Cross-posted on the Jobs board...I know this isn't OB related, but I value this board's opinions and IIRC, there are some engineers on here.

Background: In high school, I always wanted to do engineering, but for various reasons ended up in the business school instead. I graduated recently from the PPA program at A&M with my BBA in accounting and MS in finance in four years while making exceptional grades. I have passed the CPA exam and I'm nearing the work experience requirements for getting my license. After having worked at a Big Four accounting firm (currently audit...though I did an internship in tax, so I've seen that side as well) for a while, I'm not sure that accounting is for me. The only two challenging things about my current job are dealing with unresponsive clients and having more work to do than time to do it in. I find nothing about it mentally stimulating or gratifying at all, and my only true motivation for working is not getting fired.

Now that I've had a taste of what jobs in accounting are really like, I'm very seriously considering attempting to make the switch to engineering, likely mechanical or electrical/computer. Has anyone done this personally or heard of someone doing this? Or if not, do you have any general advice in regards to switching careers, going back to school, sticking with my current job, etc.? Do you think a career in engineering will be any more satisfying than accounting? For those of you who are in the engineering field, could you give me an idea of what a typical work day is like for you (tasks, work load, hours, job satisfaction, etc.)?

I know the switch is made from one field to business all the time, but going from business to something else (particularly engineering) seems like it will be much more difficult. Any and all input is appreciated.

If it wasn't apparent from the above post, I obviously plan to go back to school to achieve this.

I graduated with an engineering degree (IE), and my wife and brother graduated with their masters from the PPA program. She worked audit (MIS) at a big four and recently left after three years. She wanted a better work-life balance. My brother works tax for a middle market firm since he didn't want the pressure. I would put in my time, get the experience and leave. Big, high paying companies love to hire people with three to five years of big four experience.
If you go to engineering, you'll need to go back to school. I wouldn't spend the money or the time (which you could be earning a good salary during) to switch. The return on investment would never be there. Engineering is a grind just as accounting. I don't see a gain by going into engineering. I think it may just be a case of the grass being greener.
Edited for Swype typos.

[This message has been edited by ScubaJ524 (edited 1/2/2013 2:03a).]

I was PPA group 15 w/ a BS in ACCT an an MS in FINC.

After making it through 3 busy seasons, I made it to a large chemical company in Houston. The work load and environment is entirely different than what I experienced while I was in public

I would recommend maximizing your potential in business, rather than going back for engineering. Overall, I doubt the expense will be offset by future earning potential.

If you are in Houston and would like to discuss further, shoot me an email at southpawag07@gmail.com

Sick with your current path. As others have said, you'll spend a lot of money to get an engineering degree which won't leave you that much more satisfied in my opinion.

I graduated as an Aero engineer and have been out for 3.5 years. I find my job highly satisfying, but I do nothing related to engineering they teach in school.

Find something you like related to your degree...

Follow your dreams. I have a BS in engineering, went into the oil business, loved every minute of it....something different every day.

Whatever you choose to pursue, never stop learning, start with larger companies and learn...learn...learn, then move to smaller companies until you can start your own with some good people you have assembled/met over your career and clients that appreciate your approach to business.

If you are like me, the freedom that comes with that approach makes the grind well worth it. And if you do it well, the financial rewards will come with the effort.

It would be a labor of love, because it damn sure wouldn't pay off financially. Working as an accountant for an industrial or technical company might scratch this itch a hell of a lot better.

I had a student do this a few years ago. They received an undergrad in accounting and then worked as an accountant for ~10 years. He hated accounting so he went back an got an undergrad in civil engineering and went on to get a Masters. He has had trouble finding a job for two main reasons 1) He cannot move because of family and 2) he is in his 40's. Whether it's fair or not, many companies have a hard time putting an older person in an entry level engineering position.

I have a tremendous amount of respect for someone who can make it through an undergraduate engineering degree when they're 30+ years old. It is hard enough at 18-22.

If you are absolutely dead set on engineering then go back to school and give it a try. But it will be hard to get through engineering undergrad working full-time.

If you just want to do something different, you don't necessarily need a different degree for that.

