anyone here graduate the ppa program with a mis or finance degree? if so what were your offers coming out, and how many hours do you work a week?

I'm considering joining the program but not sure if it is worth it, thanks for your help

A lot of people I know and people on this board have gone through the PPA program. You will probably hear from both sides. One person on here named Byron will probably be the most helpful when it comes to taking the path less traveled when it comes to graduating from the PPA program.

One question...do you like accounting? How do you know?

I was group 8 finance. Finance can lead to audit, tax or advisory. MIS leads to IT. I'm still at work (eastern time), but it is busy season (taking a quick break.)

I'd do finance unless you just LOVE systems...

I completely disagree with Ol Jock. I was group 11 and did the MIS track. With a bachelors degree in accounting and a masters degree in MIS you can pretty much do anything you want. I work in public accounting in a smaller group within the audit practice that mainly does 404 and internal audit work on both IT and business process sides. I've also worked with the financial audit group as well as the advisory(IT) group. I think the hours are much better in the group I work in now than they are in financial audit. I work about 50hrs/week during busy season and never work weekends. I also know the pay is better in the group I'm in now. Dont forget even if you do the MIS track you can still sit for the CPA. I finally passed it and it has really worked to my advantage.

I must admit, I dont know a lot about MIS but here is my perception of what you can do with the MIS track degree:

IT Consulting
Public Accounting (Audit mainly)
Internal controls crap (Is that what 404 compliance is?)

Now, is that all you can do? Absolutely not. With a CPA and an Accounting/MIS degree you can go out and get a number of jobs. The ones listed above however will be basically handed to you on a silver platter. Want to do Management Consulting (Bain, McKinsey, etc), then sure you can do it with an MIS degree just as well as with a Finance or even English degree. If you are motivated and you have good internships and are a good interviewer, you can do a lot with ANY degree. My point is that the above job choices are the jobs handed to MIS students on a silver platter in the PPA program.

As for Finance, thats what I am about to finish with. I interned in Tax at Deloitte (something that you would probably have a hard time doing with an MIS degree). I learned a lot, enjoyed it, but it wasnt really my cup of tea at the end of the day. I knew auditing wasnt for me. I ended up interviewing for a vareity of jobs. I interviewed for corporate banking jobs, investment banking jobs, consulting jobs, financial advisory services jobs...

I accepted an offer in investment banking and I will work way more hours each week than you want to work if you are asking about hours.

As for hours of other jobs, here are some of my guesses:

Systems people at big 4 accounting (what most MIS people do, not sure what the position is called) - Similar hours to an auditor with big 4. Probably 45-50 hours half the time and 60-70 hours a week during the busy seasons (yes, there are more than one).

IT consulting - You will probably travel a lot. Your hours will probably hover somewhere around 50-55 hours.

Corporate MIS job - 40 hours/week

Pay for all of these will be comparable starting out ($45-55k). The corporate job will have fewer and smaller raises most likely.

As for the finance jobs I discussed. Most will work 45-60 hours/week. Ibanking will be more like 80-110 depending on your location and the group you are in. I am in Houston so I think my hours will hover towards the lower end. In NYC you will have lots of 100+ hour weeks (probably about 15-20/year). You are well compensated for your work ($60k salary, $10k signing bonus, $60-80k end of year bonus = $130-150k) but not everyone is made for working that many hours.

Long story short, if you enjoy finance, do finance. If you want to do public accounting, do MIS. You can do public accounting with finance, but you are really just a burden on the finance department if you want to do public accounting. If you want to do corporate banking, ibanking, wealth management, investment management, or even management consulting, then sure do finance. But dont be like the 50-100 people per year that do PPA finance and then do public accounting. I have seen it first hand, those peoples lack of caring for finance really diminishes the finance departments ability to challenge those who are interested in finance.

[This message has been edited by byron06 (edited 1/19/2007 8:47a).]

thank you very much for your help, im not certain what I like right now I think the only thing I do know is that I do not want to do tax or public accounting, I know I love financial markets and everything about them but I dont know if I want to work that many hours. I am enrolled in finance 267 currently (a one hour survey of stock and commodity trading course) so hopefully that will help me with my decision. You guys have been most helpful, thanks alot



[This message has been edited by bwill0509 (edited 1/19/2007 11:36a).]

I have zero idea why rodeogirl hates me, because we said largely the same thing.

I agree with byron said EXCEPT the final paragraph. Maybe times have changed, but people in my group took our finance classes very seriously. Finance also serves VERY well in public accounting, especially as you move up the ranks and deal with more complicated areas.

I am the hiring manager for a Big 4 office. When I see a MIS concentration, I know that 9.9 times out of 10, they want a systems audit or straight IT position. Finance concentrations go a number of different ways.

