It's a bit telling that they only included atheists in their comparison. The rapidly growing population isn't atheists, it's agnostics and people who claim no religious preference. The post seems to want to convey the message that reports of the rise of the non-religious population aren't true, but they fail to provide all of the relevant information.

World information on this group is harder to find, but in America they make up about 28% of the population (per Pew) as of 2023 compared with 16% in 2007.

Actually, what I find astonishing is that in 150 years, Pentecostals will have jumped from 1 million in 1900 to 1 billion 150 years later with absolutely zero military conquests on their behalf and against the opposition of the Roman Catholic, Eastern Orthodox, many Reform and almost all mainstream Protestant denominations.
Percentage of non religious in the US is irrelevant because much of that cohort may change as life takes its toll on them.

Praise the Lord!

Can someone explain the Pentecostal thing to me? My only experience with it is with extremely devout west Texas baptists calling them crazy when I was growing up. Any insight on why they felt that way? Is it highly dependent on the individual church?

Beer Baron said:

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Can someone explain the Pentecostal thing to me? My only experience with it is with extremely devout west Texas baptists calling them crazy when I was growing up. Any insight on why they felt that way? Is it highly dependent on the individual church?

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+1. I tried looking it up and it seems very loosely defined. Best I can see is essentially Baptist/evangelical but still believe in modern powers of the Holy Spirit. But others places I see that its prosperity gospel. Idk

I think it's important to separate Word of Faith from mainstream Charismatic/Pentecostals.

Word of Faith is the new age "we are gods" and "name it and claim it" and "your words make reality". Word of Faith is nominally Christian if at all. Plenty of Pentecostals are Christian.

UTExan said:

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Actually, what I find astonishing is that in 150 years, Pentecostals will have jumped from 1 million in 1900 to 1 billion 150 years later with absolutely zero military conquests on their behalf and against the opposition of the Roman Catholic, Eastern Orthodox, many Reform and almost all mainstream Protestant denominations.
Percentage of non religious in the US is irrelevant because much of that cohort may change as life takes its toll on them.

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Mate, there's a reason groups like the Mormons and Pentecostals could go on fancy mission trips across the world with ease. And were able to preach to people who already had some basic understanding of Christianity. The only reason there were no physical conquests was because the groups you mentioned assisted all the initial conquering.

Well, actually missionaries had huge roles in revivals in Argentina.
http://allrevivals.com/revivaldetails/argentine_revival

If you have ever been to West Africa you find Assemblies of God churches everywhere among Anglophone countries.

UTExan said:

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Well, actually missionaries had huge roles in revivals in Argentina.
http://allrevivals.com/revivaldetails/argentine_revival

If you have ever been to West Africa you find Assemblies of God churches everywhere among Anglophone countries.

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I think you're proving his point. Sapper can correct me if I'm wrong, but I think what he's saying is that there has been tremendous growth in countries that were already Christian (at least culturally). The implication here is that the massive growth comes from evangelizing poorly catechized Christians from the denomination of their upbringing rather than reaching those that have never heard the gospel. This naturally makes rapid growth much easier than the denominations that have historically entered into uncharted territories.

The Banned said:

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UTExan said:

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Well, actually missionaries had huge roles in revivals in Argentina.
http://allrevivals.com/revivaldetails/argentine_revival

If you have ever been to West Africa you find Assemblies of God churches everywhere among Anglophone countries.

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I think you're proving his point. Sapper can correct me if I'm wrong, but I think what he's saying is that there has been tremendous growth in countries that were already Christian (at least culturally). The implication here is that the massive growth comes from evangelizing poorly catechized Christians from the denomination of their upbringing rather than reaching those that have never heard the gospel. This naturally makes rapid growth much easier than the denominations that have historically entered into uncharted territories.

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Modern Pentecostals as a movement emerged after 1900 and they spread into places which had known animism, ancestor worship or a combination of those with some Christian beliefs. That's why Pentecostals thrived in places like subSaharan Africa. Russia and Eastern Europe were also high growth places although the established Orthodox Church lobbied the Russian government to restrict them. I believe an author named Vincent Synan has written extensively about that historical growth. Some see it as an outgrowth of the Wesleyan-Methodist tradition, which itself was the Pentecostalism of the 19th century.

Beer Baron said:

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Can someone explain the Pentecostal thing to me? My only experience with it is with extremely devout west Texas baptists calling them crazy when I was growing up. Any insight on why they felt that way? Is it highly dependent on the individual church?

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Pentecostals believe in the charisma or gifts of the spirit that never went away as opposed to cessationists, who believe that they did.
Pentecostalism certainly has more than its share of power abusers, charlatans, etc, but at its core it is about a more spontaneous expression of worship than a highly structured liturgical practice. It has found expression in Roman Catholic, Anglican, Methodist, Lutheran denominations in their charismatic branches.

UTExan said:

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Beer Baron said:

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Can someone explain the Pentecostal thing to me? My only experience with it is with extremely devout west Texas baptists calling them crazy when I was growing up. Any insight on why they felt that way? Is it highly dependent on the individual church?

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Pentecostals believe in the charisma or gifts of the spirit that never went away as opposed to cessationists, who believe that they did.
Pentecostalism certainly has more than its share of power abusers, charlatans, etc, but at its core it is about a more spontaneous expression of worship than a highly structured liturgical practice. It has found expression in Roman Catholic, Anglican, Methodist, Lutheran denominations in their charismatic branches.

