This is the biggest question that has stuck with me.


If the third movie HAS to be all about Batman being an outsider, then that means Gotham HAS to hate him/cast him out somehow.


SO, why could Gotham possibly hate him?


1) Vigilantism/Law-breaking?
Seems to me that a crime-ridden city that is fixed by a vigilante wouldn't begrudge him that much.


2) The Joker's threats?
That the entire loved-one-in-a-hospital population would want to kill Coleman Reese after the Joker's threat to blow up a hospital was only slightly believable.
Wouldn't, instead, those people concerned just run straight toward the hospital in question to get their family member out? Alternatively, would they go vigilante themselves and try to stop the Joker (e.g., the fake Batmen)?


Is there another possible explanation I'm missing?


Besides those two flimsy scenarios, now that Gotham's "White Night" is dead, why NOT fall into the waiting arms of a Batman who has previously rid the streets of crime? If Batman's hard work produced Dent, can't Batman produce another Dent? Why hate on Batman now?


HELP ME UNDERSTAND

The guy framed himself for the murders of Dent and two other officers, turning him into a criminal in the minds of everyone in Gotham besides Gordon.

Ok, I'm getting there...


Why would Batman want to kill Dent, in the public's eyes?

Why would Batman want to kill Wuertz & Ramirez, in the public's eyes?

Maybe they see it as him killing them to try to get closer to the Joker.

One thing that you aren't remembering is that Batman didn't get rid of the crime. Things were better, but still bad. As you saw, the crime bosses still met, just during the day and in hiding instead of at night and more in the open. The police department is still obviously rife with people who have been bought by the mob (run by joker now).

Things aren't so great in Gotham. People in groups are mobbish and stupid. Most people have trouble with foresight. They look for the immediate scapegoat. Joker says he is killing people until Batman shows his face... so they want Batman to show his face, when in reality, that will not solve the problem. They see the Joker as being a problem as a result of Batman. For years crime was happening, but it didn't really affect the common man, until Batman came around. Superhero takes on criminals, super criminals appear. When ordinary things are put under pressure, exceptional individuals can appear. Batman squeezed the criminals until the Joker showed up.

They blame Batman for the Joker and they hate him because he supposedly crossed a line by killing these people. A trust developed that even though he was above the law, he wouldn't go too far. And since he took the fall for the killings, they think he crossed the line.

Don't forget during the Dent press conference when the guy says "Things are worse now than they've ever been!" and Harvey agrees with him.

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Why would Batman want to kill Wuertz & Ramirez, in the public's eyes?

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Ramirez isn't dead.

And the motive for Dent could easily be explained as professional jealousy.

************SPOILER**************************










Don't forget that he attacked a swat team in front of the entire police force. Sending several of them dangling off the edge of a building.

I'm sure the next movie will highlight the fact that several of the more insightful citizens of Gotham don't buy it, but unfortunately many people are spoon fed by the media and accept whatever they see on television as the fact.

[This message has been edited by bendover (edited 7/23/2008 1:10a).]

It's, "The Batman". Not Batman.

things were corrupt before, but innocent people weren't being killed or put in harms way. the batman shows up, starts cleaning out the corruption and then innocent people and public figures start getting killed. things are better, but publicly, they are worse.

he must preserve dent's reputation as a good guy for the hope of the city... if dent is shown to have been corrupt... then the idea of the corruption going away is gone. so he must take the blame for dents death and the others.

and realize we have seen the batman for who he is, behind the scenes... all the citizens see is the aftermath. most of the citizens have not even seen this guy or pics of him, so they don't know anything other than here is a guy that dresses up like a bat, cops start getting killed, and they are in danger.

so from that perspective, i think its easy to see why he is blamed and becomes an outcast. and he willingly takes the blame to become what the city needs

ok good stuff all


that's why i'm going to see it again at the IMAX.......

they trust Jim Gordon, and Gordon told them that the Batman killed the officers.

Remember, the Joker is still in play.

You find it odd that he was not suprised by Batman finding him before midnight? Almost like he PLANNED on being caught.

Perhaps he wanted to meet someone he'd met/heard about in Arkham?

I would imagine the Joker and Edward Nygma could raise a little hell in Gotham. And it only gets worse when the Scarecrow gives his medicine to Mr. E.

The Riddler would be the psychotic antithises of the Joker. Where one doesn't have a plan.... the other IS the definition of a plan. When Edward Nygma, he had some shred of humanity, with that gone.... the Riddler frames Batman for the murder of several dozen/hundred policemen (imagine the Batcopter being unleashed on a gatering).

When the Riddler subverts Scarecrow completely a more complete effort to spread his medicine to the masses is made. Batman is forced/chooses to kill Scarecrow (the "low" point for Batman?). Perhaps preventing the Riddler's poisonous plan, or not.

Gotham would be chaos.

An important point here is that the "public" may not really hate Batman. The average person on the street definitely fears and is suspicious of him, but many know he is a defender, a force for good. It's the officials who are on a manhunt. To further their agenda, they will paint him as dangerous, unstable, etc. The jealous cops will continue to emphasize that the "freaks" didn't show up until Batman.

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Remember, the Joker is still in play.

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He is? Really? Wasn't he dangling from the Pruitt Bldg. the last time was saw him w/ SWAT members buzzing everywhere?

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He is? Really? Wasn't he dangling from the Pruitt Bldg. the last time was saw him w/ SWAT members buzzing everywhere?

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MOTHER****ER!!!!

Seriously, with all the discussion about spoiler warning on this board.....oh hell, nevermind. Wow.

Don't forget that he goes around blowing up parked cars while joyriding on his big wheel!

don't read threads about batman if you don't want to be spoiled... hth

I dont understand the public hating The Batman thing people are speculating about for the next movie. I bet the next movies starts out with that angle for maybe the first 15 mins max. Then some bad guy terrorizes the city, the public wants The Batman, and then he saves the day.

Is he The Batman or just plain Batman. Remember the first movie, with Michael Keaton. He meets Vicki Vale and introduces himself: "I'm Batman." No definite article needed.

Keaton introduced himself as "Batman" because he was the only one up until that point, there was the Adam West one but he wasn't to be confused with Keaton since he was grey and blue and only operated during the day. With Bale, the Gotham folks were starting to get confused with Bale and Keaton and all the other wannabe's cavorting around in Batman costumes.

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MOTHER****ER!!!!

Seriously, with all the discussion about spoiler warning on this board.....oh hell, nevermind. Wow.

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It's real simple. Don't click on ANY Batman threads if you don't want spoilers...or GO SEE THE DAMN MOVIE!