Who do you keep from the current talent pool?

2,682 Views | 67 Replies | Last: 6 yr ago by Texags is garbage
carl spacklers hat
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JJxvi said:

I know everyone likes to boil everything down to sheer simplicity (MLS bad, Europe good for development) or whatever. But we really had a lot of kids go to Europe that should be in their twenties after the 2010 world cup now who never got a sniff of the field at any of those clubs they signed with for a variety of reasons. Lletget for example basically spent 7 years at West Ham for almost no competitive playing time and came back to MLS.
I think it is more of an indictment of US Soccer that those players developed domestically and considered the best of the U.S. struggle to find the pitch in Europe. If a player is talented enough, he will see the pitch, no matter which continent he is from. I said on another thread and will say it again here: the very BEST players in the world all find their way to Europe. Why would any U.S. soccer player eschew Europe in favor of MLS if they aspire to develop into a world class player?
BigJim49 AustinNowDallas
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wangus12 said:

So it goes without saying that the current generation of US players have been a failure and we have to begin to build for 2022 (a ****ing travesty in and of itself. **** Qatar).

Obviously Pulisic is your main pillar. Yedlin and Wood are probably guys you want. Hope that Acosta continues to develop. Pretty much need to refill every position.
Yedlin did nothing - Wood very little !
BigJim49AustinnowDallas
BigJim49 AustinNowDallas
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planoaggie123 said:

JJxvi said:

I know everyone likes to boil everything down to sheer simplicity (MLS bad, Europe good for development) or whatever. But we really had a lot of kids go to Europe that should be in their twenties after the 2010 world cup now who never got a sniff of the field at any of those clubs they signed with for a variety of reasons. Lletget for example basically spent 7 years at West Ham for almost no competitive playing time and came back to MLS.
I think that says something about the state of US Soccer...I am not saying every starter on our World Cup roster should be from a team in the top European leagues but ultimately some of our "best" players struggle to make some of the worst teams in the top leagues...it will always be hard to compete when that is a fact. I don't have any real answers but our players just are not as good as many other countries. It is not a lack of athletes. It is 100% the structure and how we develop. If we did it right, we should be a top 10 team year in and year out.

With that all said, that does not mean we should not be able to easily get out of CONCACAF...we should...the team should be embarrassed....
thanks to Klinsman !
BigJim49AustinnowDallas
duck79
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Shouldn't Josh Sargent be included in the list of people you start to bring up right away?
moneyag7
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duck79 said:

Shouldn't Josh Sargent be included in the list of people you start to bring up right away?
I don't think he's an immediate call up due to his age (still 17, signing a pro contract on his 18th in Feb)

I do think, talent wise, he needs to be involved in the rebuilding over the next 4 years though. Should see him playing in some friendlies in a year or so.

I think Sargent, Akinola, and Carleton belong in this bunch. They'll be 22 when Qatar rolls around so it really just depends on their development with the club they sign their first professional contract with.
Aston94
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jeffk said:

Wondo will still somehow make the roster in 2022.


Don't even think it!
Aston94
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akm91
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moneyag7 said:

duck79 said:

Shouldn't Josh Sargent be included in the list of people you start to bring up right away?
I don't think he's an immediate call up due to his age (still 17, signing a pro contract on his 18th in Feb)

I do think, talent wise, he needs to be involved in the rebuilding over the next 4 years though. Should see him playing in some friendlies in a year or so.

I think Sargent, Akinola, and Carleton belong in this bunch. They'll be 22 when Qatar rolls around so it really just depends on their development with the club they sign their first professional contract with.
don't forget Timothy Weah. I wasn't as impressed by Akinola compared to Weah.
"And liberals, being liberals, will double down on failure." - dedgod
moneyag7
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Oh yep. Forgot about him. Traning overseas with PSG and a father who won the Ballon d'Or in 1995.
Terk
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jeffk said:

Wondo will still somehow make the roster in 2022.
H.E. Pennypacker
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akm91 said:

I guess it's easier to list by positions and players listed are for both starting and depth on the team. Only includes players that have been on USMNT rosters or camp invitees since January camp 2016 and will be 30 or less @ 2022 WC

GK - Bill Hamid, Sean Johnson, Ethan Horvath, Jesse Gonzalez, Zack Steffen
CB - Brooks, Miyazga, Ventura Alvarado, Steve Birnbaum, Walker Zimmerman
FB - Yedlin, Villafana, Greg Garza, Justin Morrow
MF - Nagbe, Pulisic, Arriola, Gooch, Hyndman, Lletget, Acosta
FW - Wood, Rubio Rubin, Morris, Aguedelo

That's not a lot of holdovers from the current pool. We've not done a good job of continually incorporating younger players into the team. Part of that is due to the "lost generation" mentioned on another thread.