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The modern charismatic movement (which covers a huge swath of different stuff) claims those gifts never went away, but that is very new doctrinally/conceptually. The Pentecostals claimed that the gifts of tongues and healing re-emerged around 1900 because Christ's return was imminent. Traditional Pentecostalism is fading away and/or morphing into the non-denominational charismatic stuff of today because their eschatological claims aren't really holding fast when most of its original leaders were claiming that they were the second coming of Elijah and Christ was a mere few years away from returning.

tk111 said:

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UTExan said:

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Beer Baron said:

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Can someone explain the Pentecostal thing to me? My only experience with it is with extremely devout west Texas baptists calling them crazy when I was growing up. Any insight on why they felt that way? Is it highly dependent on the individual church?

---

Pentecostals believe in the charisma or gifts of the spirit that never went away as opposed to cessationists, who believe that they did.
Pentecostalism certainly has more than its share of power abusers, charlatans, etc, but at its core it is about a more spontaneous expression of worship than a highly structured liturgical practice. It has found expression in Roman Catholic, Anglican, Methodist, Lutheran denominations in their charismatic branches.

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The modern charismatic movement (which covers a huge swath of different stuff) claims those gifts never went away, but that is very new doctrinally/conceptually. The Pentecostals claimed that the gifts of tongues and healing re-emerged around 1900 because Christ's return was imminent. Traditional Pentecostalism is fading away and/or morphing into the non-denominational charismatic stuff of today because their eschatological claims aren't really holding fast when most of its original leaders were claiming that they were the second coming of Elijah and Christ was a mere few years away from returning.

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This sounds about right. They are morphing to figure out what doctrine will draw people and which doctrine to get rid of. So if it draws people to Christ....thats a good thing. I may not agree with all their beliefs but if it brings new people to Christ then we're headed in the right direction.

BluHorseShu said:

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tk111 said:

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UTExan said:

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Beer Baron said:

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Can someone explain the Pentecostal thing to me? My only experience with it is with extremely devout west Texas baptists calling them crazy when I was growing up. Any insight on why they felt that way? Is it highly dependent on the individual church?

---

Pentecostals believe in the charisma or gifts of the spirit that never went away as opposed to cessationists, who believe that they did.
Pentecostalism certainly has more than its share of power abusers, charlatans, etc, but at its core it is about a more spontaneous expression of worship than a highly structured liturgical practice. It has found expression in Roman Catholic, Anglican, Methodist, Lutheran denominations in their charismatic branches.

---

The modern charismatic movement (which covers a huge swath of different stuff) claims those gifts never went away, but that is very new doctrinally/conceptually. The Pentecostals claimed that the gifts of tongues and healing re-emerged around 1900 because Christ's return was imminent. Traditional Pentecostalism is fading away and/or morphing into the non-denominational charismatic stuff of today because their eschatological claims aren't really holding fast when most of its original leaders were claiming that they were the second coming of Elijah and Christ was a mere few years away from returning.

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This sounds about right. They are morphing to figure out what doctrine will draw people and which doctrine to get rid of. So if it draws people to Christ....thats a good thing. I may not agree with all their beliefs but if it brings new people to Christ then we're headed in the right direction.

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Then why didn't they utilize Zechariah 14, which describes the conditions prior to Christ's return? These were not illiterate people. You say they are "morphing", but in actuality they are utilizing the model of the early church and primitive Methodism: small societies and groups for mutual accountability and support, personalized worship and adoration of God as opposed to a systemized liturgical format.

It looks to me like Pentecostalism is cross denominational, correct? Are they counting members of certain churches or people of any denomination that identify as Pentecostal?

UTExan said:

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BluHorseShu said:

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tk111 said:

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UTExan said:

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Beer Baron said:

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Can someone explain the Pentecostal thing to me? My only experience with it is with extremely devout west Texas baptists calling them crazy when I was growing up. Any insight on why they felt that way? Is it highly dependent on the individual church?

---

Pentecostals believe in the charisma or gifts of the spirit that never went away as opposed to cessationists, who believe that they did.
Pentecostalism certainly has more than its share of power abusers, charlatans, etc, but at its core it is about a more spontaneous expression of worship than a highly structured liturgical practice. It has found expression in Roman Catholic, Anglican, Methodist, Lutheran denominations in their charismatic branches.

---

The modern charismatic movement (which covers a huge swath of different stuff) claims those gifts never went away, but that is very new doctrinally/conceptually. The Pentecostals claimed that the gifts of tongues and healing re-emerged around 1900 because Christ's return was imminent. Traditional Pentecostalism is fading away and/or morphing into the non-denominational charismatic stuff of today because their eschatological claims aren't really holding fast when most of its original leaders were claiming that they were the second coming of Elijah and Christ was a mere few years away from returning.

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This sounds about right. They are morphing to figure out what doctrine will draw people and which doctrine to get rid of. So if it draws people to Christ....thats a good thing. I may not agree with all their beliefs but if it brings new people to Christ then we're headed in the right direction.

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Then why didn't they utilize Zechariah 14, which describes the conditions prior to Christ's return? These were not illiterate people. You say they are "morphing", but in actuality they are utilizing the model of the early church and primitive Methodism: small societies and groups for mutual accountability and support, personalized worship and adoration of God as opposed to a systemized liturgical format.

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The liturgy was systemized by at least 150, and likely much earlier.

Also, I don't know how one could look at all the councils and see the early church as merely local groups.

As for the end times stuff, idk much about what Pentecostals believe there

The Banned said:

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It looks to me like Pentecostalism is cross denominational, correct? Are they counting members of certain churches or people of any denomination that identify as Pentecostal?

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The modern charismatic phenomenon certainly is, beginning in the US around 1960 with an Episcopal priest named Dennis Bennett.