*** Legion (FX X-Men Series) ***

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hunter2012
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In reply to redline248 • 3:49p, 2/23/17
AG
redline248 said:
Quad Dog said:
redline248 said:
I love this show so much. Giant angry boy gives me the heebie jeebies more than the yellow devil.

So, running tab of powers:
Telepathic
Telekinesis
Teleportation
Some sort of extra planar walking...wtf
Reality warping. He altered the rooms in Clockworks to not have doors. Or more accurately Syd did while in his body.
Yep. At first I wanted to just group that in with his telekinetic power. Have other telekinetic mutants reshaped matter before?


That's just it he didn't change their state of matter from doors to wall, he change reality of the doors existing in the first place. I'm not aware of any mutant doing the first and I'm positive I haven't seen one do the 2nd... until Legion...
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MooreTrucker
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In reply to hunter2012 • 3:52p, 2/23/17
AG
hunter2012 said:
redline248 said:
Quad Dog said:
redline248 said:
I love this show so much. Giant angry boy gives me the heebie jeebies more than the yellow devil.

So, running tab of powers:
Telepathic
Telekinesis
Teleportation
Some sort of extra planar walking...wtf
Reality warping. He altered the rooms in Clockworks to not have doors. Or more accurately Syd did while in his body.
Yep. At first I wanted to just group that in with his telekinetic power. Have other telekinetic mutants reshaped matter before?


That's just it he didn't change their state of matter from doors to wall, he change reality of the doors existing in the first place. I'm not aware of any mutant doing the first and I'm positive I haven't seen one do the 2nd... until Legion...
He had to have changed the state of matter. How else would whats-her-name get caught in the wall?
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AliasMan02
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10:04p, 2/25/17
AG
I'm not normally one for the high-concept stuff, as I think it's often a substitute for good narrative, but this is just incredible. I don't think I've ever seen anything that looks at all like this show. I'm fixated by it.
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redline248
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11:27p, 3/1/17
AG
That opening scene with the guy in the astral plane was amazing.

Few thoughts: Melanie is going to be pissed that Davis is out and didn't bring that other guy along. Lenny/Benny is the monster. Why can Syd see the creepy big headed boy in the real world?

Also, this inception level of what's real is going to get so confusing.
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Bobcat06
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In reply to The Debt • 11:46p, 3/1/17
AG
The Debt said:
Fat thing = Shadow king?
Looks like Amahl Farouk

David keeps talking to his non-existant dog "King"

David goes to astral plane, where Shadow King was banished

I'm saying yes
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CorpsAg11
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12:07a, 3/2/17
AG
What.The.F.

This show is reminding me of Lost a bit. Instead of answering questions, it just keeps getting weirder and they just keep raising 5 more questions each episode. So you keep watching, hoping they'll wrap up all the questions in a nice little bow at the end. But instead they give you some ambiguous cryptic ending.
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CorpsAg11
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In reply to redline248 • 12:17a, 3/2/17
AG
redline248 said:
Lenny/Benny is the monster.

Agreed. Also occurred to me, now that it's a guy, that it could be his dad, whose face we never saw.
Quote:
Why can Syd see the creepy big headed boy in the real world?

B/c i think they're still dreaming
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TCTTS
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12:18a, 3/2/17
AG
I don't know, this is quickly turning into a bunch of trying-too-hard mumbo-jumbo for me. I get what it's trying to be, and I understand what's going on, but I'm losing interest fast. The quirk-level is just a bit too much. I'll stick with it, but I can only take so many episodes of trouncing around in people's memories.
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Madmarttigan
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4:19a, 3/2/17
AG
Ill echo what TC has said. There really hasn't been anything of substance since the first episode. It has been a bunch of trying to be over the top weird with no development. Every episode is almost exactly the same and the story has gone absolutely nowhere.

Trying to be too weird just to cover up the fact that they are milking screen time without much of a story

Only thing this episode changed was oh... we dont know what memories are real and what aren't. Now we are back at square one....

The intrigue of the first episode is wearing off quickly week by week.
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Weimerica
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6:18a, 3/2/17
The problem the show has is that they have to drag out the "finding himself" storyline because Legion is so ungodly powerful that once he does, he literally should never lose unless he's going up against someone like Phoenix, Apocalypse, Dr. Strange, Comic book Thor, Thanos, etc. He's a high end reality warper, no normal mutant will ever be a threat.

So now they will drag the story out so they don't have to deal with him actually using his powers to their fullest extent. Additionally, since this is a TV show and not a movie, they can't spend much on CGI so his powers will be shown even less than normal and anyone he can actually fight is going to require tons of CGI as well which limits his power use even more.
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MooreTrucker
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In reply to Weimerica • 7:30a, 3/2/17
AG
Weimerica said:
The problem the show has is that they have to drag out the "finding himself" storyline because Legion is so ungodly powerful that once he does, he literally should never lose unless he's going up against someone like Phoenix, Apocalypse, Dr. Strange, Comic book Thor, Thanos, etc. He's a high end reality warper, no normal mutant will ever be a threat.

