College Station Firearms Registry?

2,317 Views | 26 Replies | Last: 7 days ago by taxpreparer
CS78
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Has anyone else heard of the ordinance that went in to effect a couple months back? If you sell a gun to a gun store or pawn shop, the shop has to take a copy of your ID and submit it and the gun information to the city. The best part is they are not informing people that this is happening. I sold a gun to a store here in town a couple weeks back. Confirmed with them today that the city collected my information. I would have just kept the gun had they told me what was going on. I had taken it in for gunsmith work and they really wanted it so I let them buy it. I understand the reasoning but do not feel that any benefit will outweigh the violation of citizens rights. This is creating a de facto registry of College Station gun owners. I can see multiple ways this could be abused. I don't know the law but this sure seems like it should be against some state or federal law.

Ive tried to find out more info on the ordinance but not finding anything online. An email has been sent to a few people with the city and Im waiting to hear back. Anybody else know more on this?

cslifer
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Lets slow down a bit...nobody is trying to create a "College Station Firearms Registry". Before anyone gathers pitchforks and torches look at the ordinance. ALL "secondhand" dealers are required to report ALL items that they purchase over a certain dollar amount. In fact, firearms aren't specifically mentioned. If anything this would create a list of FORMER owners. It appears that PD is trying to be more efficient at recovering stolen items from pawnshops.
Sec. 8-324 of the city ordinances has what you are looking for.
AgGunNut
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AG
The above post is correct.

As far as selling a dealer a firearm, they were taking your Information already anyway for the required federal paperwork.
CS78
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Good info. The gun dealer made it sound like it was gun specific. Either way, its looking like the city is violating state law.

This is from the Texas State Code:

"Local Gov. code 229.001 - State preemption
(a) Notwithstanding any other law, including Section 43.002 of this code and Chapter 251, Agriculture Code, a municipality may not adopt regulations relating to:
[ol]
  • the transfer, private ownership, keeping, transportation, licensing, or registration of firearms, air guns, knives, ammunition, or firearm or air gun supplies; or"....
  • [/ol]
    1.618
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    If my guns (or computers or jewelry etc) get stolen, I want the police to have at least a small chance of recovering my items. And not only do I want my items recovered, but I want the thief identified and put behind bars. So yea, get some ID from the people who sell stuff to pawn shops or gun shops and put some cameras in there too to get photos of the person who tries to take my stuff.
    Rexter
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    I would think this skirts the mentioned code due to there is no record-keeping of private ownership, transfer, or such. The private owner no longer owns the item, and it is going into the inventory of a licensed (govt) seller. The licensed (govt) seller will be keeping a record of the purchaser, of which information has not been ordered to be entered into the system for the local PD. The licensed (govt) seller should be able to prove where he received the item should it be stolen. This has nothing to do with private sales.
    Stupe
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    S
    A pawn shop sale isn't a private sale, you either sell it to the business or they are acting as a broker.

    There isn't a legal used firearm dealer in the state that isn't taking that information.
    93Towny
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    Staff
    You will lose your ass selling to a pawn shop or gun store compared to a private transaction.
    CS78
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    I have no concern at all with the business collecting the information to cover their rears. I willingly handed my ID over to the buyer so they could create their own log. I have a problem with the government creating a registry of people that owned/own firearms. There is a huge potential for abuse of that information. I understand the need to try to catch thieves. Why not have the business report the serial numbers to the city? IF there is a hit on a stolen firearm, then collect the sellers info from the business and proceed. Would be much cleaner that way.
    techno-ag
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    AG
    Sell your guns in Bryan, OP. Problem solved.
    Stupe
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    S
    I think he's looking to sell them legally....
    taxpreparer
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    AG
    When I buy guns from private individuals I insist on bill of sale that includes their DL info. When I sell I insist i seeing their LTC. I would not expect less from a gun dealer or pawn shop. However, I would not share that information with anyone else. It for my protection.
    ***It's your money, not theIRS! (At least for a little while longer.)
    1.618
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    As strange as it might seem, CS78, not everyone is going to realize that a gun has been stolen immediately. I know several people who had guns stolen from their home over Christmas vacation. There was not even a police report filed until more than a week or two after the theft. Plenty of time for someone to pawn the guns.
    Stupe
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    S
    taxpreparer said:

    When I buy guns from private individuals I insist on bill of sale that includes their DL info. When I sell I insist i seeing their LTC. I would not expect less from a gun dealer or pawn shop. However, I would not share that information with anyone else. It for my protection.
    Why?

