At least they're not lying anymore. Where's my, gun confiscation deniers at?

The Second Amendment is all that stands between the US becoming another socialist state like China. You don't have to look any further than Australia over the past 3 years to see what the leftists would do here.

Ag87H2O said:

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The Second Amendment is all that stands between the US becoming another socialist state like China. You don't have to look any further than Australia over the past 3 years to see what the leftists would do here.

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Also, see America's hat. Canada.

Woodrow Wilson envisioned a federal government staffed with experts making decisions for the people. Today is the manifestation of that vision. They're smarter than you. Oh and they want control over everything you do and can't accomplish that without taking away your ability to fight back.

Edited out the R comment because, well, dumbass me forgot Wilson was a Democrat.

Because they're idiots that do mental gymnastics in order to get around the language of that document so they can attempt to achieve their goals. The ones on here are especially stupid. They literally believe Supreme Court justices are supposed to "vote" for what they prefer.

The right to bear arms is the reason that America won its independence and Ireland got crushed.

LOYAL AG said:

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Woodrow Wilson (R) envisioned a federal government staffed with experts making decisions for the people. Today is the manifestation of that vision. They're smarter than you. Oh and they want control over everything you do and can't accomplish that without taking away your ability to fight back.

I put the R to remind us party matters not. Politicians cannot be trusted regardless of party.

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He was a Democrat.

Oh **** you're right! Who the hell was I thinking of?

I'll edit. Thanks! Biggest duh moment I've had in a long time!

LOYAL AG said:

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Woodrow Wilson envisioned a federal government staffed with experts making decisions for the people. Today is the manifestation of that vision. They're smarter than you. Oh and they want control over everything you do and can't accomplish that without taking away your ability to fight back.

Edited out the R comment because, well, dumbass me forgot Wilson was a Democrat.

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Have you guys been to DC and seen the level of experts staffing our executive branch departments?

They're not our best. The average small town in Texas have better administrative people leading the towns and similar expertise. Plus they want to actually make things better. We need to move as much of DC out of DC. Trump was right about that. Move the departments to various states far away from each other.

Real liberal s don't hate the constitution but this brand of mind numbed "Progressives" hate it because their leaders tell them to. The leaders know the constitution stands in their way to total elitist control . None of them understand the genius of the Constitution .

WestAustinAg said:

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LOYAL AG said:

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Woodrow Wilson envisioned a federal government staffed with experts making decisions for the people. Today is the manifestation of that vision. They're smarter than you. Oh and they want control over everything you do and can't accomplish that without taking away your ability to fight back.

Edited out the R comment because, well, dumbass me forgot Wilson was a Democrat.

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Have you guys been to DC and seen the level of experts staffing our executive branch departments?

They're not our best. The average small town in Texas have better administrative people leading the towns and similar expertise. Plus they want to actually make things better. We need to move as much of DC out of DC. Trump was right about that. Move the departments to various states far away from each other.

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I graduated HS in the shadow of DC and visited in 2015. It's alarming how wealthy that area is. Something like 8 of the 10 wealthiest counties are in the wake of DC. That's just disgusting.

BigRobSA said:

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Ag87H2O said:

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The Second Amendment is all that stands between the US becoming another socialist state like China. You don't have to look any further than Australia over the past 3 years to see what the leftists would do here.

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Also, see America's hat. Canada.

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And they never were not Lying. Left = Liar.

Karl Marx said:

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Under no pretext should arms and ammunition be surrendered; any attempt to disarm the workers must be frustrated, by force if necessary.

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Karl Marx was still an idealistic moron and the world would be a better place had he never been conceived.

LOYAL AG said:

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Oh **** you're right! Who the hell was I thinking of?

I'll edit. Thanks! Biggest duh moment I've had in a long time!

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Damn Loyal, I haven't ever seen you make that kind of mistake.

The great thing about Wilson's propaganda is that a great deal of it was used by Goebbels. Wilson's administration was that good about putting stuff out.

Or maybe I should say Goebbels used similar tactics, not the exact same wording.

And Slicer, I'm sure you know, but if the jackwagon Lefties, who love them some Marx, knew what a full blown racist and jew hater he was, they may have second thoughts---but I doubt it.

