Can these be found in big box retailers? If not, any recommendations for brands online?

I purchased a box of cci, I think. Was from a specialty store though. Not a big box like walmart or academy

Aguila Colibri makes a few different varients of subsonic 22 ammo.

What is the point? I'm sure there is one, but what?

I've bought Remington subsonics from Wally World. Their accuracy at 20-25 feet was adequate for my purposes.

It's quiet as hell, I can shoot in my backyard.

purpose: squirrel maintenance

You mean tick infested tree rats?

I have shot the CCIs amd they are accurate at around 40 yards but they are slow I think 840 fps you can almost see them come out but they are very quiet.

Remington subsonics are usually found at wal-mart and cabela's.

Ah. Very good. Thanks for the education!

Arent they called .22 Shorts?

.22 short is an entirely different beast, I'm fairly certain. I shoot the super calibri

different beast entirely

Another option that is significantly quieter than a subsonic round (which is still fairly loud unsuppressed) is a CB or a CB Long.

CB Longs generally cycle through firearms better than shorts, especially if it's a semi. You'll have to manually work the action regardless, but they are hella quiet and carry about 4x the power and range of a Benjamin pellet gun. Probably about 1/4 the power of a subsonic round.

I've shot them in my backyard growing up out of a .22 single six and the neighbors had no clue. My yard there wasn't small, but it wasn't huge, and we had nothing but a hurricane fence between us and the neighbors, so sound carried as if there was nothing there. They will do a number on squirrels, rabbits, snakes, cats, etc. and usually won't punch all the way through the critter, so it makes it a little safer and easier with your shot (assuming you hit your target, of course) and what is behind it.

If you toss a suppressor on your rifle or semi pistol with these, you litereally hear nothing but the firing pin. It's very nice.

Thanks for the info.

BassPro has all the subsonic you could want. I saw Remington and Winchester, don't know about CCI. PMC used to make a subsonic called "Moderator" but I think they stopped making them. I bought a box of RWS at a local gunshop, and they were a good accurate round, but they wanted 3 times what I could get a box of Rem. or Win. at BassPro. IMHO, the Remingtons are better because they have a round nose bullet, which feeds better in an automatic. The Winchesters are truncated noses and tend to jam.

I can vouch for the the CB longs, very very quiet. I got a box of CCI from academy, perfect for stray cat/armadillo/possum eradication without drawing a lot of attention on a quiet night.

They dont cycle in semi-autos however like previous posters indicated.

[This message has been edited by hellapark (edited 5/18/2010 4:27p).]

Technically, most standard velocity .22 lr ammo is sub-sonic. Subject to some debate, the sound barrier is around 1133 fps; standards will chrono at about 1050 -1120.

The stuff marketed as sub-sonic is usually about 960-980 fps. Velocities tend to be erratic with these, varying greatly between shots. As the above poster mentioned, they are fine for short range work. Shooting at paper @ 50 yds, your group will spread vertical.

The high end target ammo >$15 (Eley, Lapua, RWS, Green Dot, etc.) will all chrono about 1050 fps, and the velocity will not vary much. This is what you pay for. There is a 'transition zone' just before and after the 1133 fps sound barrier, which causes issues as the bullet leaves the muzzle. Target ammo is designed to operate below this zone.

For backyard in city limits work, I would recommend Aguila Super Colibri (as noted by another poster). No powder, only primer powered. They clock at 500 fps, like a BB gun. Almost no sound in a rifle, audible in a handgun (remember those little white poppers you buy at the fireworks stand that pop on impact?) Will not feed in semi auto, so becomes a single shot. Revolver is the best way to go. 20 yds to 30 yds range, aim a little high.

Note I said Super Colibri, not Colibri. Aguila makes both.

Cabelas carries some Aguila, and can be bought from Midway, Natchez, etc. Cheap, about $3-$4 per box.


[This message has been edited by Boots over Delaware (edited 5/18/2010 5:01p).]

I can tell you that your run of the mill bricks (Winchester Wildcat, Remington Golden Sabre, etc.) exceed the sound barrier.

When shooting out of my 10/22 with the suppressor, the sonic crack is very clearly made out with brick ammo.

Drop down to subsonic, and the impact is generally much louder than any report, and there is no sonic crack.

