LA Times: Are The Unvaccinated Still a Danger to the Rest of Us?

3,921 Views | 40 Replies | Last: 1 yr ago by waitwhat?
Rapier108
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Quote:

For almost two years, COVID-19 vaccine holdouts have been the objects of earnest pleading and financial inducements, of social-media shaming and truth campaigns. They've missed weddings, birthday celebrations and recitals, and even forfeited high-stakes athletic competitions. Until last month, they were barred from entering the United States and more than 100 other countries.

Now the unvaccinated are suddenly back in the mix. They're dining in restaurants, rocking out at music festivals and filling the stands at sporting venues. They mingle freely in places where they used to be shunned for fear they'd seed superspreader events.

It's as if they're no longer hazardous to the rest of us. Or are they?

"Clearly, the unvaccinated are a threat to themselves," said Dr. Jeffrey Shaman, an infectious disease specialist at Columbia University. As recently as August, their risk of dying of COVID-19 was six times higher than for people who were fully vaccinated and eight times higher than for people who were vaccinated and boosted, according to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention.

But, Shaman acknowledged, "the danger to the rest of us is a more debatable issue."

When public officials imposed vaccine mandates, the unvaccinated certainly appeared to pose demonstrable dangers to their communities.

State and local leaders sought not only to suppress spread of the virus, but also to prevent their healthcare systems from being overwhelmed, degrading care for all. The unvaccinated made those goals harder to achieve since they were more likely to become infected and, when they did, to require hospitalization.

U.S. officials had long hoped to vaccinate the American public into a state of "herd immunity," in which so few people would be vulnerable to the virus that the outbreak would simply sputter out. That objective assumed a uniformly high uptake of vaccine across the nation. It also assumed a vaccine that protected against reinfection, and did so durably.

<snip>

The country's mainstay vaccines from Pfizer-BioNTech and Moderna do not construct a force field around recipients that shields them from ever becoming infected with the coronavirus. Nor do they prevent a person with a breakthrough infection from spreading the virus to others.

However, the vaccines appear to reduce the amount of virus a sick person sheds by coughing, sneezing or simply talking. That means unvaccinated people are not only more likely to be infected, but also somewhat more likely to spread it to others.

It would be hard to assert that if everyone were vaccinated, the coronavirus would just go to ground. This pathogen has proved adept at finding ways around our vaccine protection and is likely to remain a presence among us for generations to come, like influenza and HIV.

But the unvaccinated and undervaccinated are almost certainly playing an outsized role in the coronavirus' continued success, experts say. Exactly how much is hard to pinpoint. Scientists can quantify transmission differences between the vaccinated and the unvaccinated in the lab. Applying those differences to the real world is much trickier, especially in a population as immunologically diverse as Americans now are.

Finally, there's concern that unvaccinated and undervaccinated Americans could accelerate the emergence of new coronavirus variants, some of which are bound to be even more transmissible or more adept at evading existing COVID-19 vaccines and therapies. Either or both would cause new waves of transmission and illness.

While it's a theoretical possibility, the unvaccinated are not prolific incubators of genetic variants. People with immune system deficiencies are much more likely to develop the long-running bouts of COVID-19 that can spawn new variants with concerning mutations, and most of them are vaccinated.

COVID-19 surges promote the emergence of variants. By virtue of the sheer number of people infected, a surge increases the number of times the virus replicates and offers it more chances to mutate. If it drives hospitalizations, it will ensnare patients being treated for immune-compromising conditions such as HIV, cancer and organ transplants.

And as the unvaccinated are joined by ever-larger numbers of people who are undervaccinated, surges become a more plausible prospect.

People routinely confuse their communities' state of immunity with their own vulnerability, said Dr. Peter Hotez, co-director of the Center for Vaccine Development at Texas Children's Hospital and dean of Baylor College of Medicine's National School of Tropical Medicine. When fewer of their neighbors are getting sick and dying, and high vaccination rates have suppressed COVID-19, even the unvaccinated feel invulnerable.

"That could be a lethal mistake," he warned.
https://www.latimes.com/science/story/2022-11-03/are-the-unvaccinated-still-a-danger-to-the-rest-of-us-covid

Of course we are, but not because of the virus. We are because we refused to bend the knee to the tyrants, Coronakarens, Branch Covidians, and the rest who would have loved to put us into camps or even killed us outright.
Dr. Mephisto
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AG
The insane bias in that article makes it hard to take the author seriously.