If you don't want public, the MIS will lead well into an internal audit IT position or systems consulting (Bearingpoint, et al). Finance can lead into a more diverse set of choices on a macro level (accounting, IB, managerial consulting, etc, etc.)

hth

Ol Jock, I'm not disputing that Finance is a nice background to have if you go into public accounting. I am just saying its a little annoying when you have a good portion of the PPA Finance students not really trying that hard in the finance classes. Many of the Finance track PPA students just do Finance to diversify their degree. Add on to that that many PPA students know and understand that the graduate professors will give a B for just showing up to class and you have some pretty unmotivated students.

I was Group 7 finance track and currently work for a hedge fund in Dallas. I think either path is a winner. I will say the MS-Finance on the degree probably helped me get my current job and the one I had at Bear Stearns, for no other reason than it showed the interviewers a history of interest in the finance industry.

If your mind works the way it needs to take advantage of an MIS track, it has its positives, as well. If you go that route, make sure that you are VERY well versed in Visual Basic and SQL. Those are both fairly basic languages, but they'll get your foot in the door at just about any place that needs accountants who can converse with the "coders."

Just don't do the Audit track if you can possibly help it.

I agree 100% with Jeff, the audit track seems worthless unless you know you want to be a career auditor.

So what would you suggest someone that does PPA Finance do after graduation?

I would sugggest commercial or investment banking if they actually want to use their finance degree. Or they could do public accounting (most likely audit). Or they could do management consulting or corporate finance. There are lots of options for any of the PPA tracks.

Look into an internship in I-Banking before jumping in full-bore. Just my $.02. It offers great opportunities, but it carries a heavy personal cost.

Honestly, it depends on where you live and what you want to do. Most PPA program grads (including finance track) are going to start off in public accounting. The main question is going to be where you go from there. You can make a leap directly to the Front Office from Public Accounting, but it's tough without contacts. Most people take jobs in Operations, make the contacts, and then make the leap. If you just want to work in accounting, but do accounting for a financial services company, there's a growing number of hedge funds and private equity firms in the DFW area. On top of that, there are a number of large mortgage backed players in the DFW area, as well.

are there alot of careers with a ppa finance where you can work a stable 40-50 a week and still make a decent amount (40-50g) amount of money a year?
It seems to me like everyone is saying the finance related jobs require ALOT of hours, i wouldnt mind working 50 but i think too much more would definitely be pushing it

[This message has been edited by bwill0509 (edited 1/20/2007 6:28p).]

If you wanted to work 40-50 hours a week and make 50+ you should have been an engineer..

Lots of corporate jobs make $40-50k. I have a friend who started out at $60k at AT&T in their leadership development program. The problem is that upward mobility isnt very good at most corporate jobs. Also, if you want to do investment banking, I agree with Jeff that you need to REALLY know thats what you want to do. Obviously, an internship is the best way to figure that out.

http://careercenter.tamu.edu/guides/reports/SalarySurvey/2006/Spring/Salary%20Survey%20Results%20for%20Texas%20A&M%20University%20Post%20Graduation%20PlansbrSpring%202006%20(Generated%2007-26-2006).htm

I'm not sure what the point of that post is. It does show that the average acct/finc/info undergrad makes about $47-50k. Most of those people go to corporate jobs working 40 hours a week.

Finance.

what would you suggest for someone that has about 2 years of public accounting experience (audit) and doesnt really like what they do...i have a CPA and did the finance track. Im thinking I would want to move to wealth management, investment mgmt, mgmt consulting or some other consulting job. I want to do something different from public acct, but I dont really know where to start. Also my finance/skills knowledge could be a little rusty and I would have no experience in that field, so could that hurt my chances with the transition if I applied for such jobs?

[This message has been edited by byron06 (edited 1/30/2007 2:01p).]

I am surprised there aren't more responses about what to do after PPA. There is so much about the PPA but so little about what you do when you are done with the Big 4...I was curious about this as well just for my knowledge..

Stonana, most people who do public accounting move into industry in the companies finance/accounting jobs. Some go on to consulting. Some go to other financial service jobs. About half of them stay in public accounting though. Here are some statistics:

http://acct.tamu.edu/ppa/statistics.html

[This message has been edited by byron06 (edited 1/30/2007 9:35p).]

I was group 7, MIS track. I've never done the accounting thing ... went straight into consulting. I have been straight IT ever since for the most part. Never took the CPA exam ... I'm probably really skewing the statistics! I went with a really small consulting firm which is obviously not what most people do. Worked for me .... I've rarely ever worked more than 40-50 hours a week ... no travel an I made 6 figures last year.

I wouldn't worry about what you make the first couple of years out of school. Pay more attention to whatever you'll be making a few more years out of school. These years are to get experience. Go for finance if that's what you're interested in, MIS if you think you have a knack for it.

I will say this though ... as far as MIS track options since I know about it. I have been a developer/database person the whole time out of school more or less. There's only so far you can go on this track. Eventually you'll have to be a manager/project manager (ie professional metting attendee) to take a major salary jump if you go straight IT/consulting. Then you won't really be doing what attracted you to IT in the first place.

This program is just a way to get the degrees you need and sit for the CPA if you need it. After that you will figure out month by month what you realy want to do.