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Wind Farm Lease Questions

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Yesterday
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In reply to Hub05 • 7:32a, 6/12/22
AG
Hub05 said:
We have been approached for a potential lease for a wind farm on 300ish acres in north central texas. I met with a representative today with the following info:

They are currently offering us $10 an acre for a 6 month window on the exclusive right to negotiate a lease agreement. We were contacted by another company about 1year ago, but never moved towards negotiating anything.

The rep claimed the farm is going to be built, with construction starting next spring. I don't know if this is true or just posturing.

I haven't signed anything and will have a contract lawyer review before I do, but I was wondering if anyone else had any experience/thoughts on the process?


Have a great contact who used to write these leases and worked for a turbine company for many years. He consulted us and gave us a very thorough explanation with expectations about the lease. He gave us some great inside information on what to look for and how to negotiate. Was pretty damn cheap too! Cheaper than the worthless wind lease attorney we hired to help.

Let me know if you need his contact. Can't recommend enough!
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tlh3842
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In reply to Canyon99 • 11:52a, 6/12/22
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Canyon99 said:
Hub05 said:
Does anyone here have recent experience with a lease? Or a suggestion on a lawyer specializing in wind farms?


John Casper with Wetsel, Carmichael, Allen, & Lederle in Lubbock has negotiated a few leases for my clients.


Wetsel was always a firm I heard about being on the renewable development side of things.
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starks500
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7:00p, 6/12/22
we currently have four different wind farms located on our ranches. would be happy to share our experiences with you and one lease in particular that we feel was more beneficial to the landowner than the other three. please feel free to call me at 979-575-0520 greg
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starks500
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7:05p, 6/12/22
i can also refer an attorney. It is beneficial for all affected land owners to hire the attorney together We were successful in getting the company interested in leasing from us to pay for our attorney by doing this
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tlh3842
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In reply to starks500 • 7:27p, 6/12/22
AG
I think its not a bad idea if everyone has the same attorney, but not sure how successful it will be getting the company to pay for everyone's attorney. It's possible, just depends on how critical the project is for said company.
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birdman
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6:11a, 6/14/22
Was this in Hardeman County?
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eric76
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In reply to fightingfarmer09 • 6:27a, 6/14/22
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fightingfarmer09 said:
It's a matter of time before they break or the company goes bankrupt and sells it to an even cheaper outfit that won't maintain them and they break.

After all of that, you are stuck with windmills that don't work and no one to take them down.

-every farmer I know that has them
Pretty much the same here.

Some have been taken down.

There is one fairly good installation in the county that nearly everyone is curious about but nobody asks. He was pushing for wind generators early and has a lot of them on some of his land. The question is whether he's ever made a penny on them? They hardly ever seem to be running and the blades have been replaced on them multiple times. From what I hear, he's in a more or less constant war with the company for not living up to their side of the bargain.

I talked to one guy the other day who has an uncle who has about 4,000 acres of cotton in the southern Panhandle. The guy told me that they were on his uncle's farm for about five years before they ever paid his uncle a dime.

A niece of mine is married to someone who has had a wind farm on his property for years. He told me some time ago that they don't pay anything like they promised. And they haven't run in a few years and he wants them gone.

One of the larger farm and ranch families I know were approached a few years ago to put a large wind farm on their ranch. The matriarch of the family told me that after they read the lease contract, they saw that there was absolutely nothing in it for them and refused to sign.

They are putting in a bunch around me now. In my community, though, there won't be many. There were some large farmers who had been interested, but their interest seems to have cooled a bit. One farmer is said to have put in a grass strip for his airplane largely to keep them from building them around his house.

If what I've seen is anything to go by, if you get the wind generators, there is a good chance you will live to regret it.
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eric76
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In reply to water turkey • 6:31a, 6/14/22
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water turkey said:
If they aren't turning, the company isn't making any money. If it is a reputable company, they will be maintained very meticulously.

If the county doesn't require a decommissioning plan and bond, require decomm language in the lease document.
In one wind generator farm on the state line, they were there for about ten years before being taken down. As I understand it, the equipment was all crap and the manufacturer went out of business leaving the owner of the wind generators with zero parts availability to keep them running.
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eric76
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In reply to Hub05 • 6:32a, 6/14/22
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Hub05 said:
The current company is Enel and the previous company is Nextera.

I have heard the stories (urban legend? per canyons posts) On not working junk yards. So I wad curious if anyone had first hand knowledge.

Thr preliminary lease offer has a minimum payment of 5k per megawatt. So on a 3mW unit, minimum would be 15k. This number is higher than the $4-8k I had heard second hand from people, which increased my skepticism meter.
What about when they aren't turning?

I suspect that the smart thing to do is to go for a fixed lease that pays $X per generator as long as they are there whether or not they ever generate a watt of power.
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eric76
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In reply to Hub05 • 6:34a, 6/14/22
AG
Hub05 said:
That is part of our thinking. The wind farm is getting built, so it's either looking at them with nothing or looking at them a tad bit closer for a paycheck.
If they were really all that profitable to have, wouldn't the wind generator companies be buying land to put the farms on? It says a lot when they only want to put them on other people's land.
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eric76
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In reply to SunrayAg • 6:37a, 6/14/22
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SunrayAg said:
I don't like wind generators, and I certainly don't support the politics of the climate cult.

