Looking for some advice from all of you gun types (that really know what you're doing).

I've got a JC Higgins Model 50 chambered in .270 WIN. It's built on a FN Mauser action and was sold by Sears and Roebuck back in the day. Anyway, have some moderate sentimental value to it, but bottom line is once I get a gun I won't usually sell it.

The problem I've had is that it seems to be simply very inaccurate. Everything on line says this gun should be a good shooter. So chain of events was,
1) I got the gun and took it to the range, didn't pattern WAS. Would get two tight, then a flyer 6'' away. I tried different loads, 130's seemed best.. 150 not so great.
2) Let it sit for a while because I was disappointed.
3) Put a Timney trigger in it myself to see if I could tighten my groups with a light pull... Still same thing lots of fliers, just way off (all at 100 yards)
4) Took the gun to Burdett and Sons and had them put on the proper Leupold scope bases and rings for my Rifleman optic. Took gun out again, still crap.
5) Had my uncle shoot it, who is an excellent marksman (did benchrest competition etc.), still no good.

I'd be perfectly happy with 1'' groupings at 100 yards, but I just cannot get it.

What are my options? I was thinking about rebarreling? But would actually be nice to know if it is shot or not? Seems like it is... or? Put a new stock on it to allow the barrel to be free floating? But I feel like if people say it shoots well with original stock, then maybe it should shoot fine with it not being free floating?

I'm in CS, was considering just taking to Burdett and Sons and seeing if they have any recommendations.

Any ideas what I'm missing here?

TIA

First thing you need to do is bed the stock. A lot of inaccuracy problems come from poorly fitted stocks. Its an easy fix and doesn't cost a whole lot. $70-100 depending on where you get it done.

Free floating the barrel will also help a bunch.

Would I be money ahead to simply just buy a new synthetic stock that allows for free floating the barrel?

Also, will bedding and free floating the barrel fix inaccuracy where shots are flying 6'' or more off target? Just trying to see if I dump money into doing the bedding and free floating and if that doesn't work where it leaves me...

sjislepilot said:

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Would I be money ahead to simply just buy a new synthetic stock that allows for free floating the barrel?

Also, will bedding and free floating the barrel fix inaccuracy where shots are flying 6'' or more off target? Just trying to see if I dump money into doing the bedding and free floating and if that doesn't work where it leaves me...

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Depends on what kind of synthetic stock you are wanting. If its a cheap molded stock, then you are going to have to bed it anyway. If you get a nice Bell and Carlson or a nice fiberglass stock then you will definitely see improvements. Just depends one what you want to do with it and how much money you want to spend. If it were me, I would keep this as a hunting rifle and bed the wood stock assuming the wood stock is in decent shape.

Bedding and free floating will most definitely increase your accuracy. I'm not handling you rifle or shooting it in person, so I can't give you assurance that a poorly fitted stock is you problem. But, even with a nice fitting wood stock, you will still see accuracy improvements in bedding it.

You can probably freefloat your barrel on your own. Bedding is not that hard to do either, if you feel inclined to do the work yourself. I did it on a few rifles myself well before I opened the store. I can do it here but usually farm it out because I don't usually have the time to do it. Also, have you tried different brands of ammo? There is a very realistic chance that if you're only using the same ammo over and over, your gun just doesn't like that specific brand.

Those two things will get you started. I would actually think that free floating the current barrel before doing a bedding job would be a good track to take. Bedding will cost more to do and doing a free float job first will let you see if the stock is what is affecting it. Of course, it may already be free float. Easiest way to tell is take a dollar bill and wrap it around the barrel and see if you can slide it down between the barrel and the stock. If it moves freely down, you're already floated. If not, you can basically just use sand paper and remove the inside part of the stock to the point of getting it there. Then take it back out and see.

How much has the rifle been shot? It may need to be rebarreled at this point. If it was someone's workhorse of a rifle back in the day, it may have had a lot of rounds through it.

We did a rebarrel and accurizing job on an older gun for a texags poster not too long ago. Ended up having to cerakote it as well to make everything look good but it's a damned good shooter now. New barrel, new stock, trued up the action, trigger job, etc. Came out nice though it doesn't look anything like it did when it came in.

One thing to be aware of when chasing small groups... it's a bit of a rabbit hole. Find a goal and try not to let yourself get too much deeper into it than that goal is. I've had one customer drop about 4K on one remington so far because he keeps wanting to go better. At this point, the ONLY thing that is the same on the rifle from the beginning is the receiver. Everything else has been changed multiple times. In fact, he's probably going to be coming in after hunting season and bringing by the extra parts we have and assembling a second rifle. We've gone from stock gun to doing a trigger job on his original trigger to a timney then to a jewel trigger. Stock went from a standard synthetic from magpul to a magpul hunter to an MDT chassis. Barrel went through three different brands (don't even remember which all but it has a Shilen on it now). Even ordered a new bolt in from pacific. 3 1/2 cerakote jobs on this thing as well.