Most of your higher end target ammo is subsonic. Ely is good stuff, but the best I found (at least in my rifle) was Winchester Supreme match ammo. Accuracy was insane with that stuff, but I haven't seen any on the shelf in a long time.

I haven't noticed too much disparity in accuracy with the Remington Subs. You'll get the occasional flyer, but I've put up some impressive groups (for bulk ammo) at 50 yards with it - quarter sized ragged holes. It's not match grade by any stretch, but it's just as accurate as your run of the mill .22 rimfire ammo.

I have not tried any Winchester to date, but I don't doubt your findings. 1133 fps is based on laboratory settings, and there is some debate to this number.

I have not tried the Sumpremes, I will put them on the list.

Surprisingly, all of the 38 brands I have tested will group decently at 50 yds, regardless of cost. The big difference is ragged hole + 2-3 flyers, or just ragged hole (10 shots).

At 100 yds, the cheap stuff gets sorted out quickly.

Do the Aguila SSS work well with the supressor? Do you see a big velocity drop vs non-canned?

Not to hijack - but we seem to have some .22 knowledge here.

I'm looking to buy some bulk (~5000) .22 ammo from ammunitiontogo.com or similar and was wondering which brands to avoid. I've heard some bad things about the Remington stuff so far. I don't need match grade stuff - just reliable ammo my boys can use to punch holes in paper.

Check out Cheaper Than Dirt's site. If you're in North Ft. Worth on I35W sometime you can stop by their store, too.

If you need quiet pest control, it's hard to beat a modern air rifle. The Crosman Marauder comes with a shrouded barrel and is very very quiet. Available in .22 or .25 caliber and will easily dispatch small game.

You have to precharge the air container on these guns, with either a hand pump or a scuba tank. Once charged with air they'll shoot about 40 rounds in .22 or 20 rounds in .25 before needing a recharge. If you need back yard pest control in the city, they're hard to beat. Often avoids that discharging a firearm in the city limits thing.

Nearly everything is subsonic out a pistol, FYI.

Winchester Dyna-points are usually stocked at Wal-Mart and are very accurate in my rifles and they are quite through my cans.

The best bulk ammo I've used so far is the 550ct Federal in the reddish-brown box that AFAIK is only sold at Walmart. Used to run about $13 per, but I think is closer to $16 per box.

This ammo is cleaner to handle that most others, and feeds just fine in every semi-auto rifle or pistol I've ever run it through. I probably have about 20 boxes of the stuff....

BQ-

Based on this testing criteria-

-velocity repeatability
-accuracy on paper at 50 yds & 100 yds (mostly 50)
-rim thickness uniformity

using a single shot bolt action rifle 26" bull barrel with globe sights..

... American Eagle 38 gr copper plated hollow points or Federal 40 gr LRN (510) gave the best results for lower cost 'brick' ammo.

I measured and tested a brick (400 and 500 rounds, respectively) of each, they performed surprisingly well for the price.

CCI Standard Velocity is great, but cost a bit more.

I have not done any semi-auto testing, the chamber dimensions are slightly different. I didn't really test for hunting, either, just paper.

If you can swing it, try to pick up a box of Wolf Match Extra. In the ball park of the high end performance, but much more affordable, $6-$7 per box instead of $15-$20. Projectiles are lubricated, all of the high end stuff is. Most of the focused 10/22 shooters I converse with at the range run with the Wolf.

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Nearly everything is subsonic out a pistol, FYI.

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Several companies offer "match pistol" or "auto-pistol" rounds. I haven't tried this yet, what's the difference?

I have tried the Eley "Biathalon". Supposedly, the only difference is the lube is designed to work well in freezing temps...

+1 on the Aguila Super Colibri. It was quieter than a bb gun. I could not believe it.

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Will not feed in semi auto, so becomes a single shot.

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This was true of my 22 S&W target pistol, but it feeds very nice in my little bolt action rifle mag.

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I have not tried any Winchester to date, but I don't doubt your findings. 1133 fps is based on laboratory settings, and there is some debate to this number.

I have not tried the Sumpremes, I will put them on the list.

Surprisingly, all of the 38 brands I have tested will group decently at 50 yds, regardless of cost. The big difference is ragged hole + 2-3 flyers, or just ragged hole (10 shots).

At 100 yds, the cheap stuff gets sorted out quickly.