So now they will drag the story out so they don't have to deal with him actually using his powers to their fullest extent. Additionally, since this is a TV show and not a movie, they can't spend much on CGI so his powers will be shown even less than normal and anyone he can actually fight is going to require tons of CGI as well which limits his power use even more.
But how does that explain all the weirdness and dream/memory vs. not dream/memory and the big fat weird guy?
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scubasteve304
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9:13a, 3/2/17
AG
I'll echo TC and TV in not loving the circles we're going in. It's only 8eps so I'll stick with it and it certainly is enthralling with elements I really like but this show really needs a narrative kick in the pants. I was hoping a sister rescue would be it, but at this pace it'll prob be the climax of the season.

I will say the Feist song montage scene was excellent.

From a personal stand point, it's been a hard show to watch. After two years of Mr. Robot and even half of Sherlock (where *spoiler* there's even a damn dog that isn't real) I'm just getting a little burnt out on mentally ill unreliable narrators.
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Quad Dog
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9:17a, 3/2/17
AG
I see the complaints and it is close to that line for me too. The visuals, concept, and music keep it on the good side of that line for me.

All the questions we've asked about Lenny and I don't we ever asked: Was she once a man? And now she is some combination of L(B)enny, David and The Devil With the Yellow Eyes.

That had to be the most intense revelation that they didn't have a dog. Syd and Ptonomy even saw a dog in his memories.

I watched this last night with Closed Captioning on because my wife was in the other room making a bunch of noise. The descriptions of all the weird sounds are great. [Eerily throbbing] [Throbbing Intensifies]

I thought Sepinwall nailed it in his description:
Quote:
There's a point at which all of this becomes pretentious self-indulgence, and it's the most subjective of points. Some may have thrown up their hands before the first episode was over. Some may have stuck things out before giving up midway through Oliver's monologue here, or the jazz dancing, or just after one dissolve too many. With that final Hannibal season, I lost patience with the weirder flourishes well ahead of some other fans and critics. But with this, the technical execution (like the cutting between Kerry and Cary during the climax) is so flawless and beautiful, and the abstractions so clearly tied to the main character's fragmented state of mind, that all of it leaves me giddy.

But no lie: what on Earth did we just watch?
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MooreTrucker
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In reply to Quad Dog • 9:25a, 3/2/17
AG
Quad Dog said:
I see the complaints and it is close to that line for me too. The visuals, concept, and music keep it on the good side of that line for me.

All the questions we've asked about Lenny and I don't we ever asked: Was she once a man? And now she is some combination of L(B)enny, David and The Devil With the Yellow Eyes.
I don't know if this answers your question, since I haven't seen this latest ep yet, but it's been stated that the character was originally supposed to be a male, but Plaza did such a great job (or they saw her in something and liked her or something) that they put her in the role but didn't change any of the dialogue to adjust to her gender.
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redline248
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10:35a, 3/2/17
AG
Btw, the double body of Cary/Kerry is really weird.
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Bobcat06
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10:53a, 3/2/17
AG
A little bit of background:

In Marvel comics, Amahl Farouk is one of the most powerful telepaths in the world, but he gets in a fight with Professor X, who banishes him to the Astral plane, so that he can't harm normal humans (yes the same Astral plane in the Dr Strange film). However, he can still access telepathic mutants and often possess them. He once possessed Phoenix.

Farouk is a big fat man. In the Astral plane, he has with yellow eyes and is called the Shadow King.


Also, we know that Legion (David) is Professor X's son, even though that hasn't been revealed in the show


A couple big revelations from last night:

David was neither in his memories nor elsewhere on earth. Instead, he was on the Astral plane.

The "Monster" with yellow eyes is not part of David's subconscience but rather an inhabitant of the Astral plane who possesses people "like a parasite". Therefore, since the "Monster" has appeared in David's memories, it means that David has been under assault since before he entered rehab.

Since childhood, David has been interacting with things only he can see. Notedly as a child, he talked with a dog named King (as in Shadow King).

The Monster has warping David's memories and manifesting himself as other people (specifically Lenny)



Takeaway:

At this point, I'm 90% confident that the Monster is the Shadow King, who is taking revenge on Professor X by attempting to possess his omega-level mutant son and has been doing so since childhood, which leads to all the confusion about erased memories.

Also, this changes the entire dynamic of the show. It began as a battle between Summerland and Sector 3 for possession of David while David was trying to get his head straight. Instead, now it becomes a triangle with the Shadow King trying to possess David and steal him from both Summerland and Sector 3.
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Madmarttigan
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5:33p, 3/2/17
AG
The fact that you are having to use outside knowledge to make up a story at this point shows that this has not been very good so far at giving any type of narrative.
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AggieSouth06
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8:32p, 3/2/17
Comic book guys help me out. Doesn't Legion ultimately travel back in time to try to kill Magneto and accidentally kill Professor X, leading to the Age of Apocalypse?

I didn't stick with the comics long but that storyline stuck with elementary-school-me. So gritty and bloody and hopeless and full of death and horror. Would make a great movie if they hadn't already turned Apocalypse into a goofy Power Ranger.