LOYAL AG said:

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Woodrow Wilson envisioned a federal government staffed with experts making decisions for the people. Today is the manifestation of that vision. They're smarter than you. Oh and they want control over everything you do and can't accomplish that without taking away your ability to fight back.

Edited out the R comment because, well, dumbass me forgot Wilson was a Democrat.

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He also had his wife managing him while he was President.

Burdizzo said:

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LOYAL AG said:

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Woodrow Wilson envisioned a federal government staffed with experts making decisions for the people. Today is the manifestation of that vision. They're smarter than you. Oh and they want control over everything you do and can't accomplish that without taking away your ability to fight back.

Edited out the R comment because, well, dumbass me forgot Wilson was a Democrat.

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He also had his wife managing him while he was President.

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And was in worse shape than Biden is.

Slicer97 said:

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Karl Marx was still an idealistic moron and the world would be a better place had he never been conceived.

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To paraphrase JFK, democracies don't have to put up walls to keep people in.

Quote:

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"Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote!"

-Benjamin Franklin

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I think that about ends the debate on gun rights.

Why do conservatives leave out the "well regulated militia" part? Your average joe going to a gun shop is not a well regulated militia. You can't claim that liberals hate the constitution when it is written so vague that it can be interpreted in multiple ways.

DarkBrandon0111 said:

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Why do conservatives leave out the "well regulated militia" part? Your average joe going to a gun shop is not a well regulated militia. You can't claim that liberals hate the constitution when it is written so vague that it can be interpreted in multiple ways.

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It cannot be Interpreted multiple ways. The framers crafted those amendments with quite intentional language. Gun control advocates interpret it differently because they don't have an understanding of the reasons or language behind it.

DarkBrandon0111 said:

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Why do conservatives leave out the "well regulated militia" part? Your average joe going to a gun shop is not a well regulated militia. You can't claim that liberals hate the constitution when it is written so vague that it can be interpreted in multiple ways.

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DarkBrandon0111 said:

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Why do conservatives leave out the "well regulated militia" part? Your average joe going to a gun shop is not a well regulated militia. You can't claim that liberals hate the constitution when it is written so vague that it can be interpreted in multiple ways.

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What did the Founding Fathers say?

"The Constitution shall never be construed… to prevent the people of the United States who are peaceable citizens from keeping their own arms." Samuel Adams

"…arms like laws discourage and keep the invader and the plunderer in awe, and preserve order in the world as well as property. The same balance would be preserved were all the world destitute of arms, for all would be alike; but since some will not, others dare not lay them aside… Horrid mischief would ensue were one half the world deprived of the use of them…." Thomas Paine

"To preserve liberty, it is essential that the whole body of people always possess arms, and be taught alike, especially when young, how to use them…"- Richard Henry Lee

"The supreme power in America cannot enforce unjust laws by the sword; because the whole body of the people are armed, and constitute a force superior to any band of regular troops that can be, on any pretense, raised in the United States." Noah Webster

"A free people ought not only to be armed, but disciplined; to which end a uniform and well-digested plan is requisite; and their safety and interest require that they should promote such manufactories as tend to render them independent of others for essential, particularly military, supplies." George Washington

"What country can preserve its liberties if their rulers are not warned from time to time that their people preserve the spirit of resistance? Let them take arms." Thomas Jefferson

"The laws that forbid the carrying of arms are laws of such a nature. They disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes…. Such laws make things worse for the assaulted and better for the assailants; they serve rather to encourage than to prevent homicides, for an unarmed man may be attacked with greater confidence than an armed man." Thomas Jefferson

"I ask who are the militia? They consist now of the whole people, except a few public officers." George Mason

"A militia, when properly formed, are in fact the people themselves …" Richard Henry Lee

"The people are not to be disarmed of their weapons. They are left in full possession of them."- Zachariah Johnson

DarkBrandon0111 said:

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Why do conservatives leave out the "well regulated militia" part? Your average joe going to a gun shop is not a well regulated militia. You can't claim that liberals hate the constitution when it is written so vague that it can be interpreted in multiple ways.

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The "well regulated militia" is one of two specific parts of the 2A. The other is "the people". The idea being that each state shall have the right to fund and regulate a militia (the military) and also have an armed citizenry. It's genius.