Do the Aguila SSS work well with the supressor? Do you see a big velocity drop vs non-canned?

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In reloading, the general standard to keep subsonic is below 1100 fps, so your 1133 is probably pretty accurate. It all depends on elevation above sea level, temperature, pressure and humidity, so it's a fluid number.

I have't seen the Supreme in .22 in a long time - I'm really not sure if they make it anymore or not, though I admit I haven't looked for any either in a while. The rounds were scary accurate, but the drawback to them is that they seemed to have a high number of misfires compared to Ely or even bulk ammo. Part of that could have been that my setup has a lighter firing pin, but I didn't have that issue with any other brand (at least not as much). Usually if I look for higher end ammo, I go with Ely. It's not too terribly expensive and easy to find, so that's what I've used over the last 5 or so years.

I've never shot the SSS rounds, so I can't tell you much about whether they perform with a can. I can't see why they would not though. If a CB round will pass through my can easily (it's not a small can by .22 standards), then the SSS should have no issue. They are a heavier and slower round compared to most .22 rounds if I remember correctly (something like a 60 grain at around 1k fps?). I really don't know if there is any appreciable velocity drop through my can - bulk rounds still leave supersonic, so if there is any, it's not much.

I also thought that most bulk .22 rounds were in the 1250 to 1300 fps range, with CCI stingers pushing about 100fps to 200fps faster. I don't have a chrono though, so I could be off on those numbers, but my Winchester 555 box states 1280 fps with a 36gr plated hollow point projectile.

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Not to hijack - but we seem to have some .22 knowledge here.

I'm looking to buy some bulk (~5000) .22 ammo from ammunitiontogo.com or similar and was wondering which brands to avoid. I've heard some bad things about the Remington stuff so far. I don't need match grade stuff - just reliable ammo my boys can use to punch holes in paper.

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Remington Golden Sabers (and every other Remington, Winchester, Federal or CCI) bulk ammo is as good as the next. You could take a handfull of each, put them in a coffee can, shake it up well and I would bet dollars to doughnuts that you would never be able to tell the difference between any of the brands.

.22 ammo choices are like the Chevy vs. Ford vs. Dodge argument. Everybody has an opinon, and everybody has a rifle that will love one brand and hate another. Most likely everybody has a rifle that is opposite of their other rifle, and a lot of that (I think anyway) is very bias opinion.

Best thing you can do is go buy a few boxes or a brick of each brand and try them out. Whichever your rifle(s) like best, that's what to buy in your bulk pack. Any of the major brands are going to be good, and odds are that unless your gun just doesn't like one particular brand, you won't notice a difference between one and another.

I have several semi .22 in both rifles and pistols, and I can honestly tell you that I don't recall ever having a feeding issue with any brand. A lot of people claim they do, but I don't personally.

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Nearly everything is subsonic out a pistol, FYI.

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True. Doesn't matter what type I punch out of my P22, they are all subsonic and suppress very nicely.

Almost all Target or Match 22LR is sub-sonic, but if what you want is something quiet, I vote for the CB rounds. The Super Colibri rounds didn't shoot worth a crap in my 10/22. Slung them all over the place. The CB rounds go where you want them to go, and they'll knock a squirrel on his ass.

One thing I recall reading about the SSS rounds a long time ago is that if you don't have a stabilized barrel, the rounds won't perform worth a crap.

I can't remember exactly what the article said, but I do remember it stating that you needed something like a .125" diameter bleed off hole towards the muzzle of your barrel for the round to stabilize in fight and be accurate. If you didn't have it, then your rounds were likely to not produce good groups.

I think i bought a brick of colibri's many moons ago when they were relatively new on the market, but I didn't fire them out of a semi - lever action only, so I can't state whether or not they worked well in anything other. But then again, my 69A loves everything I put throug it - shorts, longs, long rifle, CB short, CB long, etc.

I have not heard about a bleed hole, but your typical twist rate is made for a 40 gr bullet, SSS is 60 gr. They would lose stability at longer ranges and keyhole. I've heard of custom 10/22 barrels made for SSS.

I have not had any keyholes at 50 , I haven't tried at 100 (the drop is ridiculous). They're supposed to have dramatic results on tree rats...

Aguila makes some interesting products...

you could always mimic the movies and tape a plastic bottle on the end of the barrel.