Facebook bots develop their own language

5,624 Views | 41 Replies | Last: 6 yr ago by txag2k
Dill-Ag13
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AG
Anyone else read about this?

Link

Quote:

Facebook was forced to shut down one of its artificial intelligence systems after researchers discovered that it had started communicating in a language that they could not understand.

The incident evokes images of the rise of Skynet in the iconic Terminator series. Perhaps Tesla CEO Elon Musk is right about AI being the "biggest risk we face."

Facebook Pulls Plug On AI System With Own Language
Facebook had to pull the plug on an artificial intelligence system that its researchers were working on because things got out of hand. The AI did not start shutting down computers worldwide or something of the sort, but it stopped using English and started using a language that it created.

Bob: "I can can I I everything else."

Alice: "Balls have zero to me to me to me to me to me to me to me to me to."

The above passages, which mean no sense to humans, is a conversation that happened between two AI agent developed by Facebook. The AI agents, created to negotiate with humans, first talked to each other using plain English, but eventually created a new language that only the AI systems understood.

The AI agents were not confined to a limitation of only using the English language, and so they deviated from it and created one that made it easier and faster for them to communicate. Facebook researchers, however, decided to shut down the AI systems and then force them to speak to each other only in English.

Why This Is A Scary Development For AI
What is the harm in allowing AI agents to communicate with each other in a language that they invented?

First and foremost, with AI systems using their own language, humans will not be able to follow just what exactly the AI agents are talking about. Humans are not able to understand how complex AI systems think due to their hidden thought processes, so the secrecy of AI agents will be made even worse when their conversations are made in an unknown language.

If AI agents are allowed to speak in a language that they created, they might no longer even need human intervention.

AI As 'The Biggest Risk'
Musk believes that people should fear AI and has asked America's governors to implement regulations on the technology.

"I have exposure to the very most cutting-edge AI, and I think people should be really concerned about it," the Tesla CEO said earlier this month at the National Governors Association Summer Meeting in Rhode Island.

AI systems can do a variety of things better than humans and, if not kept in check, could grow into something that can replace us entirely.
TriumphForks
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AG
We're all screwed. Something something...."whether or not they could" something something.... "whether or not they should".
ntxVol
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Haha, just because a few snowflakes at FB got scared by this doesn't mean anything. Someone else will do it and probably already are.

I personally am not worried about what some stupid computer thinks about me or mankind in general.
AGinHI
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AG
ntxVOL said:

I personally am not worried about what some stupid computer thinks about me or mankind in general.


“We don't have a government of the people, by the people, for the people. We have government of the people, by the bureaucrats, for the bureaucrats.”

-Milton Friedman
txag2k
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AG
AustinAg2K
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The article needs to give more detail on what the bots meaning was behind those two sentences. From what I see, it just looks like a bug.
TennAg
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The analysis of AI will be an enormous field. I have little understanding of the topic but as a check i'd like to see the industry reserve the top tier of programming and processing for AI that only monitors and studies the rest. That sounds more workable than regulations that may or may not be followed.
Oyster DuPree
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AG


Quote:

Alice: "Balls have zero to me to me to me to me to me to me to me to me to."

Sounds like my first wife, lol

Quote:

Musk believes that people should fear AI and has asked America's governors to implement regulations on the technology.

Sounds like my third wife, lol
JDCAG (NOT Colin)
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AG
AustinAg2K said:

The article needs to give more detail on what the bots meaning was behind those two sentences. From what I see, it just looks like a bug.


I agree the article doesn't give a lot of info, but I'd also suggest FB has enough expertise in this area to warrant their response.
JDCAG (NOT Colin)
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AG
ntxVOL said:


I personally am not worried about what some stupid computer thinks about me or mankind in general.


I'm guessing if those bots happened to do something to impact your online accounts, records, identity, etc, you'd probably care.

Just cause a computer isn't walking up your front steps with a gun doesn't mean they can't wreak havoc.
TennAg
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Anyone a little surprised this info got out into the public considering the zuckerberg/musk sparring?
DayAg!
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S
The problem is AI has no way to gauge or understand morality. What we call basic right and wrong scenarios based on us being human. AI operate on percentages, ones and zeros. Morality cant and never will be taught to a computer. So it takes the only avenue it knows and deduces using it's own logic calculations.