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Bobcat06
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In reply to Madmarttigan • 9:32a, 3/3/17
AG
tv1113 said:
The fact that you are having to use outside knowledge to make up a story at this point shows that this has not been very good so far at giving any type of narrative.
Knowing the backstory helps, but the show directly told you the major plot points:

  • "The Monster" isn't a memory but rather is a separate entity that exists in the Astral Plane and possesses people "like a parasite"
  • David communicates with unseen/imaginary things since childhood (e.g. his dog)
  • The Monster disguises itself as other people/things (e.g Lenny)

From that you can make some simple observations/assumptions that change the directory of the show:

  • The Monster's appearance in the kitchen scene prior to going to rehab means that this has been going on for a while (probably since childhood)
  • The Monster is competing for control of David just like Summerland and Sector 3

All of that comes directly from the show and could be figured out if you've never even heard of the X-Men. The background knowledge just confirms what the show is telling us.
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Bobcat06
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9:35a, 3/3/17
AG
Here's my question:

Did Lenny ever interact with anyone besides David in the first episode? Was it like a Bruce Willis only directly interacting with Haley Joel Osment in Sixth Sense?

Was Lenny ever an actual person or just a figment of David's head/the Monster's creation?
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ramblin_ag02
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In reply to Bobcat06 • 10:20a, 3/3/17
AG
Quote:
Was Lenny ever an actual person or just a figment of David's head/the Monster's creation?
Does it matter? David can alter reality. The figments of his imagination can manifest physically. Heck, the Astral Parasite could be using David to interact with the real world.
No material on this site is intended to be a substitute for professional medical advice, diagnosis or treatment. See full Medical Disclaimer.
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redline248
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In reply to Bobcat06 • 10:23a, 3/3/17
AG
I remember the Dr. in the hospital gesturing at her to remove headphones. Also, Syd knows that she "killed" Lenny when they body switched...although maybe that was just her seeing Lenny in David's head.
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Shelton98
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11:12p, 3/3/17
AG
This show is weird as hell, but it's also extremely entertaining.
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AliasMan02
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2:02p, 3/4/17
AG
I'm loving this, though it is definitely trippy. I disagree that any comics knowledge is needed, and actually I think it could be hurting people trying to make things fit up.

I actually feel the story tightening up. Am I alone in that? I feel like we've been circling the periphery and are slowing swirling inward toward the crux of the narrative. We're learning more about how David's perceptions interact with reality and seeing that to David it may all be the same thing.

Also, the Angriest Boy in the World is still the creepiest thing I've ever seen on television.
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Trident 88
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2:42p, 3/4/17
AG
This show entertains me more than Westworld and confuses me less than the endless barrage of Westworld theories.
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redline248
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In reply to AliasMan02 • 11:57p, 3/4/17
AG
I'm with you, I thought there was some definite advancement of what is going on with David.

Also agree about that angry boy. Just typing about it right now is making my hair stand on end.
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thaed137
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2:18p, 3/7/17
AG
Yah latest show really helped to ground the show a little more in what is going on. Side note: I was had to do a double take when I heard the lovely voice from flight of the concords appear haha.
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TCTTS
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12:01a, 3/9/17
AG
This show is dumb. And weird. And pretentious. But also kind of brilliant? Mostly dumb, though. 45 minutes in, I was ready to quit tonight's episode and not even bother with the next three, but I have to admit, that ending kind of hooked me.
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Shelton98
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12:16a, 3/9/17
AG
Whiskey. Tango. Foxtrot.
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Sports-Ag
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12:28a, 3/9/17
AG
This show is trippy and entertaining. The house scene was great, everyone on mute, the angriest little boy coming out of nowhere freaked me out but that ending though was insane. Oh and Aubrey Plaza is killing it.
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SeattleAgJr
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12:52a, 3/9/17
I am still willing to bet Prof X shows up in the final moments of episode 8
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CorpsAg11
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2:13p, 3/9/17
AG
So confused. I really think this show is just throwing curveball after curveball with no intention of ever resolving all the unanswered questions, a la Lost.

But I can't stop w/ only 3 episodes left
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Trident 88
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9:53p, 3/9/17
AG
I think this series is award winningly creative as hell.

It makes me laugh and fills me with dread at the same time.

I'd be surprised if we see Professor X wheel himself into a scene anytime soon, but that would be pretty awesome.
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redline248
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In reply to TCTTS • 11:35p, 3/9/17
AG
I understand some things are not for everyone, but what makes it dumb? It's mostly just weird.

You could tell something was up with David bc he was way too cocky at the beginning. So the monster basically has control over him, yet he could still create the white room for Syd. Maybe the monster allowed that bc that's how it could trap her?

And are they all now trapped by the monster, or did David somehow lock them up to protect them? Probably just the monster.

I agree that Plaza is absolute nails. She is very convincing as a creepy villain.
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Sex Panther
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12:25a, 3/10/17
AG
Man this is the weirdest ****ing show in history
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