This is a good list. Id add William Yarbrough to GK list even though he'll be 32 at Quatar just bc goalkeepers seem to peak in early 30s, different from fieldplayers.

We need to give all young options a serious extended look over next 3 years. There is no reason for even a Bradley or Altidore to play in a USMNT game in the next 3 years. Bleed a new generation. W-Ls shouldnt matter. Find Pulisic his guys. When 2022 qualifying starts again, evaluate whether any of the USMNT vets can still be of service. We need to 1990 this thing and play the kids.
sosolik
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Whatever happened to Julian Green? Is he not in the plans?
moneyag7
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sosolik said:

Whatever happened to Julian Green? Is he not in the plans?
Here is an article talking about him. He is still in the mix of things. Just needs to develop. Doesn't help when you're on the last place team in the 2. Bundesliga
OregonAggie
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akm91 said:

In that case, for my team both Jozy and Nagbe are off since they'll be over 30 by then.


I'm fine with both of them being done. Nagbe is terrible in my opinion.
moneyag7
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OregonAggie said:

akm91 said:

In that case, for my team both Jozy and Nagbe are off since they'll be over 30 by then.


I'm fine with both of them being done. Nagbe is terrible in my opinion.
I don't think either will be gone. I hope we are able to find a younger replacement for both of them, but they provide a good experienced depth if one is needed.
OregonAggie
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I'll agree with Jozy as far as depth but we have to have a better option than Nagbe. He shows flashes but it just isn't enough to me. He's supposed to be a creative player that can attack and he just isn't that at all.
PatAg
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OregonAggie said:

akm91 said:

In that case, for my team both Jozy and Nagbe are off since they'll be over 30 by then.


I'm fine with both of them being done. Nagbe is terrible in my opinion.
he's never really consistently gotten it done. Shows flashes, and is the best on ball player, but just doesn't get it done in international play
tysker
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PatAg said:

OregonAggie said:

akm91 said:

In that case, for my team both Jozy and Nagbe are off since they'll be over 30 by then.


I'm fine with both of them being done. Nagbe is terrible in my opinion.
he's never really consistently gotten it done. Shows flashes, and is the best on ball player, but just doesn't get it done in international play
Nagbe isnt a threat to shoot let alone score. International level defenders know they can sag off of Nagbe and instead of stepping to him defenders can play zone in front of him or mark their man. Reminiscent of Dash Harris as PG for the basketball team - defended well, passed well, dribbled well but keep him in front of you and he's not a threat to score from any kind of distance.
akm91
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I think some of the older players (Bradley, Altidore, Nagbe and others) need to be phased out gradually the next two years.
"And liberals, being liberals, will double down on failure." - dedgod
ChipFTAC01
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Based on this, how many more caps does Dempsey get? Does he finish his USMNT career tied with Donovan in goals?
An Ag in CO
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The US won't be playing a competitive, non-friendly match until 2019 so this is the best opportunity to rebuild without needing to keep too many veterans around. Get a core group of under 25 players and have them spend the next two years training and playing together under a coach who can develop a style of play that suits some of the great young talent coming up.
moneyag7
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ChipFTAC01 said:

Based on this, how many more caps does Dempsey get? Does he finish his USMNT career tied with Donovan in goals?
Unless Dempsey retires from USMNT, I will be irate if he's not in friendlies to let him break the record.
PatAg
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tysker said:

PatAg said:

OregonAggie said:

akm91 said:

In that case, for my team both Jozy and Nagbe are off since they'll be over 30 by then.


I'm fine with both of them being done. Nagbe is terrible in my opinion.
he's never really consistently gotten it done. Shows flashes, and is the best on ball player, but just doesn't get it done in international play
Nagbe isnt a threat to shoot let alone score. International level defenders know they can sag off of Nagbe and instead of stepping to him defenders can play zone in front of him or mark their man. Reminiscent of Dash Harris as PG for the basketball team - defended well, passed well, dribbled well but keep him in front of you and he's not a threat to score from any kind of distance.


