Houston
Sponsored by

HFD Closures

8,252 Views | 74 Replies | Last: 2 yr ago by htxag09
Post removed:
by user
11:58a, 7/25/20
Jack Cheese
User Profile
Private Message
Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to [removed post] • 12:17p, 7/25/20
AG
That was a classic thread. I remember someone making the point, which I had never considered, that because of modern building codes and materials traditional firefighting equipment and techniques are far less critical. That's why firefighters spend their time on drills and responding to car wrecks. The stations, ladder trucks, training, and personnel levels are a vestige of the past kept alive by union contracts.

That's probably an exaggeration.... But it also seems plausible that if you were to design an emergency response system from scratch it may well include fewer stations, firefighters and trucks and training might look a good bit different too.

Closing a station or two might not be all bad.
Reply Quote
12
1 edit
Post removed:
by user
12:32p, 7/25/20
Jack Cheese
User Profile
Private Message
Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to [removed post] • 3:11p, 7/25/20
AG
third coast.. said:
That dude pmed me making threats it was wild

Awesome, awesome, awesome. Maybe we can trigger him to come out of the woodwork again. I remember him saying we were all bad Ags if we disagreed with his union-sponsored agenda.
Reply Quote
5
NickNaylor
User Profile Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
4:25p, 7/25/20
Hard to believe that when costs increase in one area, costs need to be cut in another area.

Really surprised people working for the government two days out of nine didn't understand that.
Reply Quote
11
Betoisafurry
User Profile Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
5:28p, 7/25/20
Cool, 77 is my local station. Seems like an apartment is catching on fire every other month around here
Reply Quote
1
Waltrip88
User Profile
Private Message
Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
5:50p, 7/25/20
AG
I've worked for HFD for 12 years since graduating from A&M. I don't understand how people think unions are bad. Bad employees are fired. The union just makes sure that the state law is followed in those situations. We are one of the lowest paid departments.

The HFD union contract doesn't dictate "stations, ladder trucks, or training." It does have a section on staffing units at safe levels.

Modern synthetic materials burn hotter and faster than natural fibers causing fires to spread rapidly. Most homes in Houston are old and their construction didn't incorporate "modern building codes and materials", a lot of the new construction in Houston have 6 homes on a lot that used to hold one making it easier for fire to spread, and most midrise buildings don't have fire suppression systems making the spacing and staffing fire stations important. The city has ignored many studies stating the fire department is too small and spread thin, but their answer is always to pay for another study until they get the answer they want.

People always love to throw the "you only work 2 days a week" thing at fire fighters, but they don't know all the details. We are required to work extra days and it averages out to around 47.6 hours a week (no OT pay for the hours over 40 unless you pick up another shift). Then there's "well you get to sleep!" Maybe some people do, but in 12 years I may have slept
10 nights. Most stations are too busy to sleep.

The 24 hour shift system saves the city money because emergencies have to be responded to immediately and until they are mitigated. I honestly wouldn't mind going to 8 or 12 hour shifts because I'd see a huge increase in OT as calls last hours and I could spend more nights at home.

Anyone who thinks closing a fire station is a good thing should have the one in their neighborhood closed first.

Also I won't try to fight anyone.
Reply Quote
21
1 edit
Jack Cheese
User Profile
Private Message
Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to Waltrip88 • 8:12p, 7/25/20
AG
Yikes sounds dangerous. But a quick Google search shows fire deaths decreased by 90% (per capita) in the last hundred years.
Reply Quote
10
AGHouston11
User Profile Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
8:42p, 7/25/20
AG
Waltripp 88 thanks for all you do.
Thanks for choosing to stay in a city where you make much less than other major departments in the state. Most people don't even know the HFD runs EMS units from their stations and all Fireman are at least EMTs also. Houston isn't like those departments you see in the movies where everyone just sleeps and eats. It's one of the most active departments in the nation. Closing a station not only affects fire response but also medical response as well.
Most people could not do your job me being one of them. Thanks!
Reply Quote
15
Waltrip88
User Profile
Private Message
Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to Jack Cheese • 9:14p, 7/25/20
AG
Jack Cheese said:
Yikes sounds dangerous. But a quick Google search shows fire deaths decreased by 90% (per capita) in the last hundred years.


Because of professional fire departments and their fire prevention programs.