If you do go back and get an engineering degree, if you are willing to move, and engineering + accounting background could open up some interesting job opportunities.

If you want a change with challenges, you might look into project management. It's tough, but rewarding, and there is money to be made there in multiple industries. U of H has a great masters program in this field. I'm about to wrap my MS up next December.

See if you can do a rotation in IT Audit. That's where I am because I knew I didn't like accounting enough to do it.

It has its challenges and might be what you end up liking. At the very worst you get a different experience ti put on your résumé when you go to industry.

OP - send me an email to my gmail account.
I may know some people you can talk to.
Username98


[This message has been edited by Damagedone (edited 1/2/2013 8:39a).]

My first and foremost suggestion is for you to find someone who has the job you want and pick their brain six ways to Sunday.

Ask them what they hate about it. Ask them where their goals are. Ask them all sorts of questions.

I had a very different view of what I thought engineering was going to be from what I actually experienced.

I was a EIT from 2004 to 2009. I then made the decision to get out of engineering and go to dental school, of all places. Even though I am still in school, and will be until May 2015, I am so very happy with my decision.

But, before I took the plunge (that included 2 extra years of undergrad to bring up a crappy engineering GPA and get pre-reqs before even starting the 4 year dental program) I shadowed the hell out of several dentists. I watched their day-to-day, admin work, patient relations, everything. I wanted to be damned sure it was what I wanted to do before I put my very supportive wife and son (now sons) through the hell that is dental school.


So again, my biggest advice is to make really sure you know what you're getting into. Dont think you know, know you know.

If you do that, you wont have to wonder if it is the right decision. There wont be any questions if the move is right or wrong.

Good advice above and I agree with tx4guns and Yuccadoo. Maybe look at switching to an oil and gas company and get in project management or business development. I'm a CPA but I spend as much time, if not more, dealing with our operations and a lot of time with our engineers. If you get into PM or BD at an oil and gas company (which may take some time) you can get exposure to a broad array of disciplines and be challenged more. If you aren't interested in O&G, other industries can offer the same opportunities. It may not be easy to find a job right away but it would probably be quicker than going back for an engineering degree. And as Yuccaddo said, never stop learning. When you do, switch jobs. I see too many young kids who just want to put in their 40 hours. If you constantly learn, volunteer for more work, create your own work when it is slow, you will quickly differentiate yourself from your peers.

And one more option, try for a job in investment banking. It will be challenging and you can get exposure to engineering, operations, etc. as you work on deals.

I got a business degree because that was the quickest way out of college. I got into project management (via project controls) at an O/G company. You could easily work your way into a construction manager type position (held by engineering types) with some experience and additional learning, without spending the time and money for an Eng degree.

Get out of public.

I recommend looking into internal audit, not anything like external so don't be scared off by the word audit.

If it makes a difference in any of the answers, I have no wife or kids yet, and will be able to fund the cost of going back to school with what I have saved from my current job (i.e. if I'm working, it will only be part time to cover living expenses). My current girlfriend of 5 years will still be in school for the next 2-3 years.

Also, I assumed the pay in engineering would be significantly higher than in accounting (at least 10k or so). Wouldn't this fact alone cancel out the potential cost of going back to school?

[This message has been edited by 12thAngryMan (edited 1/2/2013 12:07p).]

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I assumed the pay in engineering would be significantly higher than in accounting

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I need to borrow the cry/laugh emotion icon.

[This message has been edited by WildcatAg (edited 1/2/2013 12:15p).]

This thread makes me smile. I was in your position four years ago.

I graduated from A&M with a degree in Industrial Distribution. I got a job working as a sales rep for an industrial equipment manufacturer. I did ok, but didn't like selling a product that was basically a commodity. I wanted to be on the other side of the sales table. So at 29 years old, and with a pregnant wife, I went back to school to get a mechanical engineering degree. I graduated last May with a 3.8 GPA. The job I have now includes quite a bit of design work, but I am also responsible for the company's sales. Not exactly the other side of the sales table, but I enjoy every minute of it.


My wife graduated from A&M's PPA program in 2004. She worked for two different public accounting firms doing audit work, and hated every second of it. She had a manager's position when she started looking for other work. She found a position at a regional bank working on their internal audits. She has since been promoted a couple times and absolutely loves her job. 8:00 to 5:00 now, and hardly ever has to bring an work home with her.