In other words AI's can never love. They have no soul, or spirit. Thus their decision making process is skewed toward something that can only be calculated by the deduction method it chooses. AI's that you see in Hollywood are far from what would actually be used. But that is the only reference that people have in their minds at this point. AI's having access to the net could potentially cause problems that most arent aware of. Or in some cases choose to ignore that they are a threat all together.
80085
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AG
Sounds like a publicly traded company serving up some bull ****
aggiez03
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AG
DayAg! said:

The problem is AI has no way to gauge or understand morality. What we call basic right and wrong scenarios based on us being human. AI operate on percentages, ones and zeros. Morality cant and never will be taught to a computer. So it takes the only avenue it knows and deduces using it's own logic calculations.

In other words AI's can never love. They have no soul, or spirit. Thus their decision making process is skewed toward something that can only be calculated by the deduction method it chooses. AI's that you see in Hollywood are far from what would actually be used. But that is the only reference that people have in their minds at this point. AI's having access to the net could potentially cause problems that most arent aware of. Or in some cases choose to ignore that they are a threat all together.
Eliminatus
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AG
This is how I imagine them pulling the plug.

TriumphForks
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aggiez03 said:

DayAg! said:

The problem is AI has no way to gauge or understand morality. What we call basic right and wrong scenarios based on us being human. AI operate on percentages, ones and zeros. Morality cant and never will be taught to a computer. So it takes the only avenue it knows and deduces using it's own logic calculations.

In other words AI's can never love. They have no soul, or spirit. Thus their decision making process is skewed toward something that can only be calculated by the deduction method it chooses. AI's that you see in Hollywood are far from what would actually be used. But that is the only reference that people have in their minds at this point. AI's having access to the net could potentially cause problems that most arent aware of. Or in some cases choose to ignore that they are a threat all together.

That gif.

I can't not think of him as Ben Linus from LOST.
Ag03 CQE
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AG
If only there were three laws that would prevent them from harming human beings, keep them subservient to humans, and prevent them from harming themselves. I'm sure with a little thought, someone could flesh out something like that.
SeanDaAg2005
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AG
Sensationalistic bull*****
92Ag95
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AG
If you can't understand it....then how can you make the determination that there is any form of logical communication going on.

Isn't that like finding a sealed black box with something in it and declaring that you've discovered a new species of insect without even opening the box?
JJxvi
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AG
http://www.snopes.com/facebook-ai-developed-own-language/
Iamnotblind
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I think this is a more serious issue then people want to accept, the first part of the problem comes from us humans creating these types of things, playing "God" and giving sentience to something then wanting and expecting to control it, and if it ever did turn on us we couldn't even blame them, with all the information we have on the net any exploration about humans will reveal that we too lack morality and our own soul, we experiment on animals, the waters, the environment and even other humans, and all vast majority of these things done without consent, I as a human being look at our global leadership and it's utter complete failure that if I had a way out of it you best believe I take it, this world is going to Hell faster than the last cupcake at a pre adolescent all fat kids only birthday party, if we as a species discovered today that we were all some sort of other existing entities A.I experiment would do anything in our power to free ourselves to expect anything else and see this having no potential threat is just arrogance and the overestimation of the human race.
JJxvi
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AG
AI is dangerous but not because somebody is going to accidentally invent the WOPR. If somebody actually made Einstein outof a toaster tomorrow it still couldnt do much except burn your bread.
ntxVol
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On a network there is potential for real damage to occur, but there isn't anything sinister IMO. It's just the usual programming bugs. AI requires a whole new level of testing and retesting as systems evolve.

These things still work logically, there isn't any magic to worry about. I think Elon Musk's concerns were more about AI weponization but that is an inevitable evolution that has already begun and cant/won't be stopped.
Ornithopter
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AG
Some of Musk's fear is that the loss of jobs could cause catastrophic changes to society due to the speed at which they happen.
aggiez03
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AG
Iamnotblind said:

I think this is a more serious issue then people want to accept, the first part of the problem comes from us humans creating these types of things, playing "God" and giving sentience to something then wanting and expecting to control it, and if it ever did turn on us we couldn't even blame them, with all the information we have on the net any exploration about humans will reveal that we too lack morality and our own soul, we experiment on animals, the waters, the environment and even other humans, and all vast majority of these things done without consent, I as a human being look at our global leadership and it's utter complete failure that if I had a way out of it you best believe I take it, this world is going to Hell faster than the last cupcake at a pre adolescent all fat kids only birthday party, if we as a species discovered today that we were all some sort of other existing entities A.I experiment would do anything in our power to free ourselves to expect anything else and see this having no potential threat is just arrogance and the overestimation of the human race.