A quick google search shows deaths related to infections have decreased in the last hundred years. By your argument we should get rid of antibiotics.
Reply Quote
13
nonameag99
User Profile Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to Waltrip88 • 10:51p, 7/25/20
Waltrip88 said:
Jack Cheese said:
Yikes sounds dangerous. But a quick Google search shows fire deaths decreased by 90% (per capita) in the last hundred years.


Because of professional fire departments and their fire prevention programs.

A quick google search shows deaths related to infections have decreased in the last hundred years. By your argument we should get rid of antibiotics.
Meh, we should all just grow up and get rid of covid restrictions and act like it never even happened!

Deal?
The Aggie number specified has already been linked with another TexAgs account.
Reply Quote
1
chickenfingers
User Profile Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to Waltrip88 • 10:57p, 7/25/20
AG
People may attack some questionable statements you have made. When that happens, I suggest thinking critically about your responses before making them. Good luck
Reply Quote
6
Waltrip88
User Profile
Private Message
Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to chickenfingers • 11:36p, 7/25/20
AG
Or you could?

I'm just trying to reply to some of the same stuff I see all the time. Most people have an opinion, but really only know what they heard from a cousin that knows a girl that dated a fireman.

I'm not going to stay on texags and argue with people. Just wanted to give som actual information.
Reply Quote
6
Ag_07
User Profile
Private Message
Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
8:42a, 7/26/20
AG
Everyone knows firemen don't sleep.

They spend their only off time grocery shopping at Bunker Hill HEB.
Reply Quote
13
Betoisafurry
User Profile Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
10:07a, 7/26/20
Y'all new to seeing crossbowags late night posts? They're a thing of beauty.
Reply Quote
2
Rexter
User Profile Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
11:30a, 7/26/20
It amazes me that people take a job knowing the crappy conditions of said job, and then complain to no end about how crappy it is.

I don't agree with the ABC schedule, and think firefighters should go to a 12 hr 4/4 or 3/2/2/3. That's going to take a tax increase to pay for it.

I don't want a paramedic working on me after he's been up 23 hrs and not had any rest. BUT....until something changes, that's better than nothing.
Reply Quote
8
Waltrip88
User Profile
Private Message
Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to Rexter • 11:52a, 7/26/20
AG
When I took the job 12 years ago the pay was alright, but it's been fairly stagnant since I got hired while all other department have gotten raises the FD didn't.

It was alright because the other department gave up some pension benefits. Then mayor turner went to the state and made the police and fire pension comparable, but now the police department has the raises for giving up some pension benefits and the FD has neither.

Sugar Land, Pearland, and Cypress have become become full time or expanding and they are getting a lot of HFD trained firefighters. Guys are getting paid more to do less at those places.

The cost of the city sending me to paramedic school was $225k. Add in the cost of fire school and basic EMT the city is wasting a ton of money to train people to leave the city.

I took this job because I wanted to help people not get rich, but that doesn't mean I want to work two full time jobs and never see my family.

When people call 911 with their fire or medical emergency they want intelligent, physically fit people that are able to recognize, treat, and take them to the most appropriate hospital, but since Turner has become mayor he's lessened the educational/physical requirements and is pretty much letting anyone with a pulse in. It worries me where this department is headed.
Reply Quote
1
Irish 2.0
User Profile
Private Message
Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to Waltrip88 • 12:02p, 7/26/20
Can you not go to a different department/city? It's what everyone else in the US tends to doe when they're not happy with a current employer and want a raise. Moving might not be ideal, but people do it all the time for their careers.
Reply Quote
7
Waltrip88
User Profile
Private Message
Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to Irish 2.0 • 12:19p, 7/26/20
AG
CreakinDeacon said:
Can you not go to a different department/city? It's what everyone else in the US tends to doe when they're not happy with a current employer and want a raise. Moving might not be ideal, but people do it all the time for their careers.


That's what everyone in the civilian world does. It's harder for civil servants. That's why FD and PD have unions.

Firefighting has an age limit. Most large cities don't hire guys over 35. When you move departments you don't take your promotions with you and you'd have to restart your pension. Most people don't want 65 year old men doing this job.
Reply Quote
3
Irish 2.0
User Profile
Private Message
Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to Waltrip88 • 12:22p, 7/26/20
Waltrip88 said:
CreakinDeacon said:
Can you not go to a different department/city? It's what everyone else in the US tends to doe when they're not happy with a current employer and want a raise. Moving might not be ideal, but people do it all the time for their careers.


