He's very old, can barely walk, can't talk, and is now being fed through a tube. Obviously his quality of life is very low. Why should he be kept alive through artificial means? Just let him starve peacefully. Of course I'm being sarcastic. Just pointing out the warped thinking of those who want Terry to die.

[snicker]

If the scenarios were the same, then you might have a point. I understand your position on the matter, but this sarcasm does nothing for your argument.

Wont happen. The Pope actually released a document last year that orders otherwise.

DCC99,

Please don't be overly offended, but I found your comment about people wanting Terry to die stupid.

I think most people who support the removal of the feeding tube are also thinking about Terry and her quality of life. You see, 200 years ago, Terry would have died long ago. Because of advanced medicine, she is still alive. If her only problem was she needed someone to feed her, then your comment might make more sense. Why not disconnect artificial means of survival and allow God to decide if she is to be healed or is to die?

Think about it this way. My Mother told me that if she was in the same condition as Terry, she does not want to be left on a feeding tube. If I allow my Mother's feeding tube to be removed, do I really want my Mother to die? Of course not. I want my Mother to live with some dignity and at a minimum have some quality of life. And mostly, I would want to follow her wishes because I honor and respect her.

But, by your logic and that of many other well meaning people, I could be considered a murderer by simply allowing my Mother to die by removing an artificial means of existence.

There really are good arguments to be made on both sides of this issue. The problem is, at some point, someone has to have a final say concerning medical treatment. I am not condemning either party to the dispute as I have no first hand knowledge of anything related to this story as most of us don't. I can only say that after all these years, if it were my daughter, I would have the tube removed.

Most of us would do well to remember, this is a tragedy of epic proportions for Terry's husband and her family. If Terry is a Christian, she is about to step from this life into an eternity with Christ. She will indeed no longer care about this issue of living in that hospital bed. And her wonderful, supportive parents will get over her death and if they are Christians, they will see her again.

I Corinthians 15:55-57 "Oh death, where is thy sting? O grave, where is thy victory? The sting of death is sin, and the strength of sin is the law, But thanks be to God, which gives us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ."

My understanding is the Pope has no living will. Newsweek had an article about this last month.

Of all the dumb things that have been said about the Shaivo case (by both sides), this might take the cake.

lorenag- No offense taken. But allow me to pick apart your argument.

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You see, 200 years ago, Terry would have died long ago. Because of advanced medicine, she is still alive.

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If this was 200 years ago LOTS OF US would be dead from minor ailments. Flu, polio, chicken pox, countless other diseases can all be treated thanks to modern medicine.

quote:

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If her only problem was she needed someone to feed her, then your comment might make more sense.

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Her only problem IS needing someone to feed her! She just can't use a spoon! There are nurses who've admitted feeding her with a spoon. With rehab there is a chance she wouldn't need a tube.

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Why not disconnect artificial means of survival and allow God to decide if she is to be healed or is to die?

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Since when is FOOD artificial means of survival?!
I may be more inclined to agree with you if the whole situation wasn't shrouded with suspicion. Why did Terry have broken ribs and ankles? Why did her "husband" not allow an MRI or PET scan? Why did it take him 7 YEARS to remember that she "didn't want to live like that?" (By the way, the movie they were allegedly watching was about someone on life support, not a feeding tube. huge difference). If you've read the affidavits from nurses and other doctors who've been with Terry, you'd see that she could have improved if her piece of crap husband would have let her go through rehab.

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Of course I'm being sarcastic. Just pointing out the warped thinking of those who want Terry to die.

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in the future, the effects of sarcastic comments are generally better when you dont inform anyone you are being sarcastic, and wait and see who is dumb enough to think you arent. just a helpful hint.



"Or what? Are you gonna sick the dogs?
Or the bees?
Or the dogs with bees in thier mouths so when they bark they shoot bees at you?
Do your worst" -Homer

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You see, 200 years ago, Terry would have died long ago.

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Try 30.

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Since when is FOOD artificial means of survival?!

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Not the food, the means of conveyance. Terri, heartbreakingly, does not have the brainpower to swallow. If any of the earnest yet misguided people trying to give her water had succeeded, she would have drowned.

DCC,

Terry does not have a MINOR ailment that can be treated with some pills or a shot, so that argument is lame.

You say her only problem IS needing someone to feed her? Geez, please remove your head from the sand immediately before you suffocate.

A lot of the medical questions you posed I cannot answer and I believe I personalized the case to me and was hoping you might do the same. Would you allow a feeding tube to remain in your Mother against her wishes?

As I understand it, Terry's husband did not give up on her improving until 3 or 4 years into her tragedy and even tried a surgery to put electrodes or something in her brain. My understanding is the surgery didn't work.

Mr. Schavio may not be on your Christmas card list and you may disagree with his decision, but is beyond me why you think you know the man well enough to call him a "piece of crap".

In the final analysis, this was a family squabble that went public and is being blown out of proportion by a lot of people. The courts rendered a decision and in the end if the tube is not reinserted, Terry will die unless God sees fit to perform a miracle.

Hopefully, all of us will take the time to have some serious discussions with our loved ones regarding end of life medical issues as a result of the publicity of this tragedy.

How is this argument lame...both are/were nutritioned by a feeding tube. Obviously the Pope has more feeling, brain power, etc. but the fact is he is being kept alive artificially just like Terry once was. Put the tube back in!

for starters, the Pope's tube is thru his nose.

Terri's was not.

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Terri, heartbreakingly, does not have the brainpower to swallow.

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If she couldnt swallow she would drown in her saliva, she can eat jello and such if spoon fed.

swimmerbabe

she cannot

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Terri, heartbreakingly, does not have the brainpower to swallow. If any of the earnest yet misguided people trying to give her water had succeeded, she would have drowned.

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That is just not true. Read the affadavits by the nurse who spoon fed her.

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You say her only problem IS needing someone to feed her? Geez, please remove your head from the sand immediately before you suffocate.

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Okay, it's not her only problem, but it is the only assistance she needs to live. Everyone has problems. Where is the line drawn between those with minor problems and major ones?

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Would you allow a feeding tube to remain in your Mother against her wishes?

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It depends. I sure as hell wouldn't let my wife starve to death. Loren, try going just one day without food and water so you can gain a slight feeling of what Terry's going through.

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As I understand it, Terry's husband did not give up on her improving until 3 or 4 years into her tragedy

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Wrong again. It took him 7 years to "remember" Terry's alleged wishes. Here is what makes him a piece of crap: He fought for a large settlement so he could "take care of Terry" for the rest of her life. Once he got it he stopped caring for her. Rehab stopped. He wouldn't let her receive antibiotics for infections. He wouldn't even let her have her teeth brushed.
Bottom line. Starving to death is not fun. This is not just pulling a plug and letting her go peacefully. Would you let your dog die this way?
p.s. tanya, you're wrong too. Why don't ya'll look below the surface of what you see on t.v.?

[This message has been edited by DCC99 (edited 3/31/2005 8:25a).]

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Loren, try going just one day without food and water so you can gain a slight feeling of what Terry's going through.

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Loren would have to be heavily medicated as well.



"There are 10 kinds of people in this world: those who understand binary and those who don't."

[This message has been edited by o3 (edited 3/31/2005 6:17p).]