But I live in the panhandle where they are everywhere with more going in daily.

I have seen exactly 1 that quit working and was beyond repair. They blew the base bolts and dropped it on its side like a big tree, and hauled it off in pieces the next day.

I've seen several.

Are you familiar with Jack Freeman's ranch? There is a line of them there that haven't run in a while and one or more have crashed to the ground. Nobody is in a hurry to do anything about it. If Jack was still alive, he would be enraged.

There was another wind farm south of Guymon, Oklahoma where they have all been brought down. And another to the southwest of Guymon with a number that are torn up and unusable. Also some that had fires.
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tlh3842
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In reply to eric76 • 6:46a, 6/14/22
AG
eric76 said:
Hub05 said:
That is part of our thinking. The wind farm is getting built, so it's either looking at them with nothing or looking at them a tad bit closer for a paycheck.
If they were really all that profitable to have, wouldn't the wind generator companies be buying land to put the farms on? It says a lot when they only want to put them on other people's land.

I don't think that's accurate. Considering the liability of being a landowner (teenagers trespassing and potential lawsuits and who knows what could happen, taxes, etc.), that's a whole different can of worms.
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RockOn
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In reply to Beckett12 • 8:26a, 6/14/22
Beckett12 said:
Pretty much all of these deals require the remediation cost in the financing. Tax equity will be involved and this will be a requirement. I deal with mostly solar/battery now, and I would take a combined cycle power plant any day to acres over acres of solar arrays. TX is jut so big, and weather is prime, so we are a big target.
There's a lot of solar farms popping up on farm land in northeast Texas (Paris area). Are there any catches or pitfalls that a landowner might need to be wary of when signing up for a long-term lease on these solar installations?

When I hear about it, seems too good to be true, so I feel like people are boasting about the upside while ignoring the downside. I've never been able to get my hands on a lease agreement to read for myself.
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CanyonAg77
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In reply to eric76 • 8:41a, 6/14/22
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And I know a guy who quit his job as an engineer at the local DOE facility, because the family farm was making so much money from wind turbines.

Turbines continue to go up all over the panhandle/south plains. If the landowners were getting ripped off, the word would spread and the industry would be dead in the water
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CanyonAg77
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In reply to eric76 • 8:47a, 6/14/22
AG
eric76 said:
Hub05 said:
That is part of our thinking. The wind farm is getting built, so it's either looking at them with nothing or looking at them a tad bit closer for a paycheck.
If they were really all that profitable to have, wouldn't the wind generator companies be buying land to put the farms on? It says a lot when they only want to put them on other people's land.

Not really. Why would they buy 100 acres of land, when all they need is a few hundred square feet of ground?

What are they going to do with the other 99.9 acres, buy a tractor and start farming?

I have a friend who's family has a cell phone tower on an unused corner of their farm. Totally useless land for them. At the time the tower went in, they would have sold it for $1000-$2000 an acre. Company didn't want to buy, they leased for 99 years at the same price per year they could have bought outright, instead.
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techno-ag
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In reply to RockOn • 11:19a, 6/14/22
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RockOn said:
Beckett12 said:
Pretty much all of these deals require the remediation cost in the financing. Tax equity will be involved and this will be a requirement. I deal with mostly solar/battery now, and I would take a combined cycle power plant any day to acres over acres of solar arrays. TX is jut so big, and weather is prime, so we are a big target.
There's a lot of solar farms popping up on farm land in northeast Texas (Paris area). Are there any catches or pitfalls that a landowner might need to be wary of when signing up for a long-term lease on these solar installations?

When I hear about it, seems too good to be true, so I feel like people are boasting about the upside while ignoring the downside. I've never been able to get my hands on a lease agreement to read for myself.
Curious about this too as people we know have been approached around BCS about using their land for a solar farm.
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rme
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11:38a, 6/14/22
AG
I've done solar leases all over Texas and have always included remediation provisions/bonds in lease agreements. I've been on both the developer side and the landowner side.
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sunchaser
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In reply to eric76 • 12:03p, 6/14/22
AG
No! The bonus on signing a "3 year lease" is not large. If you are new ……….Get an Attorney! That 3 year lease is probably 99 years when you read the fine print!
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Hub05
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4:18p, 6/14/22
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Yesterday, I would really appreciate you sharing your contact. If you want, you can email me at username at outlook.com

Starks500, I have your #. I am traveling the rest of the week, but will reach out to you sometime next week, if that is okay with you.
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Yesterday
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In reply to Hub05 • 5:16p, 6/14/22
AG
Sent!
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eric76
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In reply to sunchaser • 6:59p, 6/14/22
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sunchaser said:
No! The bonus on signing a "3 year lease" is not large. If you are new Get an Attorney! That 3 year lease is probably 99 years when you read the fine print!
I can't imagine them signing a 3 year lease. The tax credits would run longer than that.

