NYT today - discussion of HOPE vs FEAR

2,423 Views | 14 Replies | Last: 2 yr ago by Get Off My Lawn
94chem
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I read an article in the NYT today (we get it, you want to post the "stopped here" response and get a bunch of blue stars - wrong board) about the advantages of using hope instead of fear to motivate people to get vaccinated. FEAR basically concludes that vaccinated people should still wear masks, because if they don't, then unvaccinated people will think it's okay to unmask too. HOPE basically concludes that if the unvaccinated see the vaxxed people going maskless, they'll get vaccinated too.

No surprise here - hope appears to be working better, as vaccination rates seem to be ticking up as more people demonstrate what normal looks like.

BUT - here's what disturbed me...in all of the discussion, there was this false dichotomy between Hope and Fear. Not once was there a discussion of TRUTH. I know it's just a sign of the times (even all times), but it's still sad to think that most of our leaders - yes, even the ones you like - don't care for truth at all; they only care about getting you to do what they want.

Years ago when I was writing a book, I came across Erich Fromm's foreword to 1984. Fromm, an atheist, challenged the idea that we are all governed by our genetics or our upbringing, essentially saying that "nature vs nurture" is a false dichotomy. Humans are also subject to FREE WILL. As a religious person (Christian) myself, I've always loved that thought from Fromm, because it showed that Free Will - and I would add Truth - are not purely the domain of theologians; Pontius Pilate and the NYT had best respect them as well, because they still matter for all of us.

Truth may be dead as a philosophy, but it exists nonetheless, and we are free to choose it.

94chem,
That, sir, was the greatest post in the history of TexAgs. I salute you. -- Dough
GAC06
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AG
I agree the argument should be truth vs fear.

Quote:

No surprise here - hope appears to be working better, as vaccination rates seem to be ticking up as more people demonstrate what normal looks like.


For those who understand they aren't at risk from the virus, there's no need for anyone to demonstrate what normal looks like. For those who are at risk, the truth is that a vaccine not yet FDA approved is a good idea.
TXTransplant
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The sad thing is, if we would just rely on truth, there would be no need for hope or fear, at least not on this particular topic.

Both of those emotions are based on the unknown.

We have tens of millions of data points on deaths and hundreds of millions of data points on vaccines. Assess your risk based on that. We aren't facing the unknown anymore. Hope and fear are irrelevant.

We know vaccines work. We know this vaccine works. We have numbers/data to support that conclusion.

Even before the vaccine, I was never fearful. I'm intelligent and capable of assessing my risk, and I never felt fear.

At one time, I was hopeful that the combined scientific know-how of our pharmaceutical R&T experts would get us a vaccine (I think I speculated it would be before the end of the year). We know how that played out, so hope isn't even part of the equation for me anymore.
West Point Aggie
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AG
Here in SA I leave home without the gaiter I've grown to dislike; so far all my hangouts, dining establishments and people I associate with have gone maskless

Maybe that's just HOPE on my part, but I prefer it to the fear so many (secretly) enjoy to kowtow to
Let’s Go Brandon!
Capitol Ag
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AG
I go through life today with the idea that Covid truly is over. "Covid" in the sense the pandemic, is over. The virus will be around for a long time. But this should have never been about eradication, ever. I am still shocked when I hear of shutdowns like in Ontario. Maybe their hospitals were truly being over run, but their vaccine rates are much lower than ours. Everyday I go out I see more and more unmasked vs masked. I figure by the end of June and early July, there will be about 1-2 in 10 masked. Why is this good? B/c it shows that more are vaccinated or have had covid and/or are living less in fear and moving on.
Windy City Ag
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AG
There was a bubonic plague outbreak in China as recently as 2014. Covid ain't going anywhere.
Wakesurfer817
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94chem said:



Truth may be dead as a philosophy, but it exists nonetheless, and we are free to choose it.


"You can choose from phantom fears and kindness that can kill.
I will choose a path that's clear. I will choose free will."


