Good Biden: US just decapitated Chinese semiconductor industry

9,383 Views | 99 Replies | Last: 3 yr ago by BAP Enthusiast
BAP Enthusiast
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https://www.csis.org/analysis/choking-chinas-access-future-ai

Quote:

On October 7, 2022, the Biden administration announced a new export controls policy on artificial intelligence (AI) and semiconductor technologies to China. These new controlsa genuine landmark in U.S.-China relationsprovide the complete picture after a partial disclosure in early September generated confusion. For weeks the Biden administration has been receiving criticism in many quarters for a new round of semiconductor export control restrictions, first disclosed on September 1. The restrictions block leading U.S. AI computer chip designers, such as Nvidia and AMD, from selling their high-end chips for AI and supercomputing to China.


Quote:

There are four interlocking elements of the new policy targeting different segments of the semiconductor value chain, and all elements must be understood simultaneously to grasp the scope of what the Biden administration plans on achieving. In short, the Biden administration is trying to (1) strangle the Chinese AI industry by choking off access to high-end AI chips; (2) block China from designing AI chips domestically by choking off China's access to U.S.-made chip design software; (3) block China from manufacturing advanced chips by choking off access to U.S.-built semiconductor manufacturing equipment; and (4) block China from domestically producing semiconductor manufacturing equipment by choking off access to U.S.-built components.


Twitter thread on the new policy:



This will send China back to the 1980s. They don't have the local expertise nor manufacturing capability to make anything on their own. This is basically Trump's policy amped up 10x.

I'll give credit where it's due, this was a very good decision by the Biden administration here.
UTExan
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About 20 years overdue.
“If you’re going to have crime it should at least be organized crime”
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BCG Disciple
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Back to the 80s? This is a temporary setback. China will just steal the tech and continue. May set them back 2 years.

Still, I like being touch on China - agree on credit here.
BAP Enthusiast
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BCG Disciple said:

Back to the 80s? This is a temporary setback. China will just steal the tech and continue. May set them back 2 years.

Still, I like being touch on China - agree on credit here.


They literally don't have access to any of the tech necessary tools produce what they need. Without American expertise their industry is dead in the water.

For all intents and purposes this is a nuke we just launched at their industry.
Agvet12
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So China defaulted on the big man's 10%, interesting


But good move Biden - so far the only one
Burrus86
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Even a blind pig (Biden) finds an acorn every once in a while.
Secolobo
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No, they are all just able to capitalize on insider trading. Making money from that than what the Chinese would give them.
BusterAg
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I think many people overestimate our cyber security capabilities in the U.S.
It takes a special kind of brainwashed useful idiot to politically defend government fraud, waste, and abuse.
TheEternalPessimist
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BAP Enthusiast said:

https://www.csis.org/analysis/choking-chinas-access-future-ai

Quote:

On October 7, 2022, the Biden administration announced a new export controls policy on artificial intelligence (AI) and semiconductor technologies to China. These new controlsa genuine landmark in U.S.-China relationsprovide the complete picture after a partial disclosure in early September generated confusion. For weeks the Biden administration has been receiving criticism in many quarters for a new round of semiconductor export control restrictions, first disclosed on September 1. The restrictions block leading U.S. AI computer chip designers, such as Nvidia and AMD, from selling their high-end chips for AI and supercomputing to China.


Quote:

There are four interlocking elements of the new policy targeting different segments of the semiconductor value chain, and all elements must be understood simultaneously to grasp the scope of what the Biden administration plans on achieving. In short, the Biden administration is trying to (1) strangle the Chinese AI industry by choking off access to high-end AI chips; (2) block China from designing AI chips domestically by choking off China's access to U.S.-made chip design software; (3) block China from manufacturing advanced chips by choking off access to U.S.-built semiconductor manufacturing equipment; and (4) block China from domestically producing semiconductor manufacturing equipment by choking off access to U.S.-built components.


Twitter thread on the new policy:



This will send China back to the 1980s. They don't have the local expertise nor manufacturing capability to make anything on their own. This is basically Trump's policy amped up 10x.