I'd say I'm surprised, but I'm not.
YouBet
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AG
1. The only people I know who left the mix are the hyper-covidians who refuse to rejoin society. The unvaccinaated have been out and about this entire time in red states. Does this author not realize we weren't all locked down like their autocratic blue states.

2. The unvaccinated spreading new variants seems to be a lie as well. We've all read about leaky vaccines causing new variants; not the unvaccinated.
DrEvazanPhD
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I love the tone.

"These inbred fools, unclean and ignorant, ignoring the god of science, questioning their betters…"
rocky the dog
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AG
Elections are when people find out what politicians stand for, and politicians find out what people will fall for.
AggieUSMC
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Quote:

LA Times: Are The Unvaccinated Still a Danger to the Rest of Us?
What do you mean "still"? They never were.
waitwhat?
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Big Pharma is really trying to squeeze every last penny out of the pandemic.

"Unvaccinated are 6x more likely to die than vaccinated" you'll excuse me if I'm not concerned about 6x more likely than extremely unlikely.
" 'People that read with pictures think that it's simply about a mask' - Dana Loesch" - Ban Cow Gas

"Truth is treason in the empire of lies." - Dr. Ron Paul

Big Tech IS the empire of lies

TEXIT
titan
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S
Dr. Mephisto said:

The insane bias in that article makes it hard to take the author seriously.

I'd say I'm surprised, but I'm not.
Right.

Not even a decimal fraction as much a danger as the Mainstream News Media.

Fortunately more than half now realize that.
rocky the dog
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AG
Quote:

Big Pharma is really trying to squeeze every last penny out of the pandemic.

Elections are when people find out what politicians stand for, and politicians find out what people will fall for.
zoneag
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These are the people we're supposed to forgive?
AGHouston11
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waitwhat? said:

Big Pharma is really trying to squeeze every last penny out of the pandemic.

"Unvaccinated are 6x more likely to die than vaccinated" you'll excuse me if I'm not concerned about 6x more likely than extremely unlikely.


They have the new "updated booster" they need to push !
Of course
Ellis Wyatt
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Quote:

Dr. Jeffrey Shaman
Aptly named.
titan
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S
zoneag said:

These are the people we're supposed to forgive?
BINGO. Someone needs to point the Atlantice writer to the LA Times.

Democrats and Leftists are STILL pushing covid restrictions -- nothing has gone away where they will have the say. They need to be booted from power positions next Tuesday.
Dr. Mephisto
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Keep seeing commercials saying "This show sponsored by Pfizer", or "Brought to you by Moderna," followed by "get your updated booster today!"

How about you take the boosters?

All of them?

All at once?

Thanks, but I like my heart beating, my blood circulating, and my embolisms non-existent.

But we will watch for the next year the news story of your "unexpected" demise at such a young age.
lb3
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AG
We should be asking if the vaxxed are a danger to the unvaxxed:

Quote:

A COVID-19 booster, specifically a third vaccine dose, may lower protection against getting infected with the omicron variant again for some people and there's a reason why, new findings suggest.

Read more at: https://www.miamiherald.com/news/coronavirus/article268224827.html#storylink=cpy
Ernest Tucker
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AG
Article is full of "almost certainly" and "appears".

That sounds real scientific, effing tyrants
beanbean
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Quote:

Now the unvaccinated are suddenly back in the mix. They're dining in restaurants, rocking out at music festivals and filling the stands at sporting venues. They mingle freely in places where they used to be shunned for fear they'd seed superspreader events.

It's as if they're no longer hazardous to the rest of us. Or are they?
LOL. I remember when Sturgis 2020 was supposed to turn out as a superspreader event. That aged well. Also hilarious is the "They're dining in restaurants.....places where they used to be shunned" part. Tells you all you need to know that this is an LA Times article. LA county that required people to show proof of vax to enter restaurants up until April 2022. Out of touch, living in their liberal bubble. I live in Oklahoma and we could eat in restaurants again in May of 2020 and never had to show proof of vax anywhere. Somehow we're all still alive though.

aggiejim70
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AG
Question is, in California, does one have to show proof of vaccination in order to vote?
The person that is not willing to fight and die, if need be, for his country has no right to life.