That's what everyone in the civilian world does. It's harder for civil servants. That's why FD and PD have unions.

Firefighting has an age limit. Most large cities don't hire guys over 35. When you move departments you don't take your promotions with you and you'd have to restart your pension. Most people don't want 65 year old men doing this job.


So you say the unions are good for firefighters but then you say they limit your ability to compete in the market for better pay and benefits...like all other unions. These unions are literally hindering your ability to compete in a free market.

You also just described textbook age discrimination
Reply Quote
14
1 edit
KDubAg
User Profile
Private Message
Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to Irish 2.0 • 12:31p, 7/26/20
AG
CreakinDeacon said:
Can you not go to a different department/city? It's what everyone else in the US tends to doe when they're not happy with a current employer and want a raise. Moving might not be ideal, but people do it all the time for their careers.
Depends on your age. I've been in for 16 years and I'm about to be 41. Most paid FD have an age requirement of 36 or less. I'm also two promotions above from a firefighter rank and starting back as a rookie doesn't sound very appealing. Lol.

Like Waltrip stated, 10-15 years ago, working for HFD was decent. Back then pay wasn't great but retirement was decent. Now retirement was slashed with no improvement in pay. Guys/gals like me with 16 years in are getting shafted, making the same pay as a 1st year firefighter in neighboring city with less calls/day. We are sorta "stuck" But some people are furthering their education to get out of being in the fire department altogether. My plan was 30 years for HFD like many others but re-evaluating it to 20 years now.

We used to get 800-1000+ people to sign up to take the FD test. Not we barely get 200 the dept is lucky. I think that last signup was 160. The smart ones are the cadets getting paid to sit in class and train, receive their EMS and fire certs, and then apply to other departments once they graduate.
Reply Quote
1
KDubAg
User Profile
Private Message
Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to Irish 2.0 • 12:31p, 7/26/20
AG
Dp
Reply Quote
1 edit
KDubAg
User Profile
Private Message
Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to Irish 2.0 • 12:31p, 7/26/20
AG
Triple post
Reply Quote
1 edit
KDubAg
User Profile
Private Message
Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to Irish 2.0 • 12:32p, 7/26/20
AG
Stupid computer repost
Reply Quote
1 edit
Waltrip88
User Profile
Private Message
Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to Irish 2.0 • 12:54p, 7/26/20
AG
CreakinDeacon said:
So you say the unions are good for firefighters but then you say they limit your ability to compete in the market for better pay and benefits...like all other unions. These unions are literally hindering your ability to compete in a free market.

You also just described textbook age discrimination


The cities have rules that limit guys from moving around.

The city is the FD and they set the rules. 95% of the union contract just outlines promotions, how we can uses our sick, vacation, or holiday time, staffing of units, and salary. People act like the fire union is big oil pushing people around. They are just trying to keep firefighters safe and give them a livable wage.

Maximum hiring age for civil service jobs is federal law and not something you can sue over.



Reply Quote
KDubAg
User Profile
Private Message
Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to Rexter • 12:58p, 7/26/20
AG
Rexter said:
It amazes me that people take a job knowing the crappy conditions of said job, and then complain to no end about how crappy it is.

I don't agree with the ABC schedule, and think firefighters should go to a 12 hr 4/4 or 3/2/2/3. That's going to take a tax increase to pay for it.

I don't want a paramedic working on me after he's been up 23 hrs and not had any rest. BUT....until something changes, that's better than nothing.

You may get a paramedic that's probably been up 48-72 hrs with little rest. Also of lately those paramedics may have extended response times to you of 20-30 minutes due to lack of resources and staffing issues.
Reply Quote
KDubAg
User Profile
Private Message
Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to Waltrip88 • 1:01p, 7/26/20
AG
Waltrip88 said:
CreakinDeacon said:
So you say the unions are good for firefighters but then you say they limit your ability to compete in the market for better pay and benefits...like all other unions. These unions are literally hindering your ability to compete in a free market.

You also just described textbook age discrimination


The cities have rules that limit guys from moving around.