Funny thing is, when he first came in, I gave standard, mid grade, and top tier options on everything and he wanted to start with cheaper and move up. He now realizes it would have saved him a ton of money just to get what he was going to want at the end up front.

Basically, figure out where you want to end up with the gun and then look at anything you want to do to change it. Then... don't move your own goal posts. If you feel you would be happy with it simply being sub moa without any fliers, get it there and be happy.

Check the tightness of the screws on the bottom of the action (preferably with a torque wrench) to see if one is looser than the other.. You may be able to find the torque specs to check that as well.

You can also try to slide a dollar bill under the barrel to see if there are any spots that are very tight.

What does the inside of the barrel look like? Any fouling? Give it a good cleaning with a copper solvent to see if that helps.




Edit.. Eyeguy types a lot faster than I do!

Thanks guys. This is extremely helpful. To answer a few questions, yes I have tried multiple types of different ammo and different grains. I would definitely be ok with sub MOA at 100 or 200 yards. But 6'' and 8'' fliers just don't make me feel great. I'm definitely a heavy DIYer and appreciate the nudge.

The barrel is not free floating. I checked that earlier this morning to be sure. I guess what is concerning to me is that it seems like tons of people shoot this gun as is and get sub MOA. So it makes me wonder if something is inherently wrong.

I don't believe that this gun was shot lots previous to me getting it. But I'm not confident on that. I guess what I'll do is try free floating the barrel with some sanding and then if that doesn't work maybe go and slap a new barrel on it.

Can't make chicken salad out of .....

Look down the barrel and check the rifling.

I had a No.1 that had the same issue. I pulled off the stock and realized it had a hump in it. I sanded down the hump and it shot sum MOA after that. That is where I would start. Then different brands of ammo.

Clean the barrel well and then scope the bore to make sure you have a good barrel to start with. If the bore is good, the other suggestions are a good starting point. If the rifling is pitted, etc I would rebarrel before anything else.

1: check the crown for nicks/burrs
2: try swapping scope out for another/someone else's known good scope. that much variation sounds to me like an erector issue
The copper fouling suggestion is a good one as well

The brand of gun reminded me of a story.

My dad has a J.C. Higgins single shot 22. that he bought as a kid in the 1960's. I think he said he paid $15 for it at Sears. Fast forward to my youth and after a bb gun this was the first rifle I learned to shoot. Had a lot of fun with it at my grandmothers house when I was a kid. In 2005 my parents house got damaged heavily during hurricane Rita. My Dad gets his guns out of the house and stores them with some other things in a storage unit. My parents finally settle with the insurance company and decide to sell their old house as is and buy a new/different house. We move everything out of their storage unit into the new house and they get rid of the storage unit. My Dad has every gun he put in the storage unit except the J.C. Higgins .22. He starts saying someone must have stolen it, then my Mom and I finally convince him that if someone had broken into the house that probably isn't what they would have stolen. Then he thinks maybe we forgot it in the storage unit. I tell him that I was the one that moved everything and I'm sure there wasn't anything left when we were done. It means a lot to my Dad and I so occasionally we think of a new place it could be and look. About 8 years later sometime in 2014 my Dad has retired and is looking for something in a closet and finds the gun hidden under a board for a built in shoe rack. He calls me and we're both happy talking about how we had kind of given up on finding it. So I asked how do you think it got there. He replies, "I put it there, I forgot all about it until I found it, but I remember putting it there now".

Ha! That's a great story!

Well just an update, decided that I didn't have time to deal with it at the moment and was looking for some professional help. So dropped it off at B&S here in CS. Hoping to maybe get some more insight out of having someone else shoot it.

If I had immediate access to a range I'd go do all the free floating and bedding myself, but didn't want to drop $20 or more at the range and then have to make adjustments and have to come back repetitively $$$. Anyway hopefully them checking it out will give me a better diagnosis. I appreciate the help on the board in helping me come to the decision and will report back what I find out and what I decided to do with it.

Thanks!

Would bet money it's a stock issue. Getting two touching and then a flier tells me you have a stress point that is activated when you get the barrel hot enough to distort even the slightest bit. Once you get that different harmonic action going, you get the flier. Could be from an uneven heating element due to the stock not allowing the barrel to expand uniformly, to a change in harmonics due to the barrel and stock touching. Doesn't take much sometimes.

Stock
Trigger
Crown

Those are going to be the 3 biggest reasons for lack of accuracy on a run of the mill production rifle.