Delta settles this for $50 million and does not have to admit liability or wrongdoing. My understanding is that the pilots followed proper protocol to get the aircraft to a safe landing weight and that the dumped fuel atomizes and evaporates. I'm not seeing the harm here suffered by plaintiffs. What's the take of those involved in commercial heavy jet operations?
[url=https://www.wsbtv.com/news/local/atlanta/delta-air-lines-settles-lawsuit-after-plane-dumps-jet-fuel-midflight-over-major-city/FIPBZ3WKLJCO5DZHQYASU5H434/][/url]
https://www.wsbtv.com/news/local/atlanta/delta-air-lines-settles-lawsuit-after-plane-dumps-jet-fuel-midflight-over-major-city/FIPBZ3WKLJCO5DZHQYASU5H434/

stetson said:

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the dumped fuel atomizes and evaporates

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I thought the same. I know there is a certain altitude requirement for this. Perhaps the aircraft had serious thrust issues and couldn't attain necessary altitude - forcing them to chose between dumping lower or landing at an unsafe weight? I assume the devil is in some sort of detail like that.

I get the point of class action suits, though. It's more of a deterrent for bad behavior. The cost of bringing individual suits is so high and a burden on the court system, and for claims under a certain amount it's pointless.

Silent For Too Long said:

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ErnestEndeavor said:

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The four teachers who brought the suit were working at an elementary school when the dump happened. They will be guaranteed $15,000 each. About 13,000 other people have submitted claims thus far and will split $50.59 million, so about $3900 each which will inevitably go down as more people make claims (assuming more can join the settlement).

The lawyers will get $24 million.

So yeah, typical class action lawsuit to make a law firm a bunch of money.

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It really is insane that our justice system allows for this insanity.

You want to solve our affordability crisis? Get rid of all your ambulance chasers.

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Your first mistake…it's not a justice system. It's a legal system. Sometimes the result is just, and sometimes it's not. Either way, the system is still the best in the world, easily.

ThunderCougarFalconBird said:

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stetson said:

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the dumped fuel atomizes and evaporates

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I thought the same. I know there is a certain altitude requirement for this. Perhaps the aircraft had serious thrust issues and couldn't attain necessary altitude - forcing them to chose between dumping lower or landing at an unsafe weight? I assume the devil is in some sort of detail like that.

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Plus the dispersion would lower the concentration of any jet fuel component to parts per trillion or lower (i.e. undetectable).

If I had a dollar for every pound of jet fuel I ve dumped I could buy texags. It atomizes above 5000 feet. Or so they told me.

ErnestEndeavor said:

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I get the point of class action suits, though. It's more of a deterrent for bad behavior. The cost of bringing individual suits is so high and a burden on the court system, and for claims under a certain amount it's pointless.

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I'm sorry, but the BS money grabbing class action suit nonsense that only enriches the lawyers does far more damage than the potential good the scenario you paint does in my opinion. We ALL pay the price for these suits in increased costs of everything just to feed the greed of scumbag lawyers.

Can't wait for the next emergency landing that crashes 100 yards short of the runway because they weren't allowed to dump fuel. Our society is dumb.

I didn't remember this at all. Looks like it happened January 14, 2020 - so before I moved back to LA and 12 days before Kobe died.

https://ktla.com/news/delta-fuel-dump-settlement-los-angeles-schools-2020/

Quote:

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Delta Flight 89

The incident happened on Jan. 14, 2020, when, shortly after takeoff, a Delta flight en route to Shanghai "lost thrust" and had to return to LAX due to an engine issue.

While making its emergency return, Delta Flight 89 dumped up to 15,000 gallons of fuel over densely populated areas, hitting cities and schools, around 11:47 a.m. that day.

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Also

Quote:

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The flight carried about 167 passengers and crew aboard a Boeing 777

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That's not a lot of folks on a Triple 7.

6 weeks after that, I was on a Singapore Airlines A350 from LAX-SIN with no joke, 34 people on the entire plane.

So it looks like travel was already slowing pretty significantly even in January.

Silent For Too Long said:

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ErnestEndeavor said:

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The four teachers who brought the suit were working at an elementary school when the dump happened. They will be guaranteed $15,000 each. About 13,000 other people have submitted claims thus far and will split $50.59 million, so about $3900 each which will inevitably go down as more people make claims (assuming more can join the settlement).

The lawyers will get $24 million.

So yeah, typical class action lawsuit to make a law firm a bunch of money.

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It really is insane that our justice system allows for this insanity.

You want to solve our affordability crisis? Get rid of all your ambulance chasers.

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It's called tort reform. And Texas has done this.

I have issues with spurious lawsuits and support tort reform. That said, considering Delta settled, I think there's a good chance they didn't want discovery snooping around their maintenance practices.

Just because the pilot followed procedure doesn't relieve anyone from the consequences of the full scenario.

But what were the consequences? What harm was done to the plaintiffs? Don't plaintiffs have to show harm?

AgPres06 said:

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I have issues with spurious lawsuits and support tort reform. That said, considering Delta settled, I think there's a good chance they didn't want discovery snooping around their maintenance practices.

Just because the pilot followed procedure doesn't relieve anyone from the consequences of the full scenario.

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There's more likely a chance that focus groups showed that the ensuing lawsuit, cost of defense, likely outcome of a jury in California, and likely outcome of an appeal in California all showed that settling for 50 million was significantly cheaper in the long term.

Logos Stick said:

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They lost thrust in one engine and had to make an emergency landing. The FAA investigated and cleared the pilots of wrongdoing. This was a money grab.

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That's America. Until the tort laws change to align with damn near every country in the world we will always have these lawsuits. There's no downside for the plaintiffs.

DrEvazanPhD said:

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AgPres06 said:

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I have issues with spurious lawsuits and support tort reform. That said, considering Delta settled, I think there's a good chance they didn't want discovery snooping around their maintenance practices.

Just because the pilot followed procedure doesn't relieve anyone from the consequences of the full scenario.

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There's more likely a chance that focus groups showed that the ensuing lawsuit, cost of defense, likely outcome of a jury in California, and likely outcome of an appeal in California all showed that settling for 50 million was significantly cheaper in the long term.

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I get that...
But it also sends a message that you'll fight claims that you believe are without merit. The message that the win got the pantie will be costly is the deterrence

Silent For Too Long said:

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ErnestEndeavor said:

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The four teachers who brought the suit were working at an elementary school when the dump happened. They will be guaranteed $15,000 each. About 13,000 other people have submitted claims thus far and will split $50.59 million, so about $3900 each which will inevitably go down as more people make claims (assuming more can join the settlement).

The lawyers will get $24 million.

So yeah, typical class action lawsuit to make a law firm a bunch of money.

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It really is insane that our justice system allows for this insanity.

You want to solve our affordability crisis? Get rid of all your ambulance chasers.

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First of all, I don't do Plaintiff's work -- at least not Plaintiff's PI, so I don't have a dog here. I'd be more likely to be defending this as I've done some Class Action defense work in my time but not in a while. Some of the ones I worked on were truly frivolous while others, at least arguably, weren't.

But second, forget the merits of THIS case (and I'll agree it is, at the very least, questionable). What about cases where there truly is merit and multiple litigants making class certification the most JUDICIALLY economic means of resolution? How do you propose the attorneys get paid and make it worthwhile for them to take on these cases?

Or, are you just saying, screw any potential victims in that case, especially those that aren't IMMEDIATELY aware of their injuries or where those injuries may have come from?

Basing policy, or even opinions, on one bad example is never a good idea. It would be a LITTLE like the left claiming the Westboro "baptist" idiots speaking for the SBC.