So my advice is:
1 - Get out of public accounting.
2 - Go back to school if you think it will open some more doors for you. It certainly did for me.

The pay scale, like anything depends on industry. I have a MEEN grad friend that gets paid peanuts next to friends working as CPA at a big 4, and CPA would make more in industry. Then again, you could have a MEEN grad at a mid O&G operator that could potentially outearn most CPAs in an equivalent tenure role. So it depends, and if you like what you do, it makes the money not matter...as much.

OP,

From what you've written, particularly if you recently graduated and are not currently married, I see no problem in going back to school and doing engineering. I've been at three different engineering schools (huzzah grad school) and have encountered many people who have done exactly what you are considering doing, all of various ages.

However...

I would throw away all vagueness and consider what type of engineering job you want to do. Find someone with a job that you want, and as another poster suggested really pick their brain. Legally, you cannot call yourself an engineer or render engineering services unless you have a P.E. (with all its esoteric prereqs), but perhaps the job you really desire doesn't require an engineering degree (or licensure) at all.

I have always wanted to be an engineer and have been immensely satisfied in my vocation and would recommend it to anyone, but engineering is difficult is not for everyone. Give it some time.

[This message has been edited by KY AG (edited 1/2/2013 12:29p).]

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Also, I assumed the pay in engineering would be significantly higher than in accounting (at least 10k or so). Wouldn't this fact alone cancel out the potential cost of going back to school?

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Engineering may pay more to start but the up-side is a lot higher in public accounting than it is as an engineer at a typical operating company. (That assumes you are willing to go through the pain in takes to make it to the partner/director level.)

I graduated with MS Acct degree in 2009 (not from A&M unfortunately), worked Big 4 audit (in Houston) for 2 years, got my CPA then bolted for industry internal audit in midstream oil and gas a year ago. The workload and work life balance is night and day from public, but the work still is pretty much pointless stuff that no one values just like public.

Granted, internal audit is supposed to be just a stepping stone to other finance/acct jobs within the company, but all those possible jobs down the line look just as boring and pointless, but that may be just the company I work for or the midtream business as a whole. All of those wonderful post big 4 opportunities that everyone talks about, seem to be BS, unless your ultimate career goal is to be a controller or accounting manager.

I know a few engineers in the industry and now after being in the workforce for a few years and seeing how the energy industry works, it is plain as day that the engineers run these companies and operations is what drives everything, everything else is just a support function.

Not only is what they do a 1000x more interesting and vital and actually tangible, they make more money coming out of school than I will be making as a CPA in 10 years on the job, without needing a stupid masters degree that costs a fortune!!!

The fact of the matter is that the PPA programs are basically a mechanism devised by the schools and big 4 firms to crank out staff auditors to work like a slave for 2 years before the new round comes in and rip students off on a useless 5th year masters degree.

If you have the financial ability to go back to school and get an engineering degree I would do it in a heartbeat. I think it would be worth another 2 years or so of school to get out of accounting and I still may consider it.

email is jmcroft8@gmail.dot.com if anyone would like to discuss.

Wessimo, there is no chance that I will stay until partner.

This decision isn't really about the money, I was only replying to the common remark about it not being worth it financially.

Still, check your math. You are talking about foregoing 2-3 years of wages and instead spending savings on tuition, etc. I think you will find the rate of return very low if you factor in opportunity costs and expenses. That said, if you go through it and are actually happy doing your job then it would be worth it.

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Wessimo, there is no chance that I will stay until partner.

This decision isn't really about the money, I was only replying to the common remark about it not being worth it financially.

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If finances are not a factor, then it seems like a no brainer. I would certainly rather spend the next 2-3 years busting my tail on a bunch of math and science courses with a great job to follow, then to be busting my tail documenting bank reconciliation and journal entry reviews that will lead to another boring job with less hours.

Seems like the biggest obstacle is getting accepted to a school for a second bachelors.

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Follow your dreams. I have a BS in engineering, went into the oil business, loved every minute of it....something different every day.