DarkBrandon0111 said:

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Why do conservatives leave out the "well regulated militia" part? Your average joe going to a gun shop is not a well regulated militia. You can't claim that liberals hate the constitution when it is written so vague that it can be interpreted in multiple ways.

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"Before a standing army can rule, the people must be disarmed, as they are in almost every country in Europe. The supreme power in America cannot enforce unjust laws by the sword; because the whole body of the people are armed, and constitute a force superior to any band of regular troops." Noah Webster, An Examination of the Leading Principles of the Federal Constitution, October 10, 1787

DarkBrandon0111 said:

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Why do conservatives leave out the "well regulated militia" part? Your average joe going to a gun shop is not a well regulated militia. You can't claim that liberals hate the constitution when it is written so vague that it can be interpreted in multiple ways.

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Well regulated means well trained, and not regulated by the government. EOT

"Framers Intent" is massive cope. The framers hardly agreed on anything which was why the constitution was written so vaguely. They had to compromise. Every framer had their own interpretation and there is no objective way to look at the constitution.

DarkBrandon0111 said:

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"Framers Intent" is massive cope. The framers hardly agreed on anything which was why the constitution was written so vaguely. They had to compromise. Every framer had their own interpretation and there is no objective way to look at the constitution.

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Its not vague to the learned....only the obtuse who will not read what they wrote.

DarkBrandon0111 said:

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"Framers Intent" is massive cope. The framers hardly agreed on anything which was why the constitution was written so vaguely. They had to compromise. Every framer had their own interpretation and there is no objective way to look at the constitution.

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I just posted some thoughts from the framers, only a dunce would say its vague.

DarkBrandon0111 said:

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Why do conservatives leave out the "well regulated militia" part? Your average joe going to a gun shop is not a well regulated militia. You can't claim that liberals hate the constitution when it is written so vague that it can be interpreted in multiple ways.

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Check it out---


The founding fathers created 3 separate but equal branches of government.

Why?

So that no one or two branches could hold everything hostage. I think we can both agree on that, yes?

Then why, oh why, would they NOT grant that same "veto" power to the citizens?

Well, they did. They gave us, the citizens, the right to own guns. It's spelled out clearly in the Declaration--

Quote:

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But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security.

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Now let's be intellectually honest here-- do you think "throw off" means to "vote them out"?
Or do you think it's more along the lines of "throw them out forcefully"?


Well, how do you throw a government off by force? With guns....... just like THEY did.

Does this clear everything up for you?

rocky the dog said:

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While a good saying, there is no evidence that Jefferson ever wrote or uttered this.

New World Ag said:

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rocky the dog said:

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While a good saying, there is no evidence that Jefferson ever wrote or uttered this.

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Yeah, its a joke

Liberals hate freedom. They hate the people who are determined to not live under tyranny. Those people are smart enough to own firearms.

It's hard for Liberals to take away freedom if they actually need to fight to do it. That's why they've been working this long drawn out con game, chipping away at it.

DarkBrandon0111 said:

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"Framers Intent" is massive cope. The framers hardly agreed on anything which was why the constitution was written so vaguely. They had to compromise. Every framer had their own interpretation and there is no objective way to look at the constitution.

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I have to disagree. Our founding fathers just spent a crap ton of time risking their lives for a nearly impossible chance at a free nation. The somewhat mundane discussions of free speech, religion, and carrying weapons were crucial to the survivability of a fledgling nation. These were not haphazardly scribbled upon a napkin. They were written, edited, modified, reread, edited, modified until the exact wording and intent was made clear an unarguable. This is my opinion from what I have read of Franklin, Jefferson, and a few other texts. This stuff was painstakingly built to be robust.

Franklin and his ilk were not some schmucks that ran off to college and read some stuff on texags. These guys were well learned scholars. They'd spent time understanding politics and governments from around the world. They knew what mattered.

Just because a few words have meanings we can argue doesn't mean much. They were clear during the time period and they are clear now. How many other amendments do we reach for technical arguments in order to attempt to defeat? I don't know very many. This one is under attack because it's arguably the most important one there is. Without it, the rest can be rendered obsolete with the stroke of a pen.