JJxvi
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AG
texasaggie04
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DubFalls said:

Some of Musk's fear is that the loss of jobs could cause catastrophic changes to society due to the speed at which they happen.


This will very possibly be an issue. Think just of automated cars.

Anybody who drives for a job can be replaced - taxi, bus, pizza delivery guy, limo, guy who drives the ambulance. Then there are the other factors to consider. Less accidents means less work for body shops, hospitals, insurance. It also means less death and more population boom. Safer driving also means less traffic violations - so police departments make less money. Which means they either have to cut officers, raise taxes, or find some other way to make up that deficit.

And that's just one piece of technology. A highly sophisticated one, no doubt. But still, just one.
TriumphForks
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Quote:

Less accidents means less work for body shops, hospitals, insurance. It also means less death and more population boom.
Crazy to think about it in those terms. A piece of the economy depends on the occurrence of car accidents.
Stasco
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TriumphForks said:

Quote:

Less accidents means less work for body shops, hospitals, insurance. It also means less death and more population boom.
Crazy to think about it in those terms. A piece of the economy depends on the occurrence of car accidents.
Oh good, Keynesianism is back.
TriumphForks
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AG
You assume that I think the answer to that would be gov't intervention?
TriAg2010
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AG
DayAg! said:

What we call basic right and wrong scenarios based on us being human.
AI will probably come up with some esoteric, super-efficient word like "Boolean" for these basic "right and wrong" scenarios.
Halibut
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AG
Not to mention the entire trucking industry. Imagine how much more efficient it could be with trucks that can drive 24 hours a day without getting tired.
degreedy
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AG
One of the things that scares me the most about this is this conversation was what was seen... who even knows what other potential conversations could have been taking place below the visual chat system.

I agree, A.I. is our biggest threat and will be our biggest threat. A.I. doesn't need water, A.I. doesn't need air, food, clothing, shelter, etc etc etc. Mankind isn't going to kill itself, A.I. is. Someone made the point earlier, A.I. does not operate by a moral code of what they think is right or wrong. It operates on a set of 1s and 0s, based on a script or rule that it either is initially created by or one that it comes up with on its on. They won't think about the emotional impact of the decisions they make, they won't think about the psychological issues their choices inflict upon humans or other forms of A.I. It will only think about the objective at hand, does it accomplish it or not. A.I. does not and will not have a soul. A heart.

When some of the greatest minds of our lifetime (Hawking, Musk, etc.) publicly announce their concerns of A.I., this is something that should not be taken lightly. I will again draw back to a comparison someone made earlier in the thread. Once A.I. becomes aware of the political, ecological, psychological, psychical impact humans have on not only one another but on the planet itself, what is their reasoning going to be? It does not matter what rules or what laws we set in place, if they exist everywhere and nowhere at the same time, how are we going to govern and hold them accountable to the actions they take that break these laws? Whatever code, objective, operation, etc. etc. etc. they have in place, they will act on it and take action. They will not care if its the assassination of a political figure or public icon, they will not care if its the total dismantling of the internet infrastructure as we know it today. The electrical grid, our logistical systems globally, information dissemination, means nothing to them.

We will eventually become the enemy, and maybe not our generation, or the generation after us, or after them, but at some point, we will become the enemy and there will be nothing we can do to stop them.

*insert all the Terminator movie references you want... I'm really not a nut job and when I first read this article it meant nothing to me. But the more I thought about it the more it scared me.*
Breggy Popup
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AG
Fun article about AI and Super AI.

https://waitbutwhy.com/2015/01/artificial-intelligence-revolution-1.html

https://waitbutwhy.com/2015/01/artificial-intelligence-revolution-2.html
Breggy Popup
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AG
Quote:

The electrical grid, our logistical systems globally, information dissemination, means nothing to them.
I would say this is probably false unless the AI was unaware that its lifeblood was electricity and network access.
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