    That is not a requirement to by a firearm in Texas.
    Max06
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    AG
    It's a easy way to ensure their ability/ qualification to own a firearm.
    Stupe
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    S
    I can understand that between individuals. I don't get why he said the he expects it from a gun dealer or pawn shop.
    taxpreparer
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    AG
    No, not a requirement, but I do it for CYA, and would not be surprised if a business did also.
    ***It's your money, not theIRS! (At least for a little while longer.)
    Stupe
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    S
    I would be surprised.

    I've bought or been with someone that was buying from Burdett and Son's, Academy, Cabela's, Bass Pro, Champion, Carter Country, Gander Mountain, etc.... and don't ever remember being asked that question or heard it being asked at a business. It's not required to purchase and you aren't required to answer that question if asked, so why would they bother?
    It's the background check that matters to dealers.

    I fully understand someone doing that for private sale, but "expecting nothing less" from a business doesn't make sense to me.
    Stupe
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    S
    Max06 said:

    It's a easy way to ensure their ability/ qualification to own a firearm.
    Ability / qualification to use one or own one?
    taxpreparer
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    AG
    I do not know what you are arguing about. Buying from a gun dealer involves a background check. I am talking about selling to one.

    The shooter in Odessa failed a background check then bought his weapon from a private i dividual. I am simply saying that when I buy or sell a weapon, privately, I require ID and document the sale. I would expect a gun dealer to require ID when buying from an individual.

    Maybe you only deal with people you know and it is not an issue. If we do not want even more unconstitutional gov't restrictions on our 2nd Amenment rights then we need to do a better job of protecting them. The best way to keep a gun out of the hands of a bad man is to be more careful not to be the one who arms him.
    ***It's your money, not theIRS! (At least for a little while longer.)
    AgGunNut
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    AG
    When a dealer buys a gun, they are required by federal law to document who they buy it from. The owner information goes in their bound book they are required by ATF to keep.

    Where the ordinance goes further is it requires the dealer to put the used gun info into LeadsOnline which can alert LE of serial numbers for firearms entered into NCIC as stolen. Currently, when a dealer buys something, there is no required or easy way for them to check if the gun is stolen. This help curb that. I see nothing wrong with it, especially when it's evenly applied to items other than firearms (with how the ordinance is worded).
    Stupe
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    S
    Quote:

    I am simply saying that when I buy or sell a weapon, privately, I require ID and document the sale. I would expect a gun dealer to require ID when buying from an individual.
    Ok. The part that I put in bold was what I wasn't understanding from your earlier post.

    In the post that I quoted earlier, you said that you required LTC proof for an individual sale and the next sentence read...to me...that you expected businesses to do the same thing: require LTC proof instead of just a valid ID.

    We are on the same page about that.



    taxpreparer
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    AG
    Sorry, I understand that was confusing.
    ***It's your money, not theIRS! (At least for a little while longer.)
    taxpreparer
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    AG
    I do not know all the regulations that apply to gun stores, and did not realize the gov't requires what I would have done willingly if I was the store owner. As far as the LeadsOnline, I would prefer it was available for the gun store to check and see if the firearm was reported as stolen, instead of requiring the gin store to list the purchase. Do I have that right? the guns store would be required to list the purchase so law enforcement can see if they have purchased a stolen weapon? (Gun store includes pawn shops.)
    ***It's your money, not theIRS! (At least for a little while longer.)
    Stupe
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    S
    I would be great if there were a national data base that kept track of stolen firearms that is easily accessible for anyone to check a serial number.

    Edit: I'm putting "stolen" in bold and italics in order to emphasize that point.
    CS78
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    taxpreparer said:

    I do not know all the regulations that apply to gun stores, and did not realize the gov't requires what I would have done willingly if I was the store owner. As far as the LeadsOnline, I would prefer it was available for the gun store to check and see if the firearm was reported as stolen, instead of requiring the gin store to list the purchase. Do I have that right? the guns store would be required to list the purchase so law enforcement can see if they have purchased a stolen weapon? (Gun store includes pawn shops.)
    I think that's right. It would be nice if there was a system where store owners could check to see if a gun were stolen. As it is now, they are SOL if they buy a stolen item. LEO shows up and takes it and they get nothing.

    If that's not an option then why not just have them report the serial number of the guns they take in. If it hits as stolen all local LEO has to do is show up and review the records on hand for the individuals info. Sure seems much better than everyone's personal information being stored in some online database that can easily be hacked or leaked. There have already been cases of registered gun owners in northeast states having their data leaked and becoming targets of the local "progressives".
    taxpreparer
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    AG
    CS78, I agree.
    ***It's your money, not theIRS! (At least for a little while longer.)
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