Whatever you choose to pursue, never stop learning, start with larger companies and learn...learn...learn, then move to smaller companies until you can start your own with some good people you have assembled/met over your career and clients that appreciate your approach to business.

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You've gotten quite a bit of good advice in this thread, but this was the best. If you want to be satisfied, given the path you're on, working for yourself is one of the best ways to be doing exactly what you like. I don't know anything about being a project manager, but I imagine it's more interesting than auditing, but if you can put yourself in a position to run your own business you will find what you're looking for. The best way to do that though, is to keep eating a turd sandwich and work where you are. Meet people. Learn the industry. Somebody suggested investment banking, which would be a good route. You should be able to make the jump over with your background. Work in investment banking for awhile, and then start up your own gig. Easy to say on the internet, but it can be done with enough motivation and smarts, and if you obviously have the mental capacity. It sounds like you're not lacking in drive either. Just be sure to follow something you like when you start pursuing your own business. I graduated in 2002 in Finc with a 2.0 b/c I chose to screw around in college, a decision I regret. I couldn't get one of the jobs I wanted b/c of my grades and the market at the time (wanted to be an energy trader...and enron happened...and my grades sucked). Instead, I got a sales job at a mortgage company. Since I'm full of chit and good with people I've done well in it. I went out on my own somewhat in 2007, and I've had a small branch of a mortgage bank ever since. I've been fortunate to live in Houston where the economy and housing market have been very good since I graduated, and the government keeps helping what's left of the mortgage industry by artificially manipulating interest rates further and further down. So it's been successful, and that's great. And I hate it. I can't express enough how much I hate it. But I'm pretty much trapped. I've never had another job, and I'm too old now to get into something else. First world problems. But I digress. Take a serious look at the investment banking route. I assume it would be pretty interesting.

I've been in accounting since 1984. Go engineering.

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Somebody suggested investment banking, which would be a good route. You should be able to make the jump over with your background.

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That's what damn near every single person in the big 4 or with an accounting degree wants/tries to do. It's pretty much next to impossible, unless you have some ridiculous connections.

ibanking and money management (CFA) have been my answers to move into something more interesting. Or commodity trading.

AngryMan, I did PPA and have some questions and advice for you as well. email me at my name above at yahoo mail (no spaces and you can figure the yahoo part).

[This message has been edited by Fish Outta H2O (edited 1/2/2013 10:32p).]

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Now that I've had a taste of what jobs in accounting are really like, I'm very seriously considering attempting to make the switch to engineering, likely mechanical or electrical/computer. Has anyone done this personally or heard of someone doing this? Or if not, do you have any general advice in regards to switching careers, going back to school, sticking with my current job, etc.? Do you think a career in engineering will be any more satisfying than accounting? For those of you who are in the engineering field, could you give me an idea of what a typical work day is like for you (tasks, work load, hours, job satisfaction, etc.)?

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I'm an ME working for an O&G company on the E&P side. I've also interned with an auto manufacturer in an engine design role.

I also "switched" industries in my late twenties.

This is based on my experience.

My workload as well as my colleague's is fairly high and constant. In my opinion, the workload consists of things that engineers in general should not be doing. In general, I am a very highly paid secretary/admin assistant/manager.

I have used very, very little of my formal engineering training and education. The few times I have been able to legitimately be engaged in a technical matter, my superiors decided to bring the matter to a consultant. Other times, my superiors decide to confer with maintenance crafts on technical matters.

I think my employer is confused on how to legitimately utilize internal engineering resources.

Some project is commissioned. invariably an engineer must be assigned to manage it. This equates to ensuring material is specified to API and company technical specs (in this endeavor you feel more like a lawyer than anything else) all the way to managing and fixing logistics issues with the entire project.

Some examples from my job...and this goes for my colleagues as well:

"So and So can't work on this today, can we reschedule?"

"So and So doesn't know what parts to order or how to order them. I was told you were the engineer on this project." This invariably means, you have to do this for us because you are an engineer .

Once the project is being executed, be prepared to nano-manage at the job site: Don't put this part in yet...we still have to finish welding and stress relieving. Don't hold the tools this way, you will drop them and cause a safety incident. So and so didn't show up today, can we get someone else on this project?