I'll give credit where it's due, this was a very good decision by the Biden administration here.
I am supposed to congratulate peepaw for what he is supposed to do?
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"The Kingdom is for HE that can TAKE IT!" - Alexander
Omperlodge
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Chinese companies that violate US patents should be prohibited from selling to Americans. If that same company sells to a third party that then sells to an American, thay can be held liable for selling a product that violates US patents. If a company operates within the United States and sells products that violate US patents outside the United States, you should be held liable.
BAP Enthusiast
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BCG Disciple
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BAP Enthusiast said:

BCG Disciple said:

Back to the 80s? This is a temporary setback. China will just steal the tech and continue. May set them back 2 years.

Still, I like being touch on China - agree on credit here.


They literally don't have access to any of the tech necessary tools produce what they need. Without American expertise their industry is dead in the water.

For all intents and purposes this is a nuke we just launched at their industry.

I get that you're saying that and you probably believe it. There is a laundry list of foreign semi conductor manufacturing in China as well as domestic. Very easy to steal what's there.
FriskyGardenGnome
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BAP Enthusiast said:

BCG Disciple said:

Back to the 80s? This is a temporary setback. China will just steal the tech and continue. May set them back 2 years.

Still, I like being touch on China - agree on credit here.


They literally don't have access to any of the tech necessary tools produce what they need. Without American expertise their industry is dead in the water.

For all intents and purposes this is a nuke we just launched at their industry.


Does Taiwan have such expertise and equipment?
justcallmeharry
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Burrus86 said:

Even a blind pig's puppet masters find an acorn every once in a while.
If you think I am a liberal, you are incorrect. Assume sarcasm on my part. Sorry if something I post has already been posted. Just the way it is!!
Jack Squat 83
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Making the USA better (so far) has played no part in any of FJBs actions foreign or domestic since he took office. This sounds like a 180.

Something has to be up with this behind the scenes. Sorry.
I don't think you know me.
Burdizzo
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Is this going to slow down delivery of my Ford Bronco?
Owlagdad
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BusterAg said:

I think many people overestimate our cyber security capabilities in the U.S.
...and underestimate how many geeky professors and politicians we have that like some Chinese poontang in exchange for secrets.
BAP Enthusiast
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BCG Disciple said:

BAP Enthusiast said:

BCG Disciple said:

Back to the 80s? This is a temporary setback. China will just steal the tech and continue. May set them back 2 years.

Still, I like being touch on China - agree on credit here.


They literally don't have access to any of the tech necessary tools produce what they need. Without American expertise their industry is dead in the water.

For all intents and purposes this is a nuke we just launched at their industry.

I get that you're saying that and you probably believe it. There is a laundry list of foreign semi conductor manufacturing in China as well as domestic. Very easy to steal what's there.

China manufactures zero high end processors. We have never allowed them access or produced any high end chips there. They are far behind at the upper end.

What we got from China was low to middle tier stuff that is used for toys and other cheap goods. We were already in the process of removing these from China and moving them to other Asian countries.

They are screwed.
Shoefly!
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So does this move make Nvidia stock go up? There's some politicians that bought a large amount of Nvidia 3 months ago.
BAP Enthusiast
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Shoefly! said:

So does this move make Nvidia stock go up? There's some politicians that bought a large amount of Nvidia 3 months ago.


Probably yeah, they knew this was coming.
Omperlodge
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Shoefly! said:

So does this move make Nvidia stock go up? There's some politicians that bought a large amount of Nvidia 3 months ago.

Paul Pelosi is going to be celebrating tonight in SF. Best to stay off the roads.
fightingfarmer09
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Pressure will build and Hunter Biden will be the only one granted an exemption.
Fireman
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Another checkers move by Biden, while most of the world is playing 4D chess. What's going to happen to NVDA and AMD, when China tells them to pound sand when they try to acquire rare earth metals from China necessary to produce the AI chips?
newbie11
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BAP Enthusiast said:

https://www.csis.org/analysis/choking-chinas-access-future-ai

Quote:

On October 7, 2022, the Biden administration announced a new export controls policy on artificial intelligence (AI) and semiconductor technologies to China. These new controlsa genuine landmark in U.S.-China relationsprovide the complete picture after a partial disclosure in early September generated confusion. For weeks the Biden administration has been receiving criticism in many quarters for a new round of semiconductor export control restrictions, first disclosed on September 1. The restrictions block leading U.S. AI computer chip designers, such as Nvidia and AMD, from selling their high-end chips for AI and supercomputing to China.