The city is the FD and they set the rules. 95% of the union contract just outlines promotions, how we can uses our sick, vacation, or holiday time, staffing of units, and salary. People act like the fire union is big oil pushing people around. They are just trying to keep firefighters safe and give them a livable wage.

Maximum hiring age for civil service jobs is federal law and not something you can sue over.



And keeping the city in check with rules and laws against their employees too.
Reply Quote
Rexter
User Profile Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
2:14p, 7/26/20
Mmmk, then. Quit complaining, go full-time at your second job, make more money, and spend more time with your family. See how easy it is?
Reply Quote
3
W
User Profile Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
2:19p, 7/26/20
AG
has anyone ever met a poor (retired) firefighter?
Reply Quote
11
Waltrip88
User Profile
Private Message
Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to Rexter • 2:32p, 7/26/20
AG
Rexter said:
Mmmk, then. Quit complaining, go full-time at your second job, make more money, and spend more time with your family. See how easy it is?


I'm not complaining. Simply offering actual information instead of the normal hearsay that these threads contain.

Most guys aren't in my situation and should be paid appropriately.
Reply Quote
Silky Johnston
User Profile Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
2:35p, 7/26/20
Not getting paid for working more than 40 hours isn't unique to firefighters. Every salaried employee is in the same boat. I get paid the same whether I work 40 hours or 60 hours.
Reply Quote
17
Jack Cheese
User Profile
Private Message
Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to Waltrip88 • 2:37p, 7/26/20
AG
Waltrip88 said:
Jack Cheese said:
Yikes sounds dangerous. But a quick Google search shows fire deaths decreased by 90% (per capita) in the last hundred years.


Because of professional fire departments and their fire prevention programs.

A quick google search shows deaths related to infections have decreased in the last hundred years. By your argument we should get rid of antibiotics.

Or because of sprinkler systems and fire resistant building materials. By your argument we should still be treating polio with more iron lungs.
Reply Quote
2
Waltrip88
User Profile
Private Message
Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to Jack Cheese • 3:03p, 7/26/20
AG
Jack Cheese said:
Or because of sprinkler systems and fire resistant building materials. By your argument we should still be treating polio with more iron lungs.


How many residential homes have sprinkler systems?

2%

We are a long way away from it going higher than that.

I'm not sure of the exact rules but buildings under 6ish floors in Houston didn't need sprinkler systems when built. The city ordinance has changed but the deadline keeps getting moved back because property owners keep complaining that it's too expensive to retrofit.

The city keeps growing and getting denser, but the fire protection stays the same.
Reply Quote
1
htxag09
User Profile
Private Message
Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
In reply to Waltrip88 • 3:15p, 7/26/20
AG
Do you not agree that as technology advances buildings are more fire resistant and less susceptible to fires, including personal residences?
Reply Quote
2
1 edit
KDubAg
User Profile
Private Message
Ignore User Stop Ignoring
How long do you want to ignore this user?
24 hours One week Permanently Cancel
3:21p, 7/26/20
AG
I know three Ladder trucks are out of service right now for sure. I wouldn't be surprised if there are more units out of service. I hope nobody needs tall ladders or extrication equipment for motor vehicle incidents near Meyerland, Willowbend, Sharpstown, Gulfton, Westbury, or south of Hwy 90 near Orem/S. Post Oak or South Houston near Pasadena. These ladder companies are usually the second or third arriving company doing the primary search looking for victims during a fire. Browning them out is just delaying manpower and tools for rescue. The same manpower that would be used to staff high water vehicles or boats.

But don't worry, you'll get the next closest one available maybe 15-20 minutes away if traffic is good.

Some people don't know, but HFD does EMS too. Yea, fire side of things have decreased a little but EMS has gone up. The fire and ladder trucks are the first ones usually on scene on any EMS call since transport units are coming further away. That crew is doing the initial assessment and stabilizing any injuries before a transport unit arrives.

Population has increased, so call volumes have too but the size of the department has not. It's the citizens that will suffer, not so much as me. If staffing keeps dwindling down, more units will be put out of service.

I'm told we lose 60% of our cadets to other cities after they graduate the academy. Those cities greatly appreciate your generosity.
Reply Quote
Last Page
Page 1 of 3 ▼
 
×
subscribe Verify your student status
See Subscription Benefits
Trial only available to users who have never subscribed or participated in a previous trial.