That's been true,which is strange because that's part of how he attracted a lot of.attention coming up in the MLS. Some players either just aren't wired that way or they lose that drive as they progress in their careers I guess
mrmill3218
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I'll be happy if I never have to watch Michael Bradley and Jozy Altidore again.

I may cry in fact. Just so tired of these guys.
fig96
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BigJim49 AustinNowDallas said:

wangus12 said:

So it goes without saying that the current generation of US players have been a failure and we have to begin to build for 2022 (a ****ing travesty in and of itself. **** Qatar).

Obviously Pulisic is your main pillar. Yedlin and Wood are probably guys you want. Hope that Acosta continues to develop. Pretty much need to refill every position.
Yedlin did nothing - Wood very little !
They're still two of your best young players in the pool, no one had a good game vs T&T. And Wood was one of our top scorers throughout qualifying.
akm91
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fig96 said:

BigJim49 AustinNowDallas said:

wangus12 said:

So it goes without saying that the current generation of US players have been a failure and we have to begin to build for 2022 (a ****ing travesty in and of itself. **** Qatar).

Obviously Pulisic is your main pillar. Yedlin and Wood are probably guys you want. Hope that Acosta continues to develop. Pretty much need to refill every position.
Yedlin did nothing - Wood very little !
They're still two of your best young players in the pool, no one had a good game vs T&T. And Wood was one of our top scorers throughout qualifying.
Agreed. I'm more than happy with Wood as part of the attackers in the pool going forward.
"And liberals, being liberals, will double down on failure." - dedgod
Pahdz
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moneyag7 said:

ChipFTAC01 said:

Based on this, how many more caps does Dempsey get? Does he finish his USMNT career tied with Donovan in goals?
Unless Dempsey retires from USMNT, I will be irate if he's not in friendlies to let him break the record.


Honestly, I'd rather him not break it. I personally think Donovan meant more to US soccer anyway.
H.E. Pennypacker
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akm91 said:

I think some of the older players (Bradley, Altidore, Nagbe and others) need to be phased out gradually the next two years.


I agree generally. But someone like Jozy may still be in a useful place when 2020 gets here.
akm91
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H.E. Pennypacker said:

akm91 said:

I think some of the older players (Bradley, Altidore, Nagbe and others) need to be phased out gradually the next two years.


I agree generally. But someone like Jozy may still be in a useful place when 2020 gets here.
Did you mean 2022? He'll be almost 33 by then. If talking purely about 2020 then I'd have to disagree. We won't have a meaningful match until 2019 and we'll need to get the younger players experience in meaningful matches in the USA jersey to see who we can depend on.
"And liberals, being liberals, will double down on failure." - dedgod
moneyag7
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I grew up about 25 minutes from where Dempsey was born and raised. Dempsey will forever be my all time favorite.
H.E. Pennypacker
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I think we are on different wavelengths. Im saying bleed the youngsters for the next 3 years, and when 2020 (WC Qualifying) gets here, see if a Jozy or a Bradley might still be useful. They may or may not be (and my personal preference would be to not have a 33 year old Bradley cruising around midfield). At that point, if they are, they can try and claim a 2022 spot through qualifying games and staying healthy/fit. The reason i dont write someone like Jozy off fullstop is bc Dempsey was still our 2nd/3rd best scoring option this year.
akm91
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Here's an interesting link of 2022 WC roster projections.

I had totally forgotten about Kenny Saief and he'll only be 28 in 2022.

2022 WC Roster
"And liberals, being liberals, will double down on failure." - dedgod
akm91
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Gotcha. Although Dempsey has much more technical ability than Altidore hence I think Dempsey has been able to contribute even in his early 30's. Although that may also be an indictment on the stagnation of the striker pool.

I would hope that we don't have to rely on Jozy even in 2020 at the beginning of WCQ.
"And liberals, being liberals, will double down on failure." - dedgod
Texags is garbage
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I have nothing technical to add, but man we need some passion and guys who look like they give a **** on the pitch. The USMNT of the past two years is not the one I fell in love with 5 or so years ago. It's a disgrace how complacent some of our squads looked in some of these qualifying matches.

I wish our most talented young guys would look to playing overseas as opposed to the MLS if they find the right situation. I've heard it explained here how difficult it is for a US player to find a good situation though.
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