Quote:

There are four interlocking elements of the new policy targeting different segments of the semiconductor value chain, and all elements must be understood simultaneously to grasp the scope of what the Biden administration plans on achieving. In short, the Biden administration is trying to (1) strangle the Chinese AI industry by choking off access to high-end AI chips; (2) block China from designing AI chips domestically by choking off China's access to U.S.-made chip design software; (3) block China from manufacturing advanced chips by choking off access to U.S.-built semiconductor manufacturing equipment; and (4) block China from domestically producing semiconductor manufacturing equipment by choking off access to U.S.-built components.


Twitter thread on the new policy:



This will send China back to the 1980s. They don't have the local expertise nor manufacturing capability to make anything on their own. This is basically Trump's policy amped up 10x.

I'll give credit where it's due, this was a very good decision by the Biden administration here.
And in return, China will cut off our supply of rare elements crippling our entire economy.
BarnacleBill
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There is no good Biden. I'm sure there is some insider angle that motivated this.
BAP Enthusiast
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newbie11 said:

BAP Enthusiast said:

https://www.csis.org/analysis/choking-chinas-access-future-ai

Quote:

On October 7, 2022, the Biden administration announced a new export controls policy on artificial intelligence (AI) and semiconductor technologies to China. These new controlsa genuine landmark in U.S.-China relationsprovide the complete picture after a partial disclosure in early September generated confusion. For weeks the Biden administration has been receiving criticism in many quarters for a new round of semiconductor export control restrictions, first disclosed on September 1. The restrictions block leading U.S. AI computer chip designers, such as Nvidia and AMD, from selling their high-end chips for AI and supercomputing to China.


Quote:

There are four interlocking elements of the new policy targeting different segments of the semiconductor value chain, and all elements must be understood simultaneously to grasp the scope of what the Biden administration plans on achieving. In short, the Biden administration is trying to (1) strangle the Chinese AI industry by choking off access to high-end AI chips; (2) block China from designing AI chips domestically by choking off China's access to U.S.-made chip design software; (3) block China from manufacturing advanced chips by choking off access to U.S.-built semiconductor manufacturing equipment; and (4) block China from domestically producing semiconductor manufacturing equipment by choking off access to U.S.-built components.


Twitter thread on the new policy:



This will send China back to the 1980s. They don't have the local expertise nor manufacturing capability to make anything on their own. This is basically Trump's policy amped up 10x.

I'll give credit where it's due, this was a very good decision by the Biden administration here.
And in return, China will cut off our supply of rare elements crippling our entire economy.


We can get that supply elsewhere, China is not the only global source for rare earth metals.
BAP Enthusiast
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BarnacleBill said:

There is no good Biden. I'm sure there is some insider angle that motivated this.




The angle is that the military industrial complex has been screaming at the Feds that maintaining domestic production is absolutely critical to American military success. Seems like they finally broke through. I don't doubt that this has been in the works since before Trump left office.
BarnacleBill
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I hope you're right. I would like to think that this is truly beneficial to the US. I'm just way too cynical now
YouBet
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newbie11 said:

BAP Enthusiast said:

https://www.csis.org/analysis/choking-chinas-access-future-ai

Quote:

On October 7, 2022, the Biden administration announced a new export controls policy on artificial intelligence (AI) and semiconductor technologies to China. These new controlsa genuine landmark in U.S.-China relationsprovide the complete picture after a partial disclosure in early September generated confusion. For weeks the Biden administration has been receiving criticism in many quarters for a new round of semiconductor export control restrictions, first disclosed on September 1. The restrictions block leading U.S. AI computer chip designers, such as Nvidia and AMD, from selling their high-end chips for AI and supercomputing to China.