Good point about that it might actually be a 99 year lease.

FWIW, I have wondered if anyone is selling the wind rights outright. It doesn't sound like it would be a smart move at all.
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RockOn
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In reply to techno-ag • 7:24p, 6/14/22
techno-ag said:
RockOn said:
Beckett12 said:
Pretty much all of these deals require the remediation cost in the financing. Tax equity will be involved and this will be a requirement. I deal with mostly solar/battery now, and I would take a combined cycle power plant any day to acres over acres of solar arrays. TX is jut so big, and weather is prime, so we are a big target.
There's a lot of solar farms popping up on farm land in northeast Texas (Paris area). Are there any catches or pitfalls that a landowner might need to be wary of when signing up for a long-term lease on these solar installations?

When I hear about it, seems too good to be true, so I feel like people are boasting about the upside while ignoring the downside. I've never been able to get my hands on a lease agreement to read for myself.
Curious about this too as people we know have been approached around BCS about using their land for a solar farm.
All I know is I've never seen a man become a drunkard faster than one getting those solar check$.
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techno-ag
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In reply to RockOn • 7:47p, 6/14/22
AG
RockOn said:
techno-ag said:
RockOn said:
Beckett12 said:
Pretty much all of these deals require the remediation cost in the financing. Tax equity will be involved and this will be a requirement. I deal with mostly solar/battery now, and I would take a combined cycle power plant any day to acres over acres of solar arrays. TX is jut so big, and weather is prime, so we are a big target.
There's a lot of solar farms popping up on farm land in northeast Texas (Paris area). Are there any catches or pitfalls that a landowner might need to be wary of when signing up for a long-term lease on these solar installations?

When I hear about it, seems too good to be true, so I feel like people are boasting about the upside while ignoring the downside. I've never been able to get my hands on a lease agreement to read for myself.
Curious about this too as people we know have been approached around BCS about using their land for a solar farm.
All I know is I've never seen a man become a drunkard faster than one getting those solar check$.
Hm. Dunno about that. I have seen a solar farm off 6 heading into Waco, but I haven't seen anything closer to College Station. Not saying they're not there, just haven't seen them.
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rme
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In reply to techno-ag • 7:59p, 6/14/22
AG
There are several under development in the area.
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starks500
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10:14a, 6/15/22
Yes that is fine.....i have no doubt they are offering 5K per MW the last 3 installed on our place are 4.3 MW The ones installed 9.5 years ago are 1.4 MW. Technology changing and advancing has definitely made it where land owners are getting more per turbine. There are also minimum rent amounts you can put in the contract that seem to be common these days. The contracts and agreements are way more beneficial to the landowner these days than what landowners were offered 15-20 years ago.
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Blue Bell Ag
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5:24p, 6/15/22
AG
I am appraising a proposed solar farm in Montgomery County. They want to lease 2,500 acres near Magnolia. The client is a private university in Houston near the Med Center.

Can anyone help me with actual per acre solar lease rates in Texas? I will certainly share what data I have.

ksimmons@valbridge.com

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Yesterday
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In reply to Blue Bell Ag • 5:42p, 6/15/22
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NM. Asking about solar instead of wind.
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tlh3842
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In reply to Yesterday • 6:27p, 6/15/22
AG
Solar is still per acre, it's not identical to wind. Not sure on going rates, especially for Montgomery County (as opposed to middle of nowhere Texas)
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Yesterday
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In reply to tlh3842 • 6:28p, 6/15/22
AG
tlh3842 said:
Solar is still per acre, it's not identical to wind. Not sure on going rates, especially for Montgomery County (as opposed to middle of nowhere Texas)


Good lord. Completely missed the solar part. My apologies for that long post.
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Blue Bell Ag
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10:25a, 6/16/22
AG
TTT
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OnlyForNow
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In reply to Blue Bell Ag • 10:44a, 6/16/22
AG
Look at the solar farm in southern Fort Bend County on Google Earth, ~3,000 acres - west of Guy, TX. Doesn't look like imagery is updated. look at the property SE of 442 and 1236, where there is a new ditch on farm land.

Find landowner info on CAD, google name, call and ask.
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rme
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In reply to OnlyForNow • 12:11p, 6/16/22
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OnlyForNow said:
Look at the solar farm in southern Fort Bend County on Google Earth, ~3,000 acres - west of Guy, TX. Doesn't look like imagery is updated. look at the property SE of 442 and 1236, where there is a new ditch on farm land.

Find landowner info on CAD, google name, call and ask.
Jack won't tell you anything.
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Beckett12
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3:19p, 6/16/22
AG
You referencing the solar project in Wharton County?
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rme
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3:35p, 6/16/22
AG
Not me. There are several in Wharton, Fort Bend and surrounding counties.
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Ogre09
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In reply to AgGrad99 • 9:14p, 6/16/22
AG
AgGrad99 said:
These wind farms have ruined The West Texas landscape.

Not saying I'd turn away the money if offered, but it's definitely ruined the landscape. I miss the way it used to be.


I think they're beautiful, like pump jacks and windmills.
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