The Kaga and either the Akagi or the Soryu have been found!

2,779 Views | 14 Replies | Last: 4 yr ago by BrazosBendHorn
eric76
How long do you want to ignore this user?
AG
They found a Japanese aircraft carrier from the Battle of Midway at 18,000 feet.

From [url]https://www.foxnews.com/science/warship-wwii-battle-of-midway-pearl-harbor-second-japanese-carrier[/url]:
Quote:

A review of sonar data captured Sunday showed either the Japanese carrier Akagi or the Soryu resting in nearly 18,000 feet of water in the Pacific Ocean more than 1,300 miles northwest of Pearl Harbor, Hawaii, Vulcan Inc. director of undersea operations Rob Kraft said.

...

The finding came on the heels of last week's discovery, another Japanese aircraft carrier, the Kaga, which U.S. forces also sank during the Battle of Midway in June 1942.

Until now, only one of the seven ships that went down in the air-and-sea battle five Japanese vessels and two American ships had been found.
Cinco Ranch Aggie
How long do you want to ignore this user?
AG
It was the Akagi.

I think it's awesome that we can go find all these famous sunken ships, and I can stare at the images for hours just taking in all the details, looking for objects that I might be able to identify.

Edit - oops, not enough caffeine in me this morning. The news story I'm looking at also uses the phrase "Soryu or Akagi ..." but I only saw Akagi at first glance.

JABQ04
How long do you want to ignore this user?
AG
They found the Kaga last week. Just announced the find of the Akagi yesterday. If you have FB I would suggest following the RV Petrel page. They post lots of videos of their work and teased at the Akagi early yesterday morning with before announcing it officially later on.
thach
How long do you want to ignore this user?
AG
Dangit, the ROV was damaged today after a Kaga dive and they can't repair it on site, so no Akagi footage (per the RV Petrel FB page).

Quote:

Petrel's Midway mission has concluded today. This was an extended project for our team, fraught with challenge and adversity from its inception which has taken its toll. Upon recovery of our ROV from the KAGA dive, the ROV suffered damage that was beyond our ability to repair on site. Regrettably, as a result, there will be no video or photographs of AKAGI from this mission. Most importantly though, our team and assets are safe and will return in 2020 with some exciting new projects!

The Petrel team are honored and proud to have been a part of this extraordinary and successful expedition. We sincerely thank our colleagues, support groups and participating partner agencies, Naval History & Heritage Command, US Navy, Papahanaumokuakea Marine National Monument, Midway Atoll staff and you, the public, for your unwavering support and feedback.

There is so much more work we would like accomplish here in the future and look forward to returning soon.

We are posting and extended version of the KAGA video this evening and will resume with the Battle off Samar wrecks shortly.
Ag_of_08
How long do you want to ignore this user?
AG
Fascinating finds. Most people, now and then, dont understand how pivotal the victory around Midway was, because it was not easily understood.
Cinco Ranch Aggie
How long do you want to ignore this user?
AG
Ag_of_08 said:

Fascinating finds. Most people, now and then, dont understand how pivotal the victory around Midway was, because it was not easily understood.
I've run into people who don't even know that this battle happened. I get not everyone is a WWII nut such as me, but not knowing that the battle happened seems about as bad as not knowing that Washington crossed the Delaware or Texas won its independence by thrashing Santa Anna at San Jac.

Sad to hear about the ROV. Would love to have seen more pictures of Akagi.
Ag_of_08
How long do you want to ignore this user?
AG
It is extremely depressing. I will occasionally put together, or even come talk to, mom's third graders on occasion about some historical topic. She's been teaching long enough she has kids coming up of the first ones she taught, several of the adults have told me they remember me talking about modern US history, but didnt hear it again until college. So much of our jr high and hs curriculum completely glosses over modern history, or even important parts of history in general.

Then you get to college and take a "western civ" class, and get stuck with a marxist professor who spends the whole damned semester on the french revolution, and the birth of modern liberalism.

Tie all that together with the fact that history and discovery channel no longer show history and science....

Sorry, rant over.
expresswrittenconsent
How long do you want to ignore this user?
Ag_of_08 said:

Fascinating finds. Most people, now and then, dont understand how pivotal the victory around Midway was, because it was not easily understood.

I dont really find this to be accurate, esp the part about it not being easily understood. I think you could argue it is the most well known and best understood naval battle among the millions who passed through the american public school system you're discussing in later posts (esp if considering pearl harbor as an act of war and not a battle between two nations at war).
In fact it has a handy baseball type score that most land, air, sea battles in military history dont often provide.
Ag_of_08
How long do you want to ignore this user?
AG
See inhave just the opposite experience with public schools and the general public. Of the 40 or so people I work with( 85-15 male to female, from 21 to 75, all interested in military affairs and history when I speak about it), maybe 10 can tell you more than midway was a battle. Of those ten maybe 3 or 4 know more than the fact it was a naval battle in WWII. that ratio holds very true with younger people to.... there is next to nothing in any course material about midway.