Quote:

There are four interlocking elements of the new policy targeting different segments of the semiconductor value chain, and all elements must be understood simultaneously to grasp the scope of what the Biden administration plans on achieving. In short, the Biden administration is trying to (1) strangle the Chinese AI industry by choking off access to high-end AI chips; (2) block China from designing AI chips domestically by choking off China's access to U.S.-made chip design software; (3) block China from manufacturing advanced chips by choking off access to U.S.-built semiconductor manufacturing equipment; and (4) block China from domestically producing semiconductor manufacturing equipment by choking off access to U.S.-built components.


Twitter thread on the new policy:



This will send China back to the 1980s. They don't have the local expertise nor manufacturing capability to make anything on their own. This is basically Trump's policy amped up 10x.

I'll give credit where it's due, this was a very good decision by the Biden administration here.
And in return, China will cut off our supply of rare elements crippling our entire economy.
Silver linings: maybe this will cripple Biden's mandate to kill ICE vehicles and move everyone to EV's.
LOYAL AG
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Fireman said:

Another checkers move by Biden, while most of the world is playing 4D chess. What's going to happen to NVDA and AMD, when China tells them to pound sand when they try to acquire rare earth metals from China necessary to produce the AI chips?


You do realize those aren't actually rare, right? The question for this is the same as most other manufacturing questions. Will the EPA let Americans use America's natural resources to make the things we need to make. If the answer is no then we need China for this. If it's yes we don't. China doesn't do much we can't do here, they do a lot of things we don't want to do here. Chinese manufacturing is effectively NIMBY on a global scale.
Get Off My Lawn
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My understanding was generally that cheap chips were made in china, mid level chips are made in Taiwan, and cutting edge stuff is still made in America.

If that's the case, then does restricting high end chips from China really do much?
LMCane
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BAP Enthusiast said:

https://www.csis.org/analysis/choking-chinas-access-future-ai

Quote:

On October 7, 2022, the Biden administration announced a new export controls policy on artificial intelligence (AI) and semiconductor technologies to China. These new controlsa genuine landmark in U.S.-China relationsprovide the complete picture after a partial disclosure in early September generated confusion. For weeks the Biden administration has been receiving criticism in many quarters for a new round of semiconductor export control restrictions, first disclosed on September 1. The restrictions block leading U.S. AI computer chip designers, such as Nvidia and AMD, from selling their high-end chips for AI and supercomputing to China.


Quote:

There are four interlocking elements of the new policy targeting different segments of the semiconductor value chain, and all elements must be understood simultaneously to grasp the scope of what the Biden administration plans on achieving. In short, the Biden administration is trying to (1) strangle the Chinese AI industry by choking off access to high-end AI chips; (2) block China from designing AI chips domestically by choking off China's access to U.S.-made chip design software; (3) block China from manufacturing advanced chips by choking off access to U.S.-built semiconductor manufacturing equipment; and (4) block China from domestically producing semiconductor manufacturing equipment by choking off access to U.S.-built components.


Twitter thread on the new policy:



This will send China back to the 1980s. They don't have the local expertise nor manufacturing capability to make anything on their own. This is basically Trump's policy amped up 10x.

I'll give credit where it's due, this was a very good decision by the Biden administration here.


OR the Chicoms will simply invade Taiwan and take 70% of the worldwide supply of chips.

"President Roosevelt, you cutting off Japanese oil in 1941 is a brilliant plan! Just make sure we put all of our Air Force planes on one runway in Oahu lined up in nice rows!!"
American Hardwood
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Give Biden credit? If asked to define semi-conductor, he would probably guess it's a new flavor of Ben & Jerry's.
Philip J Fry
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Where is the media here? They did nothing but hand wring about Trump's trade war with China.
Burdizzo
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Shoefly! said:

So does this move make Nvidia stock go up? There's some politicians that bought a large amount of Nvidia 3 months ago.



Gee. Why would a politician with potential inside information on the currency of the world's biggest economic engine want to invest in a stock like NVIDIA?
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