this year. Problem is we need to shoot about 30 cull bucks and 15 does.

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Just curious, but how did you guys figure this?

Yes, they can pull your mld status. Has your landowner discussed it with the biologist? Those numbers should be based on the survey info you sent in.

That off my pencil whipped survey data alarm goes off.

30 cull bucks? Is this a huge property or has your cull buck harvest been drastically lacking over the past few years?

ursusguy said:

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Yes, they can pull your mld status. Has your landowner discussed it with the biologist? Those numbers should be based on the survey info you sent in.

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He has but said he couldn't do anything this year but next year will be game on. This is the first year also that there was no survey, which I think is the main issue. Pulling a number out of thin air that's based off previous years appears to not be very accurate this time.

Lt. Joe Bookman said:

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Received 30 doe tags, 9 buck tags and 6 "unbranched" buck tags this year. Problem is we need to shoot about 30 cull bucks and 15 does.

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Just curious, but how did you guys figure this?

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I looked at thousands of pictures from 5 different cameras and noticed there are a lot of cull bucks that need to be shot and not many does that are 2.5 and older.

Brush Country said:

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30 cull bucks? Is this a huge property or has your cull buck harvest been drastically lacking over the past few years?

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2,000 acres. We've historically been getting 60-65 tags per year, but this year for some random reason they gave us 45. I happen to agree with this number, but I think they got the sexes backwards. Next year I bet we'll get the reverse which is what we need. The "unbranched" thing sucks though because there are a lot of cull bucks that we could take out with those.

Do a mid season count with a certified biologist. You can get more MLDP tags with good data.

It sounds to me like you are enrolled in the harvest option, which is new this year. Going that route, they issue unbranched antler tags separate from the buck tags. Deer surveys are not required, as I believe they take county-wide surveys and use those numbers.

This year, the conservation option is similar to the old MLD option where you complete surveys and turn in your counts. This likely would have given you similar amounts of tags as previous years. This year on my place I received 3 times as many tags going the conservation option as I would have going the harvest option.

You are correct. I asked someone else on our lease and they said that's what happened. I hadn't heard of that option before. I need to do some research on the differences. Thanks for the helpful info.

Ahhhh, I just went with your initial comment of MLD 3, and assumed y'all rolled in at Conservation.

Can a mid season count (after whacking a bunch) still change things? I've been on Level 3 places for years.

ursusguy said:

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Ahhhh, I just went with your initial comment of MLD 3, and assumed y'all rolled in at Conservation.

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No sir. Apparently not. Didn't know there was a second option. My guess is landowner didn't either and checked a box without reading.

We are very good friends with our local GW who is an AG grad. and has helped us many times with investigations of poaching on our ranch. He told me about a landowner last year who had been on the MLD L3 for the last 5 years, and was allowing hunters to tag WT with their own tags in addition to his allotted MLD tags. He was caught by a GW who was checking a local processing facility and found two deer from the same ranch, one tagged with a hunters tag and another with an MLD tag.
He said the issue with the landowner was all of his ranch was under the one program and it is unlawful to tag a deer with a normal tag if the ranch was issued MLD permits. In this case the landowner lost his MLD privileges and and the hunter was fined for illegal tagging of a WT. In addition he said that there was a possibility that the landowner could also loose his wildlife tax exemption as well in the county.
He went on to say that TPWD originally created the MLD programs so that landowners, along with help and assistance from their local TPWD biologist, could manage their WT herds to improve the quality of the herd, obtain the correct buck/doe ratio, and to obtain proper range management and population densities.
The above was to be accomplished by allowing the MLD landowner to have longer hunting seasons, additional permits, etc. to accomplish his management goals. However, he went on to say that it has become evident to TPWD that there is now evidence of abuse of some landowners on the programs by falsifying census data and harvest records just to be able and have extended hunting seasons. The new "on line system" is supposed to help free up the time of the TPWD biologist so they can become more interactive with the landowners to start verifying the harvest and census data etc. to curb the abuse of the programs.
The wildlife management or "MLD" program is a tremendous management tool for the landowner wanting to put out the effort, time and money to improve his deer herd. I hope the actions of abuse by a few won't mess it up for everybody in the future.

That's all I needed to hear! Won't be using my personal tags this year. Sounds like we need to work on our relationship with the biologists. Thanks for the information everyone.

Very well put.