So and so comes to you in a panic because they can't put such and such part in according to the drawing. You are the engineer, so you have to do it for them. If the project is scheduled for 24 hr shifts, be prepared to have to crawl out of bed to inspect the project at hold points or to come down to the project site and manage some logistics issue.

Regional management wants to know the percent complete on such and such project--that you aren't working on because you are managing this project.

Regional management wants to know what your projected spend is for the month and why such and such invoice (out of 100) was off by 15.7% which is against company rules.

Your boss tells you: Safety showed up at your job site and said rules 1,2,3,4,5,6,7, are being willfully violated. I need to know how you are going to fix it.

Your boss tells you: your colleague can't handle such and such portion of their project. I need you to handle it.

You also get to sit in various meetings for projects, safety committees, RCAs, etc and listen to snide remarks about being an engineer and how much you don't know (yet when projects kick-off people's IQ drop 300 pts) and how much experience you don't have. Multiply this times 2-3 for being an Aggie.

Your boss tells you that he has to send you to North Dakota for a quick 3 month rotation on another project.

Example I haven't experienced but heard in real-time from my colleague's office across from me: A contractor storms into your office complaining (almost screaming) that you underpaid him and that it is up to you to make it right.

When I worked for an auto manufacturer the work was much more intellectually satisfying. You are put in charge of solving a technical problem with some such component of the whole vehicle.

You work up a solution to a problem. You show this to your supervisor. This invariably must be accompanied by solid and sound engineering theory or some technical modeling program output that the company has. The both of you work out a plan to test the solution. You get prototype parts made up with people who know what they are doing. You install the parts. You test the parts. You statistically analyze the results. Report findings to upper management. Interface with them if they have further questions.

Overall my job satisfaction is about the same but in dramatically different ways. O&G pays well, manufacturing did not. O&G allows me ample opportunities to stay in Tx, manufacturing does not.Job security is 10x in O&G what it is in manufacturing.

Hope this helps...



[This message has been edited by fixer (edited 1/3/2013 8:29a).]

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I have used very, very little of my formal engineering training and education. The few times I have been able to legitimately be engaged in a technical matter, my superiors decided to bring the matter to a consultant. Other times, my superiors decide to confer with maintenance crafts on technical matters.

I think my employer is confused on how to legitimately utilize internal engineering resources.

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This frustrated me to no end.


The only way I saw around this was to be the boss, which is one of the reasons I bolted for dental school, or rather oral engineering.

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This frustrated me to no end.

The only way I saw around this was to be the boss, which is one of the reasons I bolted for dental school, or rather oral engineering.

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Same here...frustrating is putting it very lightly.

I got lucky. The company developed a new role that I moved into that allows me alot of room from the more frustrating elements of being a typical engineer.

I am or was in a very similar situation to you. Graduating with a degree in accounting, but went to work as an internal auditor at a major O&G company. That was interesting for several years until I got burned out on the travel. Now I work as a finance analyst and am essentially the punching bag for the managers and vice presidents to complain to when we don't hit production targets. But I digress.

I can look around and see the engineers running financial models for investment prospects, which drives someone with an accounting/finance background insane. We literally went to school for this, and have to watch guys try and trick the models to give them answers that will fund their projects. It's just absurd, but is the reason if you did go back, you would probably be an extremely valuable engineer to whoever hired you.

Getting an engineering degree will probably take a minimum of 4 years going to school full time. I looked into this myself, and almost 0 hours from my accounting degree would have transfered over to any engineering degree plan.

When you graduate, you will most likely entertain two types of job offers, entry level engineering, or consulting. Yeah, consulting, selling bull**** answers to companies with managers that don't want to be accountable for their decisions. It will likely pay more starting out, but you could get into consulting right now.

I'm not trying to discourage you from doing this, in fact I would love to be able to say I really envy that guy on Texags who did it in a few years. Just wanted to share the experience of someone in a similar position.

Two other comments, I can gaurantee you that life on the other side of Big 4 Acct will be better, because it is for everyone who leaves.
Also, if you hate Big 4 hours and trivial work, investment banking is absolutely not for you.