James Earl Rudder '32
January 31, 1945
Maroon Dawn
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Remember when Concerned Moderate, just a few days ago, said it was ridiculous to claim that Dems aren't done with COVID, are only ignoring it for the election but if they somehow regained power will immediately go back to mandating masks, jabs and lockdowns?

Pepperidge Farms remembers
titan
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S
Maroon Dawn said:

Remember when Concerned Moderate, just a few days ago, said it was ridiculous to claim that Dems aren't done with COVID, are only ignoring it for the election but if they somehow regained power will immediately go back to trying to masks, mandates and lockdowns?

Pepperidge Farms remembers
More like many hours? I thought it was just yesterday?

Yes....
samurai_science
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Are we still a danger, I HOPE SO. That's one of the benefits!
HollywoodBQ
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AG
aggiejim70 said:

Question is, in California, does one have to show proof of vaccination in order to vote?
No

Even California isn't willing to try that Shiite on the red blooded voters who attend the in person voting locations.
oldarmyjess66
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Will these covid morons ever stop?
Muktheduck
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oldarmyjess66 said:

Will these covid morons ever stop?


Why would they stop? This has been an incredible success for them. They didn't even need a real threat and they managed to convince/coerce a gigantic chunk of the country to inject something that literally rewrites your dna. There's a lot of morons but the people running this know exactly what they're doing

They couldn't have possibly imagined this dry run would go so well. Even among the anti-vax crowd, nobody seems all that freaked out about the mRNA injection stuff. That has the potential to be so much more than a vaccine, it's a gene editor
ThreatLevel: Midnight
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AggieUSMC said:

Quote:

LA Times: Are The Unvaccinated Still a Danger to the Rest of Us?
What do you mean "still"? They never were.
I disagree.


I think the vaccinated that were so quick to judge & condemn the stubborn, pig headed, selfish, etc. unvaxxxxed are now in more danger than ever. An environment of increasing danger by their own creation.

To paraphrase Heisenberg: "...you clearly don't know who you're talking to, so let me clue you in. I am not in danger. I am the danger! A guy opens his mouth and gets Covid, and you think that of me?
No! I am the one who coughs!"
Thanks & Gig 'Em
LegalDrugPusher
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And they think people die from Covid? Lol

I have never gotten Covid, had meals with Covid people,,traveled with them etc.
NonReg85
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AG
I've had COVID twice. My sypmtoms were less than mild cold both times. I'm also vaxed and boosted. Ive had zero adverse affects from the shots.
Tony Franklins Other Shoe
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Have a friend that was admitted for a stroke yesterday, yes, vaxxed and boosted. He's also had covid run through his house a couple of times already. I'm not going to say without a doubt the vax and booster is the source of the stroke, but I'm going to stay very skeptical of the shot since there were no other leading signs based on his previous medical history.

Person Not Capable of Pregnancy
Mville Ag
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I don't know if I ever had Covid. Never took a test or injection of experimental gene therapy.
JamesPShelley
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Rapier108 said:

Quote:

"Clearly, the unvaccinated are a threat to themselves," said Dr. Jeffrey Shaman, an infectious disease specialist at Columbia University. As recently as August, their risk of dying of COVID-19 was six times higher than for people who were fully vaccinated and eight times higher than for people who were vaccinated and boosted, according to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention.

But, Shaman acknowledged, "the danger to the rest of us is a more debatable issue."



Really? Doctor Shaman? Can't make that **** up. **** him.
cevans_40
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Neehau writes for the LA times. Who knew?
bmks270
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Okay, totally ignored are the many people who did not get vaccinated, and also recovered from COVID. Which at this point is mostly everyone vaxxed or not.

Pookers
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NonReg85 said:

I've had COVID twice. My sypmtoms were less than mild cold both times. I'm also vaxed and boosted. Ive had zero adverse affects from the shots.
That you know of. But hopefully you're correct.
William K. Klingaman
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Everyone I work with who are getting sick are heavily vaccinated
Pookers
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William K. Klingaman said:

Everyone I work with who are getting sick are heavily vaccinated
Same thing here.
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