Neil Peart RIP
94chem
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Wakesurfer817 said:

94chem said:



Truth may be dead as a philosophy, but it exists nonetheless, and we are free to choose it.


"You can choose from phantom fears and kindness that can kill.
I will choose a path that's clear. I will choose free will."


Neil Peart RIP
If you choose not to decide, you still have made a choice.
94chem,
That, sir, was the greatest post in the history of TexAgs. I salute you. -- Dough
West Point Aggie
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AG
94chem said:

Wakesurfer817 said:

94chem said:



Truth may be dead as a philosophy, but it exists nonetheless, and we are free to choose it.


"You can choose from phantom fears and kindness that can kill.
I will choose a path that's clear. I will choose free will."


Neil Peart RIP
If you choose not to decide, you still have made a choice.

There's a simple and elegant depth to that statement!
Let’s Go Brandon!
cavscout96
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AG
I'm not sure I've read a more lucid and thoughtful post in my entire time on Texags.
01agtx
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Hope and fear are such a strange use of words. I have felt neither in regards to COVID. It just is what it is. If we were talking about cancer I could see using those words, but not COVID.
94chem
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It's just a reductionist way of viewing human beings as animals, with the sole goal of behavior modification.
94chem,
That, sir, was the greatest post in the history of TexAgs. I salute you. -- Dough
GIF Reactor
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AG
GAC06 said:

I agree the argument should be truth vs fear.

Quote:

No surprise here - hope appears to be working better, as vaccination rates seem to be ticking up as more people demonstrate what normal looks like.


For those who understand they aren't at risk from the virus, there's no need for anyone to demonstrate what normal looks like. For those who are at risk, the truth is that a vaccine not yet FDA approved is a good idea.


But if the government has just been manipulating the populous this entire time, why would there be any level of trust in what the FDA says about the vaccine?
ec2004
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AG
I'm not a NYT fan, but I for one am glad to see such an influential publication exploring this.

Fear is used by both political parties to keep their die-hards in line with regard to the consequences of the other party taking power. Next on the emotional progression is anger, which then leads to hate.

GAC06
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AG
Electrical_Ag said:

GAC06 said:

I agree the argument should be truth vs fear.

Quote:

No surprise here - hope appears to be working better, as vaccination rates seem to be ticking up as more people demonstrate what normal looks like.


For those who understand they aren't at risk from the virus, there's no need for anyone to demonstrate what normal looks like. For those who are at risk, the truth is that a vaccine not yet FDA approved is a good idea.


But if the government has just been manipulating the populous this entire time, why would there be any level of trust in what the FDA says about the vaccine?


I'm not inclined to trust any government agency at this point. I am glad my parents got vaccinated but my wife and I have no plans to get it. We can look at the statistics and understand our risk. That was my point
Get Off My Lawn
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94chem said:

It's just a reductionist way of viewing human beings as animals, with the sole goal of behavior modification.
That's what's infuriated me about this whole thing. If I catch you lying to me or trying to control messaging in an effort to subversively adjust my behavior; then I forevermore categorize you as a deceiver and a liar.

"Masks don't help" - in order to preserve PPE supplies
"Masks protect you" - in order to reduce droplet transmission
"2 weeks to slow the spread" - team effort to help NYC
"It came from a bat / pangolin!" - don't get angry at China / don't stupidly attack asians
"Masks help even after immunity gained" - help maintain covid omnipresence
"Cases on the rise!" - don't pay attention to the falling deaths and fading risk
"Unvaccinated most at risk!" - you maintain the same risk profile, but we want to trick you into acting as we wish
"You have to get vaccinated to help us get rid of covid!" - two lies in one: that we can purge a virus from society, and that it herd immunity requires vaccinations
"Variants!" or "Reinfection!" - keep the vaccinated engaged on this (since they were the easiest to activate), even if the risk of a non-novel reinfection is MUCH less.
"Hero!" - artificial praise meant to shape perception

Truth doesn't necessitate manipulation.
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