Let me amend "hard to understand" and my reasoning may make more sense. The battle itself is pretty easy... 4-1 Americans, no big deal. What most dont understand, and talking to relatives and even veterans who survived that time they didn't fully grasp even then, was why the victory itself was so devastating. I'm hard pressed to think of another naval battle that so effectively gutted a navies ability to PHYSICALLY make war. Jutland gutted the high seas fleet, but not because they couldn't replenish the navy... they could have sorties again within months, Wilhelm would not allow it. The japanese physically could never recover from the loss of pilots and especially ships.

That's the real legacy of the battle, and precious few people grasp it in a strategic position in my experience
Cinco Ranch Aggie
How long do you want to ignore this user?
AG
Quote:

The japanese physically could never recover from the loss of pilots and especially ships.
My take on this would be reversed. The Japanese Navy remained a formidable foe in the months and years after Midway. Guadalcanal was a mere 3 months or so in the future. They still had a few aircraft carriers, including 2 that participated in the Pearl Harbor attack. It was a severe blow to their ability to project force, yes, but I would argue that the loss of experienced pilots at Midway was a bigger blow.
Ag_of_08
How long do you want to ignore this user?
AG
Cinco Ranch Aggie said:

Quote:

The japanese physically could never recover from the loss of pilots and especially ships.
My take on this would be reversed. The Japanese Navy remained a formidable foe in the months and years after Midway. Guadalcanal was a mere 3 months or so in the future. They still had a few aircraft carriers, including 2 that participated in the Pearl Harbor attack. It was a severe blow to their ability to project force, yes, but I would argue that the loss of experienced pilots at Midway was a bigger blow.


Formidable, and a threat to decimate the american fleet are two different things IMO. Their ability to project force is what could and would have kept us from pursuing the same strategy in Europe, and forced us to come online faster against them. The fact the never recovered their carrier force afterwards and never managed to challenge us on this side of the pacific again pretty well shows that. I'm not saying it was the ultimate doom, but it certainly made the way the war was prosecuted possible.
Cinco Ranch Aggie
How long do you want to ignore this user?
AG
Ag_of_08 said:

Cinco Ranch Aggie said:

Quote:

The japanese physically could never recover from the loss of pilots and especially ships.
My take on this would be reversed. The Japanese Navy remained a formidable foe in the months and years after Midway. Guadalcanal was a mere 3 months or so in the future. They still had a few aircraft carriers, including 2 that participated in the Pearl Harbor attack. It was a severe blow to their ability to project force, yes, but I would argue that the loss of experienced pilots at Midway was a bigger blow.


Formidable, and a threat to decimate the american fleet are two different things IMO. Their ability to project force is what could and would have kept us from pursuing the same strategy in Europe, and forced us to come online faster against them. The fact the never recovered their carrier force afterwards and never managed to challenge us on this side of the pacific again pretty well shows that. I'm not saying it was the ultimate doom, but it certainly made the way the war was prosecuted possible.
The IJN and IJA both operated aircraft, but with the IJN, which was based around its carriers, the ability to project force was precisely due to the aircraft they carried. When you lose the vast majority of experience gained through actions against PH as well as Malaysia, China, India, etc, you lose the ability to effectively engage the American carrier groups or to launch attacks against American targets (well, you can launch them, but with inexperienced pilots, your chances of success go down). The carriers themselves are not the force projection, it's the aircraft they launch. But those airplanes have to be manned by people who know what they are doing, otherwise you end up in a Great Marianas Turkey Shoot.
JABQ04
How long do you want to ignore this user?
AG
Didn't want to start a new thread, but the same crew just discovered (possibly) the USS Johnston one of the tin cans from the Battle off of Samar. (Last Stand of the Tin Can Sailors)


coupland boy
How long do you want to ignore this user?
AG
So have either of the Soryu or Hiryu been found?
JABQ04
How long do you want to ignore this user?
AG
coupland boy said:

So have either of the Soryu or Hiryu been found?


I think those two still have yet to be discovered.
BrazosBendHorn
How long do you want to ignore this user?
JABQ04 said:

Didn't want to start a new thread, but the same crew just discovered (possibly) the USS Johnston one of the tin cans from the Battle off of Samar. (Last Stand of the Tin Can Sailors)



Just read that this is the deepest wreck ever found, at 20,406 feet. Wow ... and hats off to everyone in Taffy 3
Refresh
Page 1 of 1
 
×
subscribe Verify your student status
See Subscription Benefits
Trial only available to users who have never subscribed or participated in a previous trial.