Talk to me about Korea

2,375 Views | 15 Replies | Last: 3 yr ago by Aggie12B
I Like Mike
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AG
Why did Rhee not unify the peninsula when Pyongyang was captured in the UN counterattack after the Inchon landing? What could we have done differently in regards to solving the problem of Korea?
BQ_90
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AG
I think the 5 or 6 Chinese divisions sent over the border sorta stopped the reunification Korea.
USAFAg
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AG
Just a few:

- Could have made it crystal clear to the communists that the sovereignty of SKorea was of national importance
instead saying that it wasn't really part of our strategic sphere
- Could have believed the Chinese when they said don't approach the Yalu (could have kept 3/4 of nK)
- Could have taken the communist threat in Asia more seriously and not allowed our Armed Forces to degrade to
near ineffectiveness just five years after WWII

12thFan/Websider Since 2003
aalan94
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AG
BQ90 has it right. The war was not "over" and Rhee was basically propped up by American power in a destroyed capital city where starvation avoidance was the only real priority.The U.S. was not prepared to announce a takeover specifically to avoid Chinese and possibly Soviet intervention, and would have discouraged him from doing so right away, even if he had considered it. Background, I've done 8 multinational exercises in Korea and read extensively on it. It was an arduous and exhausting war, with brutal and savage fighting and nobody was ready to move on to those kind of ideas in the very short time they had to do so.

MGS
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Not give material support to the Russians in WW2 so they wouldn't be able to invade Manchuria and Korea in August 1945?
Old RV Ag
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AG
MGS said:

Not give material support to the Russians in WW2 so they wouldn't be able to invade Manchuria and Korea in August 1945?
We pushed the Soviets to declare war on Japan three months after Germany was defeated. Also, without that material support, many many more American lives would have been lost in the European and Pacific theaters.
AtlAg05
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AG
Old RV Ag said:

MGS said:

Not give material support to the Russians in WW2 so they wouldn't be able to invade Manchuria and Korea in August 1945?
We pushed the Soviets to declare war on Japan three months after Germany was defeated. Also, without that material support, many many more American lives would have been lost in the European and Pacific theaters.


That's one reason, but if there was no eastern front(assuming Soviets can't hold), Operation Overlord probably doesn't happen, Italy could have been reinforced. Not many options left for an invasion.
fasthorse05
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I've wondered if Hitler ever tried to talk the Japanese into attacking Vladivostok? I know the Russians crushed the Japanese before, and didn't want to mess with the Russians, but it certainly would have made it possible for the German's to either get Moscow (and kill Stalin), or for Paulus to take Stalingrad.

I understand the Japanese were stretched to the limit, although not so much in '42, but had they feinted an invasion in order to make Stalin (Zukov) put a couple of divisions on the east coast, perhaps the Russians wouldn't have sowed so many evil seeds.

Just a thought in an alternate universe.
BQ_90
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AG
fasthorse05 said:

I've wondered if Hitler ever tried to talk the Japanese into attacking Vladivostok? I know the Russians crushed the Japanese before, and didn't want to mess with the Russians, but it certainly would have made it possible for the German's to either get Moscow (and kill Stalin), or for Paulus to take Stalingrad.

I understand the Japanese were stretched to the limit, although not so much in '42, but had they feinted an invasion in order to make Stalin (Zukov) put a couple of divisions on the east coast, perhaps the Russians wouldn't have sowed so many evil seeds.

Just a thought in an alternate universe.
that's good what if. But I thought I had read that Stalin had some pretty good spies in Japan and they thought it was pretty safe to move divisions west to defend Stalingrad.
Old RV Ag
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AG
BQ_90 said:

fasthorse05 said:

I've wondered if Hitler ever tried to talk the Japanese into attacking Vladivostok? I know the Russians crushed the Japanese before, and didn't want to mess with the Russians, but it certainly would have made it possible for the German's to either get Moscow (and kill Stalin), or for Paulus to take Stalingrad.

I understand the Japanese were stretched to the limit, although not so much in '42, but had they feinted an invasion in order to make Stalin (Zukov) put a couple of divisions on the east coast, perhaps the Russians wouldn't have sowed so many evil seeds.

Just a thought in an alternate universe.
that's good what if. But I thought I had read that Stalin had some pretty good spies in Japan and they thought it was pretty safe to move divisions west to defend Stalingrad.
Stalin had lots of his army in the east to defend against Japan. Right before Pearl Harbor, Japan negotiated a peace treaty with the USSR. Japan then attacked Pearl Harbor and the Philippines. Stalin then moved most of the remaining troops west - this sunk the Germans. They were the USSR's best troops and they were winter troops from Siberia. Once Japan took on the US they weren't going to add Russia. And, yes, Stalin had an incredible network of spies so he was confident of that.
C1NRB
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AG
Other than M*A*S*H, all I know about Korea I learned from Back to School:

[url=https://www.imdb.com/name/nm0455630/?ref_=tt_trv_qu][/url]Professor Terguson (Sam Kinison): You remember that thing we had about 30 years ago called the Korean conflict? And how we failed to achieve victory? How come we didn't cross the 38th parallel and push those rice-eaters back to the Great Wall of China?

Thornton Melon (Rodney Dangerfield): [incensed] All right. I'll say it. 'Cause Truman was too much of a ****** wimp* to let MacArthur go in there and blow out those Commie *******s!

Professor Terguson: Good answer. Good answer. I like the way you think. I'm gonna be watching you.
BQ_90
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AG
C1NRB said:

Other than M*A*S*H, all I know about Korea I learned from Back to School:

[url=https://www.imdb.com/name/nm0455630/?ref_=tt_trv_qu][/url]Professor Terguson (Sam Kinison): You remember that thing we had about 30 years ago called the Korean conflict? And how we failed to achieve victory? How come we didn't cross the 38th parallel and push those rice-eaters back to the Great Wall of China?

Thornton Melon (Rodney Dangerfield): [incensed] All right. I'll say it. 'Cause Truman was too much of a ****** wimp* to let MacArthur go in there and blow out those Commie *******s!

Professor Terguson: Good answer. Good answer. I like the way you think. I'm gonna be watching you.
we did push them back across the 38th parallel, we got close to China and they sent over 4-5 divisions and pushed us back across the 38th parallel until the lines stabilized and turned into stalemate which still exist today technically.
UTExan
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TR Fehrenbach wrote a really good book about the conflict from an infantry officer's perspective called This Kind of War. He is a Texan historian whose specialties are the state, the Rangers and Mexican history. The only way to have won that war was to allow McArthur to speed to the Yalu after blowing the bridges across the river. It was ridiculous to allow safe haven for Communist forces in Manchuria. And neither the Soviets nor the Chinese would have been in position to do much about it with our deployed forces based on what I have researched so far.
It is better to light a flamethrower than to curse the darkness- Sir Terence Pratchett
“ III stooges si viveret et nos omnes ad quos etiam probabile est mittent custard pies”
USAFAg
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AG
UTExan said:

TR Fehrenbach wrote a really good book about the conflict from an infantry officer's perspective called This Kind of War. He is a Texan historian whose specialties are the state, the Rangers and Mexican history. The only way to have won that war was to allow McArthur to speed to the Yalu after blowing the bridges across the river. It was ridiculous to allow safe haven for Communist forces in Manchuria. And neither the Soviets nor the Chinese would have been in position to do much about it with our deployed forces based on what I have researched so far.
All things being equal, this is true from a Theater, military perspective and only if we were willingly to stand on the Yalu and keep them out. However, all things weren't equal...

At the time,
- Europe remained an economic and infrastructure shambles
- Nationalist communism was a big threat in most European countries and elsewhere
- We were still war weary from WWII
- We were busy converting from wartime production to peacetime production
- We viewed the Soviets as a major menace in Western Europe and a genuine threat to invade
- Soviets had just signed a pact with Communist China
- US military was not prepared (as later events demonstrated) for a land war in Asia (or anywhere for that
matter), most of it's veterans were now civilians, had sold or disposed of the majority of it's war material, was
poorly trained (again), was poorly funded (again), its best troops were in Europe, it relied too much on the atom bomb as a deterrent (and we were becoming aware of what an appallingly destructive and political weapon it really was)
- We did not want to fight either the Chinese or Soviets (especially not both) in a country that up to that time
wasn't considered part of our strategic sphere
- We were afraid of the Soviets and didn't recognize or respect the Chinese (Communists)

12thFan/Websider Since 2003
BQ_90
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AG
excellent points. No way the population was interested in another global world war.

there is a reason the Korean War is called the forgotten war.
UTExan
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McArthur, whatever his other failings, understood a great deal about geopolitics. The Soviets were also war-weary and the Red Chinese had only won their internal war in 1949. That is why blowing those bridges and isolating/destroying the most radical of Communist regimes was so vital to securing a future for Korea. We were in control of the nuclear arms race because the Russians had only managed their first successful test in 1949. Stalin was also averse to taking risks after the Finns bloodied the Red Army. Note that no Soviet tanks ever rolled through Helsinki and after Poland defeated the Red Army in the aftermath of WW1, he was not keen to try again until the Germans attacked from the west.
It is better to light a flamethrower than to curse the darkness- Sir Terence Pratchett
“ III stooges si viveret et nos omnes ad quos etiam probabile est mittent custard pies”
Aggie12B
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AG
My class of 56 Dad told me that Korea was the coldest place on Earth. I remembered that when the Army tried to offer Korea as my first duty station when I enlisted.

During the Korean War, my dad served in the Navy aboard a destroyer, the USS Miller. Because of his highmarks qualifying with his M1 rifle, on several occasions, he was voluntold to do what basically was sniper duty on some of the islands off the west coast off the peninsula, north of Inchon. Though he was never diagnosed with it, I know he suffered from PTSD for over 45 years until he passed away in 1998.

After the first of my 4 deployments to Iraq, I had a greater understanding of my Dad and why he would tell me that he prayed I would never see combat.
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